What happened is best said to be NOT about the Pai, but about a person - his attitude which was to try to run the Foundation and when that wasn’t gonna happen, he just stired the ****.
The Pai are still friendly to one-another, it was just one bad ass mother who screwed it up - in a way that might cause the older generation to get involved. Sick.
That’s why I believe that it WILL happen one day, the Pai themselves are cool and don’t pull one another down.
If it don’t happen, then one day there’s gonna be one hell of a lotta trouble in Jook-Lum as some guy is gonna try take over the whole scene and claim that he has got the whole art - all Pai - all branches under his control. Yeah, there is such a mother - all the Pai know who he is.
Sad, to let him get his way by ‘doing nothin’.
I’ve been advised by my Si-Fu not to fan the flames any further - but, suffice to say that he wasn’t from HK or the USA. The Foundation people know who he was (the guy who f****** it up that is). The one who is planning a ‘move’ on the Pai is also well known and ain’t a Senior generation Master.
Thanks for the copmpliment, but I am not my teacher. He has asked me not to stir the politics up. If you know him you can contact him directly.
Otherwise I’m real happy man to talk with you.
Who is SW? And who is Steve? But I guess it dont matter? An idea to bring people together never works. There has been quite a few groups who tried to get together only to find out it was not a good idea. Maybe this guy Brian Gray has it right? Dont talk about who you trained with and that way know one can say you are wrong. Or at least they say you have to be wrong cause you dont have a history. Make it up on your own. Make your own system like him. He got people calling him Master, maybe he has the key.
Who is S.W. his name is Simon Wong a Jook Lum sifu from the Wong Yok Kong lineage in Great Britian or England .The other guy is Sifu Steve Richards from the Lee Yin Sing lineage of Jook Lum.These two lineages are known to have arguments in the past because of some heated debates between the two Jook Lum Masters who are of the same lineage under Chung Yel Chung or Chang the two masters are Wong Yok Kong and Lee Yin Sing.Lee Yin sing learned more Jook Lum from another master after he learned from Chung Yel Chung he also new Chu Gar Southern Mantis before he studied Jook Lum.It appears that the students of Wong Yok Kong and Lee Yin Sing also still argue about things concerning Jook Lum that Wong Yok Kong and Lee Yin Sing argued about and it has been brought to Great Britian or England with there students.It was thought that the argueing was over but it seems Simon Wong has brought it back to life.
Posted by Jack on February 19, 2001 at 17:59:46:
I see where Simon Wong, self proclaimed “Spiritual Master” and creator of Yellow Dragon Kung Fu, the UK, mix of Southern Praying Mantis & Yang Family Tai Chi Ch’uan, had his web page taken down by Yahoo. The alleged “Buddhist Spiritual Master” launched a protracted series of personal attacks on Steve Richards and Steve’s family on his web site. Yahoo finally said enough of this rubbish and disabled his site. Very unBuddhist like, cowardly behavior on the part of Simon and his collection of cult based groupies. Simon’s a total fraud as his supposed “lineage” within the Kwongsai Jook Lum Gee Tong Long Pai is shot through with errors and lies. A public declaration of challenge to Kong Sau will be published in a couple of local UK newspapers in the near future calling on Simon to put his hands out or close his school. Good stuff and it will be interesting to see just what the little weenie does in response to same. Just goes to show that “Karma” is something that is real as “What goes around comes around” proved true in this case. Jack
I’ve been told not to get involved with ‘politics’ by my Si-Fu and I know Lee-Yin-Sing’s inheritor, his son Grandmaster lee-Sun-Wah
(Lee-Lien Ah Gore) would not be intereested but, just to say that you rae right that WYG and LYS ‘fell out’ but, the trouble in the UK was to do with my Si-Gung the late LYS Master Ho-Sing who chased a VERY VERY senior WYG master out of Liverpool UK - closing his school down. SOME of WYG’s people never forgot that and had bad attitudes towards Ho-Sing’s students (one of whom was my Si-Fu - he is now disciple and nominated co-successor to GM Lee-Lien). It should be said also that many of LYS’s and WYG’s descendants in the UK are not only good friends but also study each others Pai. There is no ‘trouble’ between the Pai as such, but some individuals have tried to cause it, s**** being stired on other forums from some J-L people from “another” branch not in the UK. We should try to be friends and concentrate on our common ancestry. Some of us can “do it” why not the others?
The problems most are between different peopl and should not be held against lineage. Meaning the system remains the same. There is always going to be people who try to mess things up. I think this is why some of the old schools waited so long to show any of the good martial arts to the people they trusted. I think the smaller the style the more this goes on. If people hear there is going to be someone putting on a demo in their area most dont praise it they condem it, if it isnt from their branch. They try to get people to stay away by boring them with the personal attacks of their branch, instead of letting the indiviuals judge for themselfs. This type of thing starts with the teachers of the art. I’ll bet any rumor you hear about a teacher in the same art but from a different art, can be traced to the teacher of your branch. He is most likely the one who started it. If not he can nip it in the bud, by telling his student this guy is OK. If your teacher says he’s OK, most likely you will pass it on. But instead, they say this guy is this or that and you pass it on. Before long there is a war between branches. It does nothing good for your system. Everyone wants to be the leader. Everyone wants to be right. If the Master of the system wanted you to be the inheritor of his art? He would make it clear before his death, and knowone would doubt it. It would be clear. If he did not make anyone the inheritor, he had his reasons. He may have left pieces here and there, and it is up to those people to get together and put it together.If they cant? Then maybe their students can. But it did come from the same tree. And the Master was not only right with you. Open your mind. Your not that good. Learn from all branches of the system. You can do this without hurting your branch. You dont no everything. If it looks a little different? But has the same root, it is your system. Just because your teacher dont teach this way, dont make the other guy wrong.Maybe your teacher didnt learn this way. I have taken instruction from many different people in the same class and they all teach different. When they get on their own, they teach the way they understand. Some people learn on a much higher level. *****, but it is true. Some people see what others will never see. Screw the trouble makers, they are not going to do you guys any good. Most likely they have knowthing to teach any way. For the sake of the art, get together. Learn from each other. You will soon see, “You dont no that much”
Thank you all for all of this wonderful dialogue on the subject. This has been most enlightening, educational and helpful – in many many ways.
Thanks again and I can only hope it will continue. It would be wonderful to use this forum as a springboard for the creation of a “who’s who and where” database within the Jook Lum community. Only qualification being your claim as such (a Jook Lum practitioner) and the integrity of those who would evaluate that claim.
