KC is correct - for a big, goofy action movie with a decently interesting subtext, it really raised the bar. And frankly, I’m pretty anti-Matrix myself. Like a lot of people here, I’d seen Yuen Wo-Ping’s stuff before, I’d read up a bit on zen and gnosticism before, I’d seen bullet-time used in Dr. Pepper commercials before. But for most people, everything except bullet-time sfx was new.
Look at X-men. Setting aside the built in cachet of all the comic book fans, it has pretty much the same formula.
Cool action (although not as cool as Yuen’s)
Cool FX (in a pretty different style)
Reasonably interesting subtext (civil rights struggles and queer consciousness vs. The Matrix’ questions of perception vs. reality)
And it was a big success.
But Ballistic Ecks vs. Sever had nothing going on under the surface, so it flopped.
Look at X-men. Setting aside the built in cachet of all the comic book fans, it has pretty much the same formula.
X-Men doesn’t have the same type of Cult following. Fans of the comics like it for it’s connection to the comics. Other people like X-Men and Spidey movies because of the movie itself, not because of the theme or it’s connection to them.
Do a search for Matrix on Google. You’ll get thousands of metaphysical treatises. Same as Star Wars.
Dude, have you tried a google search on “X-Men”!??!
X-Men has a massive cult following. If it doesn’t have as many treatises on the net as Matrix, it’s mostly because most of that stuff got worked out by fans in the pre-web
edit - a seach for X-men and queer just got me 5,170 hits. So much for no interest in the thematic content!
I know it has a Cult following, but not for the same reasons. Comics aren’t exactly known for their ability convey a mystical experience to the reader. They are Soap-Operas for boys.
I’m talking about a deep, fundamental spiritual chord that these series strike in an audience full of people disillusioned by the world they are forced to participate in.
In recent Austrailian census, the government had to warn people about putting JEDI as their religion. They didn’t have to warn people about putting Mutant for their race. There is a difference.
Originally posted by cho
[B]take Keanu out of it, then you’d have good acting.
IMO, no one in Hollywood has been able to emulate HK style action. I have yet to see action that’s better than Hard Boiled.
I intend to see it for the spfx and Bellucci. [/B]
It’s not really emulating HK style, since it’s done by a hong kong crew, not the Warchowski brothers. It IS Hong Kong style. It’s just that real actors must be used, or the movie will blow in exactly the same way most HK action (or any action flicks, for that matter)flicks blow- way substandard acting. It doesn’t matter how good the kung fu is, if people don’t believe in the character, you’ve got a flop.
CSN, that X-Men relation is a good one. It’s the magic combo, though I think Matrix did the combo better, while X-Men satisfied the old fans better.
I’m not taking the freeway until at least a week after seeing Matrix2. For the safety of the other drivers. I LOVED that chase scene, and I hate chase scenes.
“I know it has a Cult following, but not for the same reasons. Comics aren’t exactly known for their ability convey a mystical experience to the reader. They are Soap-Operas for boys.”
No, not quite for the same reasons. After all, they’re digging into different themes.
As for the second part of that statement - don’t make me come over there and hurt you! Comics have been inspiring people to think and act in particular ways as long as movies have and probably longer. For every Star Wars and Matrix you bring up, I have an X-Men, Spider Man and Batman I can bring to the table. And for every Un Chien Andalou and Schindler’s List you have, I can haul out Ghost World and Maus.
But now I’m really digressing - suffice it to say that different media have different strengths and weaknesses. For the most part the strength of movies is enveloping the senses and the strength of comics is manipulating the perception of time.
Masterkiller has a good point, although I hadn’t realized that the Matrix would have that sort of following.
Since star wars, jedi is a little piece of the collective junk philosophy. Whereas, at least in my experiece, X-Men issues are more a shared experience, in that I know if I mention the shi ar guard’s part in the death of phoenix, Design Sifu will not only know what I’m talking about, but can supply a link to a site where bodacious redheads dress as Jean Grey and get all dominant on the discerning geek.
I don’t know how that relates to the Matrix. I hope kids aren’t putting really long needles in the backs of their heads or anything.
Chang Style Novice:
As for the second part of that statement - don’t make me come over there and hurt you! Comics have been inspiring people to think and act in particular ways as long as movies have and probably longer.
You tell 'em CSN!!! beat me to that punch!!!
X-Men issues are more a shared experience, in that I know if I mention the shi ar guard’s part in the death of phoenix, Design Sifu will not only know what I’m talking about, but can supply a link to a site where bodacious redheads dress as Jean Grey and get all dominant on the discerning geek.
Comics have been inspiring people to think and act in particular ways as long as movies have and probably longer. For every Star Wars and Matrix you bring up, I have an X-Men, Spider Man and Batman I can bring to the table. And for every Un Chien Andalou and Schindler’s List you have, I can haul out Ghost World and Maus.
