This is turning into Battle of the Lore-Masters… am dusting off my 1st edition hardcover Silmarillion as I type… watch out!
[QUOTE=rett2;1293140]This is turning into Battle of the Lore-Masters… am dusting off my 1st edition hardcover Silmarillion as I type… watch out![/QUOTE]
Frankly, I’m ok with the philosophies.
I don’t subscribe to any particular religion though.
I think there are underlying truths to our existence and one of them is that we should really get to enjoying existence and living the life as life is for the living. Spending a life in dread about what happens when you’re dead is in my view the height of absurdity.
You’re missing out on a lot otherwise. How would you feel if you gave someone a gift and they never really used it but rather kept it on a shelf?
[QUOTE=David Jamieson;1293142]Frankly, I’m ok with the philosophies.
I don’t subscribe to any particular religion though.
I think there are underlying truths to our existence and one of them is that we should really get to enjoying existence and living the life as life is for the living. Spending a life in dread about what happens when you’re dead is in my view the height of absurdity.
You’re missing out on a lot otherwise. How would you feel if you gave someone a gift and they never really used it but rather kept it on a shelf?[/QUOTE]
I have similar views.
IMO, religious practices or lifestyles based around fear…fear of death, fear of hell/eternal d@mnation, fear and judgment of those who are different, etc…has nothing to do with spiritual joy, love and goodwill to others and self. Spreading and promoting fear is the opposite of love. Many devout types, whose philosophy revolves around the constant threat of fire and brimstone, approach spirituality in a self-serving, kiss-a$$ manner in the hopes they’ll be allowed into heaven. Many such people don’t even necessarily believe in an afterlife, but view being ‘devout’ as a type of insurance ‘just in case’.
I strongly believe that we came into this life for a purpose, whatever that is for each soul, and that’s certainly not to grovel and be a suck up, spiritually or otherwise.
P.S.:
I realize I’ve just contradicted myself here with regard to ‘judgment of others/those who are different’, but I’ve observed MANY people like I’ve described. Hey, I’m not perfect, but at least I’m aware of it.
[QUOTE=David Jamieson;1293142]
I think there are underlying truths to our existence and one of them is that we should really get to enjoying existence and living the life as life is for the living. Spending a life in dread about what happens when you’re dead is in my view the height of absurdity.
You’re missing out on a lot otherwise. How would you feel if you gave someone a gift and they never really used it but rather kept it on a shelf?[/QUOTE]
I agree with you on this…I do find the religious histories and philosophies fascinating though, while I’m sure it bores most people to tears.
I think there is value in knowing where we as a society came from, why we do the things we do, why things are the way they are.
Kung Fu being a wonderful example…the more authentic history you learn about it, the more your perspective on it is bound to change.
[QUOTE=rett2;1293140]This is turning into Battle of the Lore-Masters… am dusting off my 1st edition hardcover Silmarillion as I type… watch out![/QUOTE]
You made me google “Silmarillion.” My pop culture credentials are abysmal. 
Slightly OT
But fascinating on many levels…
PARANORMAL
MAY 9, 2016
WERE ‘DEMONS’ RESPONSIBLE FOR 80 SUICIDES IN INDIAN VILLAGE? INVESTIGATORS REVEAL SHOCKING INFORMATION ABOUT MASS SUICIDES IN THE VILLAGE OF BADI
ERIN FITZGERALD
Throughout the year in the village of Badi in the Khargone district, 80 people committed suicide, causing residents to believe “demons” were haunting them. Investigators revealed shocking information about the mass suicides in the village of Badi. Are demons the culprit of this increase in suicides?
Paranormal News reports that 320 families in the small village experienced at least one suicide within their family. The village chief, Rajendra Sisodiya, said his mother and brother committed suicide, as well as his cousin, who hung himself in front of his home.
Are demons or pesticides to blame for mass suicides in village of Badi in India
[Photo by Prashanth Vishwanathan/Getty Images]
Ashok Verma was chosen to lead an investigation to find the root of the mass-suicide problem.
