The Topics and most of the Posts in the last months are about to bother most sincere Readers and writers I think.
Most of the interesting Threads in the past are long gone and now I see only talking about Gossip. Thats sad. I really don´t understand, why people answer such stupid Posts like the new one from Wang about the gathering. It´s clear, thats it only about miscrediting.
I hope that some posts of more substance and knowledge will come in the future, but I also understand that many of the former writers are no longer intrested in this forum!
Well, I hear you GBL. I sometimes feel the same and wonder if it was as good as it can get.
Personally, this forum is one of the finest and the best place where a lot of the real people behind the mantis community meet and share ideas. Please note that I say real people not masters. To me it doesn’t matter whether they are masters or not. It does however mean a great deal to me that they are real people. I have in fact emails, meeting and phone conversations with a number of people whom in my view are great and dedicated mantis stylists including yourself. Just look at the Mantis Quarterly phenom. Yes, it’s nothing short of a phenom IMHO! It all began with people who frequent this forum. So it is a phenom that belongs to all those who lend their support. It is a success that can be shared by everyone who is willing to participate. That’s the beauty of the realm of internet. We can build something beautiful together even if we are land and sea apart. I would venture to say the best is yet to come but we need to hang tight for it.
I knew at least 2 great people in my style who used to come onto this forum but they have since passed away. One of them is Eric Ishii whom I am sure a few people in the US mantis community have heard of him. Eric had given me not only a very good collection of CCK TCPM achieve but also the inspiration of learning and sharing from others. So I for one won’t pack it in as long as this forum stays in operation.
My view is this, when a thread that has good content is started a few people (some of which don’t even study mantis) tend to chime in and the threads are taken over. Instead of locking those people out, the thread itself gets locked and I don’t think that’s right. Just like commercials we sift through to get to the real show. I’d rather do that than have a convo shut down because of the temporary interuptions. It is the real world, even though an internet world. Every one has opinions and you have to get them whether good or bad. If it turns into name calling or personal threats then shut it down.
I felt it should at least be said that he was ignorant and incorrect about what he was saying, for those who might not have been at the gathering. I’m not a big fan of misinformation.
I completely agree with you that there isn’t as much substance on this forum as there used to be. A few of the older posters are still here, but only a few. And I think it’s unfortunate that the only thing that seems to occur these days is people trying to stir things up, as opposed to share information.
I agree with you also, Mantis108. This is a fantastic medium for sharing a great deal about Tanglang Quan, and I hope that the focus returns to that in the future. It would be a welcome change indeed. I only wish that I had more to contribute.
The quality of this place went down hill when I started planning my restuarant.
I have sold it and the last day of work is Sunday.
After that time I will post some and share bits of my latest research and questions.
This place has been so good in terms of sharing historical and cultural knowledge. It has also opened the door to me and others to travel around and visit other teachers.
So I conclude that it should not die.
Eric was one of the first people (along with Sifu Cottrell and Sifu Patrick Hodges) I spoke with when I came looking for ‘real’ mantis 5 years ago. He was very encouraging and giving for sure.
But, while this place can be a good place to be sometimes, would it not be somewhat cumbersome to go between here and MQ?
I truly feel that MQ and everything associated with it (forum, newsletter, the conference) is going to be the future of Mantis in the US if not the rest of the world. So, wouldn’t it be better if all the information exchanged was contained in one archive instead of two?
just a thought and I’m certainly not dissing KFM or anything.
Oso it seems like that is the way things are going right now any way… Technical info is being archived over there, while nothing is being said over here. When a discussion does start it is quickly shut down when people start to not agree or the topic strays ever so slightly. So why post anything here at all?
My only complaint about the MQ site is it can be at times too technical for myself and other students who don’t really know all of the terms. Be it because of language differences used (manderin, cantonese etc) or just that they simply don’t know what the terms are. Like the chinese term for punch or kick etc. Instead of saying that there is punch or kick they use the “chinese term” and some people get lost. I know when I use to post I would use general terms so any one reading could understand what was being said. I think this is where some people will turn away from that forum, or at least not participate as much as they want to for fear of sounding “not as informed” as others on that site. I know personally If you show me I’ve seen it or can do it, but I don’t know all the terms because I didn’t ask or it didn’t sink in.. I just wanted to do it, not know what the animal name for the combo was.
