I ma currently studing northern shaolin and I have 2 years of experience in ITF taekwon-do..and when i transfered to shaolin, i was very disapointed to see that we hardly practiced kicking..
And when we do…its low kicks, never higher then your waiste..is this how the system is or just something stupid the teacher made up cause he’s too lazy to kick high
Low Kicks
No - this is not something your instructor made up. Though there are higher kicks in many Kung Fu styles - you will find (prticularly in comparison to TKD) that the Northern Shaolin kicks are lower (knee to hip/abdomen). This is also true of many of the Kung FU styles (certainly so for Lung Jop Pai (Northern Dragon) and for Hung Ga)
Many Northern Instructors teach that as you go above your own waist you begin to lose power. This is assuming you are standing - there are kicks with you down on all fours, kicking backwards at an opponent in Fu Jow Pai (Tiger) for example where you are obviously kicking above your own waist but you will find that most of your NS kicks hover around the waist or below.
Hope that helps
I’ve been doing Northern Shaolin for about 5 years now, and there are plenty of high kicks. They’re all up in the forms we practice.
Some people show up with a TKD background, and seem to fit right in with the kicking methods. As far as application, the kicks are mid to low level (solar plexus to knee/ankle with the occasional thust kick to the sternum). If you train your kicks at all levels then you increase your flexibility, and power.
Of course the higher level kicks don’t have as much power, but they’re still powerful. If you keep practicing your kicks high, then as they get stronger, so will your mid to low level kicks, which are the kicks you would use anyways. Flexibility helps you to relax when kicking lower, and the more you relax, the more body you can put into your kicks.
But, I really don’t think your Sifu is “too lazy” to kick high, he’s probably just showing the more technical side. Of course, I don’t know the guy, so I can’t make any judgement. I guess you would have to ask him, or stick around and watch the more advanced students, or the forms.
Jaguar Wong
www.superaction.com
It all depends on what school you go to. You will get less power from a head kick, but then the target is more fragile. Many people only teach lower kicks until you are ready and have done the necessary groundwork.
I came from an ITF TKD background, and it took me ages to iron out all the flaws in my kicking technique, so that now I have a great deal more power and stability in my kicks at all levels.
The higher kicks must come, as it is very hard to do low butterfly and tornado kicks.
“Weapons are the embodiments of fear,
the wise use them only when they have no choice”
Lao Tzu
higher kicks
Definitely true guys. JW - you may be right that the higher kicks are taught later when the foot-work and stances are more solid.
I didn’t mean to imply that there weren’t ANY high kicks in NS just that the lower ones are stressed more. In Lung Jop Pai I learned inner and outer crescent kicks - essentially a slap to the face using your foot.
We definitely had them its just that my Sifu tended to stress the lower ones.
I think your missing the point.’
High kicks are not practical for a streetfighting situation and can often lead you to a number of nasty asskickings if you try to perform them outside of your safe training hall.
Your instructor might be teaching you the practical side to your art. By teaching & working you on the low-line kicks he is giving you better tools for a real life encounter.
If you are looking for high-kicks just for fun and conditioning than I am sure there will be some in your up-coming sets, but take the time to learn the low-line kicks as “most” of them are very effective & street practical for self defense as for obvious reasons of balance and mobility.
Regards
Hi-
I do Bak Sil Lum (Tams style, Kuo Yuo Cheong Lineage).
There is an incredible variety of both high and low kicks in North Shaolin of this style.
Double front kicks, inside /outside crescents (used as head shots or to clear arms before using hand strikes), tornado kicks, broom sweeps front and back, heel kicks at all levels, toe kicks at all levels, sole kicks, knife edge kicks… you name it and north Shaolin has the high kick you are looking for in one of its iterations.
I have found that Nam Sil Lum puts way more emphasis on low kicks than North Shaolin does.
peace
Kung Lek
Gray’s Anatomy, I know you weren’t saying NS has no high kicks. For the most part, I was just agreeing with the low/mid application of most kicks. I was just adding more and pointing out that the style does train high kicks for other reasons not just for the KO 
BlackJack, I don’t think we’re “missing the point”. I’m not gonna walk around in the mean streets looking for that sweet spot high roundhouse kick under the ear. It’s not always like Yvel vs Goodridge (Pride 10 man that was something! 