[QUOTE]“This is a very grave situation and we need to act fast. The villagers lack confidence and motivation and it’s very important to counsel them.”
Although Sisodiya and other village residents believe that a demonic presence is the cause of the mass suicides, scientists determined the increase in suicides were caused by pesticides.
The village uses pesticides on cotton crops, and the chemicals are likely to cause conditions such as schizophrenia and depression.
Scientists further reported that when farmers in China were using pesticides a couple years ago, they, too, experienced an increase in suicides. A study was performed to confirm that pesticides are, in fact, linked to depression.
According to RT, during an interview with the Times of India, Dr. Srikanth Reddy, a psychiatrist, said that the villagers do not relate to depression and otherwise associate the problem with a demonic presence.
The villagers tried banning alcohol, thinking maybe that was the cause of the suicide problem. However, this simply caused the residents to visit other neighboring villages to get alcohol.
The youngest villager to attempt suicide was only 11-years-old, forcing the community to declare a state of emergency last month.
As mentioned above, China experienced a similar experience a couple years ago when farmers began committing suicide. The suicides were linked to exposure to the harmful pesticides, which caused depression and sometimes even schizophrenia.
Toxipedia states that 250,000 suicide deaths worldwide were a result of pesticide poisoning. Within the last decade, up to 90 percent of suicides in Malaysia, Sri Lanka, and China were caused by pesticide ingestion, particularly Trinidad.
India village hit with mass suicide and pesticides could be to blame
[Photo by Carlos Villalon/Getty Images]
Although pesticide ingestion is the logical explanation for the mass-suicides in the tiny Indian village, residents seem to blame a more illogical reason: demons.
Antiochian reveals that before the time of Christ, mental illnesses were considered demonic, not physical. It was insisted that the symptoms were caused by demons.
Unexplained Stuff says that studies of psychical researchers and clergy reveal certain aspects of demonic possessions.
The possessed may become antisocial and will begin hearing voices. They begin to see a demonic spirit, and eventually, the possessed will black-out consciousness and carry on in a trance-like state.
Others will notice the possessed speaking and walking in a strange manner and doing odd things that the person has never done before. Eventually, the possessed may commit violent crimes, murder, or even suicide.
Professionals in the healthcare industry do compare demonic possessions with mental health illnesses.
A psychotherapist, Dr. Adam Crabtree, stated that entities that seek a person’s body and mind are because they have “unfinished business on Earth.” Crabtree also mentioned that he has had patients come to him complaining that they feel a presence within then. These patients are typically very emotionally disturbed and have often shown different characteristics, unlike their own.
What do you think is the reason behind this Indian village’s mass-suicide problem? Of course, the more likely reason behind the case would be the scientific evidence pointing at pesticide ingestion. However, it is certainly possible that a demon or demons are haunting the tiny Indian village, eventually causing those possessed to commit suicide.
[Photo by Daniel Berehulak/Getty Images]
[/QUOTE]
steaming exorcism
Yan’s mother, sitting next to where the steaming took place, is still grieving CREDIT: NEIL CONNOR FOR THE TELEGRAPH
Neil Connor, guangyuan, sichuan province
15 MAY 2016 2:50PM
After other black magic rituals failed to cure his wife’s ailments, Yan Yingmao relented to the Chinese witch doctors wishes: she would be steamed alive until the “ghosts” were dispelled from her body.
The two men who had been “treating” the woman proceeded to place her inside a wooden barrel suspended over a large vat of slowly boiling water. She seemed okay at first," said Mr Yan, who lives in a remote village near Guangyuan, deep in the mountains of south-western China.
The barrel being removed from the steaming apparatus. CREDIT: CHINA NEWS SERVICE
As scalding hot vapour began to pass through the barrel, he was told to fetch a needle needed for the exorcism. “When I returned the screaming had begun,” Mr Yan told the Sunday Telegraph.
As his wife cried out in agony inside the barrel, he remonstrated with the two witch doctors. "They said the ritual must be concluded, and that the screams from my wife was the sound of demons leaving her body, he said.
