In most MMA fights, the hands are often dropped while kicking.
This is tactically wrong in my book and leaves you unnecessarily open for high gate counter attacks.
Why is this done and to what advantage? power?
I’ve never learned to throw any kick w/o keeping my guard up.
Yenhoi, cite the ‘thai’ round kick and said that if timing and range are correct then guarding is less important. I agree but that could be said for anything.
Why would one not want to maximise your ability to protect the head?
I see it a lot, and I am guilty of it myself from time to time. It’s easier to generate power (for me), but optimally I would prefer to keep my hands up.
I will never forget seeing one time in a kickboxing match years ago, the guy kept throwing his roundhouse kicks and dropping the same side hand down past his waist, I guess to generate torque - anyway, his opponent must have noticed this because he kind of waited, waited, and after about the 4th or 5th time he had the guy timed, slipped the past the kick to the guy’s outside, and hooked him square on the side of the chin from the kicking side; the guy spun around 360 deg. and hit the canvas like a sack of dirt
I have tried to keep my hands up when I kick ever since…
When people are entrained to just “sit and wait” the attack out instead of countering then its easy to not worry about keeping a guard. Some people fight like ducks in a shooting gallery.
However if you are fighting a person that is all about the counter attack and doesn’t just stand there, you better have a guard. That person will not “feign and brace” and wait for impact. That person will move, block , counter, attack and continue moving.
All of my kicks are done with the guard up. The drop the guard thing is how TKD teaches to kick, and I think since TKD is the starting point for so many people, it’s a habit that stays with later on down the road.
My guess is the method was created to teach people to be a little open so sport competitors have the oppertunity to counter and thus create more excitieng ring fights. Now, today, no one knows that and just followes out of habit and how thier TKD Sensi taught them when they were in Kiddie Karate at age 9.
Moving your arms is very common in kicking. The arm that moves (if you notice, it’s always the same side as the kicking leg) serves as a counter weight that oth stabilzes balance, and adds power to the kick. That’s the problem. It ‘makes sense’ to the body to move the arm like that. That’s why everyone (myself included) does it.
I got to the point where I wasn’t doing for a while, but that’s when I was doing Muay Thai. It’s a lot easier doing something when you train it regularly. Now, I change my arm movement, and that works for me. I push when I throw a roundhouse, and ‘elbow myself in the hip’ on a sidekick.
yea, i’m as guilty of the next person of dropping the hands on a kick…i got knocked down in the finals of that sport jj event a few years back because I dropping the kicking leg hand to my hip, he slipped inside the arc of the kick and tagged me good in the jaw. but, I try not to train that way.
My guess is the method was created to teach people to be a little open so sport competitors have the oppertunity to counter and thus create more excitieng ring fights. Now, today, no one knows that and just followes out of habit and how thier TKD Sensi taught them when they were in Kiddie Karate at age 9.
RD, that doesn’t make any sense. It’s just lazy teaching and lazy training.
I try to keep my kicking leg arm up, low enough to cover ribs w/ elbow and high enough to cover the chin w/ my hand.
in muay thai they drop the hand thats the same side as the kicking leg. this puts more power in the kick. the difference may be in thai boxing they roll the hip over so your head’s out of range.
[QUOTE=Royal Dragon;765076]My guess is the method was created to teach people to be a little open so sport competitors have the oppertunity to counter and thus create more excitieng ring fights. Now, today, no one knows that and just followes out of habit and how thier TKD Sensi taught them when they were in Kiddie Karate at age 9.[/QUOTE]wtf??? hahahaha great, teach something that doesnt work because it makes fights more exciting. brilliant why didnt i think of that hahaha
The defence to being hit in the head whilst kicking is not being in range in the first place for the counter punch to reach you…if you’re in range to be counter punched then generally you are also in range for him to shoot on you without getting a chance to effectively sprawl (since to kick your hips need to be forward) which is why MMA guys dont kick at that closer range.