). All the kicks I learned can be used as head hunter shots, but they generally are aimed at areas like the hips, knees, stomach (has anyone ever taken a clean thrust kick to the Tan Tien? 
) and solar plexus. There are even kicks aimed at the ankles. Then there are the sweeps… I personally use my kicks along with the hands (grabbing/pulling a limb while kicking the thigh, or stomach, or punching high and follwing with a low kick/knee) so it’s faster to use low line kicks, cause they’re already down there. BUT, my low kicks have all gotten faster and stronger, because of the strength and flexibility gained from practicing them high as well. There’s more to it than just the surface. Don’t get me wrong, I try hard to use or set up my high kicks, because you never know when you may need it.
Kung Lek, You sound like a kick salesman 
. Yes, Northern Shaolin does have it’s fair share of high kicks, but the higher applications tend to be the more advanced stuff. The basics tend to be low-mid level with a few high kicks (crescents, toe, or heel thrusting kicks). Like I said, I love putting a knife edge side kick under the arm, or to the throat, but the one I’m relying on is aimed at the stomach, or hips (I use round house kicks, and cross kicks for the knees). I’ve landed spinning hook kicks in sparring and tournament settings, but those were set up, and again, I wouldn’t put my life on the line trying to use it. I know it can be done, so I keep practicing it, hoping to make it second nature, but I’ll always use my bread and butter side and round house kicks.
BTW I’m also learning the Kuo Yuo Cheong Lineage (Johnny So, Ken Hui, and my Sifu Steven Baugh ).
Oh yeah, I agree that the Southern styles stress the lower kicks more, but I learned a white crane set (Ark Wong’s lineage) that has one or two low kicks and the rest are high (crescents, tornadoes, toe kicks, side kicks, hook kicks, etc.) What makes it even harder is the stances are so frickin’ low!
Jaguar Wong
www.superaction.com
think about it
take any kick done higher than waist level.
you could hit your target faster using your hands everytime. they are closer to your target than your feet are.
breathe
Kicks for Sale… get em on a stick.
Yeah yer right Jag, I was sounding like Ron Popeil there for a sec. ahahahaha..
“Say Kung…can I get that kick with the accesories and spice rack?”
“why yes you can, and it comes with a cappacino maker and a video about how to set up your satellite dish in 3, yes 3 easy steps!”
peace
Kung Lek
I don’t exactly agree with that no1.
It depends on where you are at in your training.
I know a few dudes who can get high kicks at yer head before the dukes are up. I know guys who prefer kicks to punches.
What you are saying is true about those who are at beginning and intermediate levels. Once the Lower Tan Tien is understood, the body tends to be balanced and highly mobile regardless of the striking appendage you choose to use.
High Kicks don’t have to be slow just because they can take a little more energy to use.
peace
Kung Lek
No. 1
Also - don’t forget that there are situations where the hands are not the best choice or they are unavailable.
In the scenario I explained in my earlier post regarding Fu Jow - the hands are holding you up.
no1, I don’t mean to jump all over your statement as well, cause for the most part, I think it makes sense. BUT just because my jab or snapping backfist is faster, and closer to my target than my right cross, doesn’t mean it’s automatically ruled out … think about it
Other than that, for the most part, I mainly use kicks low, and punches high, and both in the middle. There are exceptions (I got a mean knifehand to the outer thigh in close).
Jaguar Wong
www.superaction.com
Hmmmm..
Hey Jicga, have you ever thought that your instructor does not teach high kicks because he knows how impractical they are? Your views are very typical o someone who has not matured or grown out of tae-kwondo.. i do not know enough about northern shaolin, but i do know enough about tae-kwondo. The percentage of people who can get away with speed and power kicking without losing balance in a fight are very few…even many amateur kickboxers and many many black belts telegraph those kicks a mile away- hence the beating they have taken by people with quick hands and grappling skills..I know far too many fighters and bouncers that are on you so quick the kicks have got to be delivered quick- really quick.
This is not to say that high kicking is inneffective, but you really have to know what you are doing…most taekwondo students do NOT. I wouldspend more time learning the ohter concepts he is teaching, space, distance, timing, zoning,etc…from there you can make the art your own and do whatever the hell you want with it. If you don’t like it..walk away and go back to Tae-kwondo…i am sure they’d be willing to let you hit pads and pay them 300$ for your next red stripe ..