He stood and watched until his wife’s cries became too much to bear. But after pulling her blackened body from the barrel and cradling her in his arms, he knew it was too late. “I looked at her face, and it was purple. She told me she wouldn’t make it,” said Mr Yan, 45. The pair of witch doctors then slipped away and ran to the green mountains surrounding the family home.
Police remove the barrel CREDIT: CHINA NEWS SERVICE
This incident in Sichuan province shows how belief in the supernatural and adherence to ancient rituals still runs deep in rural China. Beijing is waging a war against superstition, having vowed to eradicate poverty and improve education among the countrys alienated rural citizenry.
This campaign dates back to the 1920s when Mao Tse-tung, then a rebel leader, tried to eradicate feudal and superstitious beliefs in the areas he controlled, more than two decades before the Communists seized power in Beijing. Today, a directive on the partys website promises the regime will firmly crackdown on those who used superstition to damage national interests, social stability and peoples life and property.
Mr Yao lives in a remote rural community CREDIT: NEIL CONNOR FOR THE TELEGRAPH
Ironically, belief in fortune-telling and geomancy is particularly strong amongst Communist party cadres. In March, an official in Shaanxi province was expelled from the party after he was found to be participating in an evil cult which claimed to be able to cure diseases. He should have believed in science and led the locals in gaining wealth, said a disciplinary official.
The prevalence of irrational beliefs is an embarrassment for the officially atheist Communist Party as it seeks to modernise China in accordance with its own brand of Marxism. People living in Mr Yans community - made up of remote dwellings perched on jagged white-cliff mountains speak openly of their belief in superstition. Many believe in the power of spiritual healing for physical ailments, while some blame “ghosts” or “devils” living in the body for health defects.
The sick are usually the ones with the most extreme beliefs, said one local man.
The death of Mr Yans wife whose name he would not disclose follows other examples of lethal exorcisms in China. In the southern island of Hainan, three brothers were charged with murder in 2013 after they killed their mother following instructions by a witch doctor who was treating her painful joints.
The three brothers killed their mother under instructions from a witch doctor CREDIT: HINEWS.CN
Gao Yongchuan, a self-proclaimed "legendary doctor subordinate to the Jade Emperor, Taoist ruler of heaven force-fed the 61-year-old woman with a concoction of distilled liquor and the blood of pigs, chicken and dogs. The aim was to force her to spit out the ghost.
When she fell unconscious after the ritual, he ordered her sons to beat her to death, burn the body and then bury it. She would then climb out from beneath the ground, he promised.
Chinas booming coastal cities have also witnessed examples of extreme “healing”. In 2013 a self-styled Ghostbuster persuaded a woman to sleep with him after saying that he could only exorcise the demons inside her with his *****.
Those accused of committing crimes through “dispelling ghosts” have been accused of distorting the art of shamanism, an ancient tradition of spiritual healing which is respected among some minority communities in China. Shamans, or “spirit masters”, are considered the intermediary between the spiritual and human worlds, and they often offer spiritual advice, commonly in the form of fortune telling.
There are so-called shamans claiming they can cure," said Shi Wenji, a shaman from Jilin province, in north-eastern China. A shaman should deal with the relationship between human beings and God, but fake shamans deal with the relationship between human beings and ghosts.
The two fake shamans who convinced Mr Yan and his wife to carry out the steaming ritual were later arrested by local police.
Mr Yan now lives in despair, trying to cope with the loss of the mother of his two children, and also the guilt that he was partly responsible for her death. I really didnt have any other choice as I wanted my wife to be cured, he said. I would have rather died than let this happen. How could I have intentionally killed my wife?
Slightly OT
I found this so disturbing that I had to share. I wonder what the shirt was. I’m sure it was possessed.
Former ASU football player sacrificed family poodle in smoker, police say
Katie Faller, The Republic | azcentral.com 7:13 a.m. MST May 17, 2016
Patrick Zane Thompson
(Photo: Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office)
A Goodyear man and former Arizona State University football player was arrested Saturday on suspicion of animal cruelty after being accused of breaking the family dog’s neck and placing him in a smoker, according to court documents.