The time to Kick at that closer range in MMA is when your opponent is huddled up, dazed or otherwise on the backfoot and so cant execute an effective counter strike, but then again in that instance covering the head is not so important anyway
still if its a concern you can cover with the cross hand, leaving the same side hand free to counter balance the rotation of the kick
Moving your arms is very common in kicking. The arm that moves (if you notice, it’s always the same side as the kicking leg) serves as a counter weight that oth stabilzes balance, and adds power to the kick. That’s the problem. It ‘makes sense’ to the body to move the arm like that. That’s why everyone (myself included) does it.
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I find I get more power keeping the guard up. I allways felt dropping the arm causes the body to fight itself as part of it is going in the opposite direction as the other part, causeing a drag and inefficiency.
[QUOTE=Royal Dragon;765185]Moving your arms is very common in kicking. The arm that moves (if you notice, it’s always the same side as the kicking leg) serves as a counter weight that oth stabilzes balance, and adds power to the kick. That’s the problem. It ‘makes sense’ to the body to move the arm like that. That’s why everyone (myself included) does it.
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I find I get more power keeping the guard up. I allways felt dropping the arm causes the body to fight itself as part of it is going in the opposite direction as the other part, causeing a drag and inefficiency.[/QUOTE]
to be blunt, that’s just not true. there is power to be had from countertwisting the upper body. it’s much easier to get the power that way then with just waist coiling w/o the upper body helping. you can get power by using great waist/hip coiling and keeping your guard up but it’s not likely to be as great as dropping the hands and counter coiling w/ the upper body. that’s why we see it where we do.
me, I don’t like getting hit in the head…****es me right off, it does. so, I’ll sacrafice a bit of power and inrease my chances of getting ktfo’d
[QUOTE=stricker;765151]in muay thai they drop the hand thats the same side as the kicking leg. this puts more power in the kick. the difference may be in thai boxing they roll the hip over so your head’s out of range.[/QUOTE]
yes. in addition, as the kicking leg arm is dropped, the base leg arm is brought aroundthe face - similar to how a capoeirista does the ginga. one of the most effective counters to a roundhouse is the cross, so you need to protect your face.
[QUOTE=Royal Dragon;765185]Moving your arms is very common in kicking. The arm that moves (if you notice, it’s always the same side as the kicking leg) serves as a counter weight that oth stabilzes balance, and adds power to the kick. That’s the problem. It ‘makes sense’ to the body to move the arm like that. That’s why everyone (myself included) does it.
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I find I get more power keeping the guard up. I allways felt dropping the arm causes the body to fight itself as part of it is going in the opposite direction as the other part, causeing a drag and inefficiency.[/QUOTE]
then you need are doing something wrong - at least from the perspective of a thai roundhouse.
[QUOTE=Oso;765182]what about just training to throw good hard kicks with good enough balance that you don’t need to drop your hands?
serious question.[/QUOTE]
too much momentum. ever notice how after throwing a hard roundhouse and missing, some muay thai guys spin completely around and some stop at 180 and throw a back kick? it is hard as fock to stop a fully committed roundhouse in mid-kick. that said, you can kick hard with less momentum, but it would still be much more powerful with the momentum added.
I do know a couple of guys who teach not to drop the hands tho.
[QUOTE=Royal Dragon;765198]If the upper body is going one way, and the lower is going the opposite, these opposing directions cancell eachother out and reduce impacting force.
Sure, dropping the arm makes it Feel stronger, because you feel the struggle, but you are not actually Hitting as hard.
This is especially true with a side kick, and the round kick.
Once you learn to keep the upper, and lower body connected (like internal guys do), you really see what I am taling about.[/QUOTE]
dude, there is nowhere near as much torque involved in a sidekick - there is no need to drop the hands.
let’s assume you are right about keeping the body connected. what happens when you miss?
I was taught from orthodox stace, you throw the roundhouse with the right leg, you can swing your right arm, but bring your left hand in front of your face showing your palm to your opponent to block the cross (a common counter). There are many though. Sometimes your so worried about checking the kick your not even thinking about punching.