Michael Panzerotti
Taijutsu Nobody from the Great White North..
that’s why I quit TKD, because of the stupid belt system..
This will come off rude…sorry everybody
So you quit tae-kwondo because of teh “stupid” belt system and that is all? well you obviously have not lost their point of view..if you are looking for tae-kwondo without the belts and trying to find it in another system..you will be dissapointed. Furthermore, you will miss out on the true lessons which will lead you to see why tae-kwondo is such a poor combat/street system.
Yes i know, before everyone rants and raves…jimmy woo of such and such a place in incredible…that is because he is a master and has taken hapkido as well or hwrang do…niot just tae-kwondo alone. TKD remains the most unrealistic system there is out there. The hands are forgotten and flashy snap kicks and showmanship becomes reality. Do you know how easy a kick from most people is to catch? You get guys in there for 4-5 years and they are still too slow to kick with power. TKD is a joke, if you get an elbow or a fist on an incoming leg, i guarantee you they will think twice about trying it again.
You are far better off where you are..you will actually learn to fight. TKD cannot be dragged through the mud enough in both Canada and the United States..it is pure and utter crap. Why anyone would buy into the hype and competitions is beyond me. Even watching the Olympic matches…i could see them getting thir heads knowcked off trying some of those kicks…the part you don’t see is where the fight goes to the ground and the TKD guy gets fed elbows…thank god for the wistles and the poomsie
Michael Panzerotti
Taijutsu Nobody from the Great White North..
Kicking in Northern Shaolin
Generally you can kick as high as you want because not everyone is built the same. Beginners attempt to kick high but can’t because of their tight leg muscles. In demonstration and for stretching purposes, intermidiate and advance students will kick high but for fighting the high kicks are not recommonded unless their skill level and their abilities are at a very high level.
You should do your kicks according to the way the set dictates because the sets that you will learn later on will contain higher kicks.
TKD is not crap
Listen, you were obviously beatin up but a TKD artist (roaring elbow), and that’s why you keep bashing it in. The system is used to develop your kicking skills and your speed. That’s all, if you want to bash anything, bash in Karate…
Taekwon-do does have a lot of flaws but its not meant for punches, or knees, or elbows or whatever the hell you use to fight.
Secondly, no one uses their martial art techniques to actually fight in real life.
A) You won’t punch someone and go into your bow stance..
B) You won’t hope for a left hook so you can do your best technique..
there are more reasons,
TKD is just there to build your kicking skills…nothing else…increase power, speed and quickness…
Kicking at the high line is as usefull as any other fighting skill, given the context.
(Blackjack, I would think that you would be more “JKD” minded)
Many real fights have been ended by good kick to the face or head.
TKD (northern kung fu, Savate, Muay Thai) does an excellent job in teaching the merits of this combat skill.
If you were a kicker, and you lost a fight, that’s
on you. You can’t blame kicking.
When a wrestler losses to a boxer is that wrestling’s fault. Of course not.
Know what to do and when to do it. That is your
main concern as a martial artist.
Bashing a style just shows the huge gaps in your
fighting arsenal.
Valrave
I always thought high kicks were useless until…
I’m not arguing for one or the other, first of all. Personally, I have no use for high kicks because I’m short and broad, and not built for effectively delivering them (thanks to the short legs, though, I can deliver some mean abdomenal kicks even at very close range). Anyway, I was watching a UFC fight where this guy was getting beat six ways from sunday by a dude about 50 pounds heavier than he was. Somehow, he managed to remain standing and the fight went into overtime. He managed to get a good forearm shot to the big guy’s face, and suddenly the dude wasn’t hitting with the same accuracy. Next (I watched this several times in slow motion it was so good) the smaller guy throws a feint, which was obviously so by the fact he fanned his fingers out at the end (it was just to get the guy’s attention and it worked). While he threw the feint he chambered his right leg, and when the guy went for the block he hammered the side of his head with a beautiful roundhouse. The dude fell against the fence with this total spaced-out look. He didn’t know what hit him, but he sure as hell wasn’t getting up. Anyway, that’s just one situation, but it shows a properly delivered high kick can have a place in some situations. Like I said though, I personally don’t like 'em. Fortunately, there aren’t any high kicks in Bagua.
Just my two cents…