Patrick Zane Thompson, 42, was booked on suspicion of two felony and four misdemeanor counts related to the death of the family’s white poodle, documents said.
Thompson played right guard for ASU football in 1996, when the team posted an 11-1 record and lost the Rose Bowl to Ohio State University. He is also the owner of the Raging Cajun Smoking Barbecue catering company.
Officers were called to a house in the 16000 block of West Mohave Street in Goodyear and found Thompson lying on the sidewalk with a self-inflicted gash in his arm, according to police documents.
Thompson earlier had burned a shirt that belonged to his 17-year-old daughter in the industrial-size smoker in a trailer in his side yard, saying he didn’t like the shirt because he believed it had to do with the devil.
Family members told police he had begun to act erratically, saying in front of his wife and four children that he had to make a sacrifice of a male, either himself, his 6-year-old son or the family dog.
Thompson grabbed the dog as the children and his wife pleaded with him to stop, but he broke the dog’s neck, police said. The family fled and called police.
Officers found the dog dead in the smoker. Thompson told officers he had smoked marijuana earlier in the day and began to have an “episode,” according to court documents.
After he burned the shirt, he said he began to have a vision that something bad was going to happen to his family and that “the Lord” was going to kill him for what he had done. From his readings of the Bible, he said, he knew he had to make a male sacrifice. He selected the dog instead of himself or his son, he told officers.
Thompson was booked into a Maricopa County jail on a $20,000 bond. His next court appearance was set for May 23.
Exorcism of Demon Possessed Beyonce ( Sasha Fierce ) and Others!!! - Tess Kielhamer
too scary
Alas…kids today. :rolleyes:
Exorcism in Italy a job ‘too scary’ for young priests
By James Reynolds
BBC News, Rome
18 October 2016
Fr Vincenzo Taraborelli sees dozens of people every day in his backroom office
“That is a possessed woman there,” says Fr Vincenzo Taraborelli as he points up to an 18th Century fresco in his Roman church. “They’re holding her with her mouth open. She has little devils coming out of her body. She’s being freed.”
It is a scene the 79-year-old priest says he knows well. For the past 27 years, Fr Taraborelli has performed exorcisms - the Catholic rite of expelling evil spirits.
He stumbled into the job when a fellow priest needed help.
“I didn’t know what it was, I hadn’t studied it,” the father says. “He told me what to do. I was totally ignorant.”
He has since become one of Rome’s busiest exorcists, and the Catholic Church is struggling to find younger successors.
Working three days a week from a windowless room at the back of his church near the Vatican, he often sees up to 30 people every day.
“Before doing exorcisms I urge people to see a psychologist or a psychiatrist, and I ask them to bring me their prognosis. I’m in touch with many psychologists who send their patients here.”
AP
The Vatican denied claims in 2013 that Pope Francis had been filmed performing an exorcism
On one side of the room, a cabinet is filled with hundreds of small statues of angels. In a drawer, he keeps a supply of sweets to hand out to his visitors. On the wall is an official document showing his qualification as an exorcist.
Fr Taraborelli’s desk is crowded with papers, photos, and prayer books. He sits in a simple chair; those who come to see him sit opposite him.
Before doing exorcisms I urge people to see a psychologist or a psychiatrist. I ask them to bring me their prognosis."
Fr Vincenzo Taraborelli
BBC
“First of all, I get the room ready,” he says. “Then if the person is not doing well, I try to calm them down reassure them. I invite them to join me in prayer. But many of them when they come here are already disturbed.”
He looks through his copy of the Catholic Church’s exorcism rites. He’s had to tape it back together to stop it from falling apart. Amidst the pile of papers on his desk, he finds the cross he uses to expel evil spirits.
His most notable case involved a married woman he treated for 13 years.
“Another man, who was a Satanist, wanted her,” he remembers. "She refused. So this man told her: ‘You’ll pay for this.’ He cast so-called spells to attract her to him, twice a week.
"Then they came to me, in this room. I started to pray, and she went into a trance. She would blurt out insults, blasphemies. I quickly understood she was possessed.