On the flip side though, language provides structure to ideas. Sometimes this can be a problem if applying english language to a chinese mantis concept.
For example, sometimes people translate as follows:
kwa sao = upper block
bung chui = backfist
cho chui = uppercut
The problem then arises because the student does the kwa like a karate block, the bung like a point sparring flick motion, and cho chui like a looping vertically rising punch.
None of these are the mantis way to do the motion. But unfortunately, once the student has heard the english term, he automatically assumes he knows what to do. Then you have to spend the next 18 months correcting his kwa and bung etc. Then 3 years later, he still has an element of weirdness to his kwa. If you look around, you see a lot of mantis out there that looks weird because the original ideas and motions have been “translated” to something else that isn’t mantis anymore.
-N- Oh I agree completely, when you have to figure out what someone is talking about then you get kind of screwy though when you don’t explain what you are talking about in detail… Even with simple things like kwa, bung, pi, etc. But then throw in mantis catches the cicada, goose palm exits the rhinos ear drum etc and people’s minds could explode. (read disclaimer) :eek:
I hear you on the technical stuff. My chinese is virtually nil (but working on it).
But, I feel that wading through that and asking for clarification is part of my personal growth in the whole shebang. I know that Mantis108 in particular, as well as K.Brazier, have both been very willing to reply to my PM’s with help on the terminology.
Hopefully, Sifu Cottrell’s book will be a boon to us all. (hint, hint)
I tried asking a queston on “Mantis stuff” on the mantis curriculum thread and no one answers. It doesnt matter if they know the techniques I asked about, I would also like to know if anyone teaches them or not.
How many instructors or students know these?
Maybe people dont want to admit that they dont know them?
Mantid 1 I think with that question you asked it is very general and covers a lot of ground. I think I touched apon the issue but it’s hard to go into detail because different people have different ways of training. What we are talking about with the terms used is part of that issue. Some schools stay more traditional and use the chinese terms, and others don’t. I for one don’t because I never learned them all. Soft this hard that, I can do them and understand them. But don’t ask me to name them.. Everyone teaches different and hold different things as high priority in training.
The topic of this thread is where is this forum going. GBL conserns seemed to think it may have become a place to slander and gossip rather than share mantis info.
I posted a thead asking specific questions about mantis. I dont think it is a general question at all.
Do you know or teach 12 word - yes or no
8 hard - yes or no
12 soft - yes or no
7 long - yes or no
8 short yes or no
Did you learn them from your teacher or did you adopt them from other systems.
After reading MQ most of the people that who seem to know about mantis think that these catagories should be high priority.
My system does the 12 word and requires the student to know what is long, short hard or soft (much like the way you have described you do it).
I have been told this is not good enough to be in a mantis system. You have to have these catagories to be “mantis”.
I realize that different systems have different techniques but most have these catagories that I have listed.
It seems that Lee Kam wings system has these covered very well.
You asked a theory question recently? Western approach sometimes is more academic than eastern. My teacher just said, “do like this”. More kung fu than talk fu. Or in his words, “more practice and less talking makes one a better mantis”.
So does mine. Not everytime. But i’m a person, who wants to know every single detail of a movement. So he answers “Practise more and don’t waste your time on unimportend questions”. Some things gain on doing them a thousend times and you don’t need a detailed description.
But i also think that it’s importend as mantid1 says, that you can name what you do and know what kind of principles are behind you techniques.
Yes I have the items listed… But when you break down these things some people tend to dwell on certain items more than others even within these key examples.
The examples given are in everything you do in mantis that is why some say it is essential. Even if you don’t know the individual (keywords, 12soft, 8hard, etc) in reality you are actually already training these concepts and tactics. Well you should be that is, whether you understand what you are doing or not. It helps if you know that before you train individual tactics so you know how to apply certain things. But honestly I wasn’t given everything first and I had to figure out the comparrisons myself on down the road on a lot of things. Not to say my teacher didn’t know them, he just concentrated on teaching different things. In my youth I just wanted to know how to do it and that was good enough for me, give me some tools to use so I can fight and that’s all I need. I could see what was going on without being told what was happening behind the scenes and why and I was fine with that. Now I’m going back and putting together what I know with what the traditional terms are for what I know.