"As the rite continued, she started feeling worse and worse. So when I told the devil: ‘In the name of Jesus, I order you to go away’, she started to vomit little metal pins, five at a time.
“Aside from pins she would also vomit hair braids, little stones, pieces of wood. It sounds like something from another world right? Instead, it’s something from this world.”
Exorcism and the Catholic Church
THINKSTOCK
Within the Catholic Church, the concept of possession by demons is an accepted belief.
It is sometimes used to explain murderous behaviour, as in the recent murder of 85-year-old French priest Fr Jacques Hamel in his church in the French city of Rouen in July.
GETTY IMAGES
Pope Francis said Fr Hamel was on his way to sainthood
When two Islamist militants acting in the name of jihadist group Islamic State (IS) burst into the church and stabbed Fr Hamel, he tried to fend them off, crying out “Be gone, Satan!” - an apparent attempt at exorcism.
In support of the priest’s actions, Pope Francis accelerated the process of Fr Hamel’s candidacy for sainthood.
But outside the Catholic Church, many dispute the entire basis of demonic possession and exorcism.
Non-believers argue that so-called possession by evil spirits is simply a medieval superstition or myth. Those who claim to be possessed by evil spirits are people suffering from easily explicable psychological or psychiatric problems, they say.
Fr Taraborelli rejects the scepticism.
“Well, someone who isn’t a believer doesn’t believe in the devil either,” he says, “But someone who believes knows that the devil exists, you can read it in the gospel. Then you only need to see how the world is nowadays. It has never been this bad. These violence acts are not human. So terrible, like IS.”
AFP
The Church’s most prominent exorcist, Gabriele Amorth, who died last month, was said to have performed 160,000 exorcisms
Fr Taraborelli shows no sign of wanting to give up his work and his mobile phone rings constantly.
But younger priests are not particularly attracted by the prospect of spending hours in windowless rooms, reading exorcism rites to disturbed believers.
“I told the bishop that I can’t find anyone willing to do this. Many of them are scared. Even priests can be scared. It’s a difficult life.”
Happy Halloween!
The Making of a Modern-Day Exorcist
With reports of demonic possession on the rise, a look at the clergy who have to separate mental illness from the devil’s work
By Caroline Cox
4 days ago
In 1999, a man we’ll call Jacob Turner was 18 and on a mission trip in Trinidad and Tobago when he suddenly felt the sensation of something wrapping itself around him, constricting him and rendering him unable to breathe. He tried to ignore it, but it continued to escalate, as though a snake was wrapping itself around his torso, squeezing him tighter and tighter. He and his fellow Pentecostals had ventured into a part of the Caribbean nation where demonic activity had been reported. After about 10 minutes, Turner alerted his group to what was happening, and they began to pray over him. The pain and discomfort subsided immediately.
From a self-trained mentalist to a second-generation ghost hunter, what it takes to conduct a seance for the Hollywood set
What Turner – who asked Rolling Stone not to use his real name due to his continued affiliation with the Catholic Church – experienced is a makeshift exorcism from what could be classified as “demonic oppression,” less severe than demonic possession, wherein someone can experience anything from a physical ailment to financial hardship due to an evil spirit or the devil himself.
Reports of exorcism requests have been steadily on the rise in the last century – a short time when you consider that the first instance of Christian exorcism was reportedly recorded in the year 253 in a letter from Pope Cornelius, with the first rite of exorcism allegedly being written in 1614. Though in the U.S. the practice is mostly relegated to Christianity, non-Christian religions, including Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam and Judaism also have their own forms of exorcising. The Exorcist, which was released in 1973 and remains one of the most popular R-rated films of all time, certainly had its part in bringing the phenomenon outside of church doors and into public consciousness. But it’s more recent developments that have arguably had a greater effect.
[QUOTE]Advancements in technology have made it easier than ever to submit an exorcism request
In 1999, the Vatican revised its exorcism regulations for the first time in more than 300 years to put more emphasis on working with mental health professionals to ensure that the allegedly possessed person’s feelings aren’t from a chemical imbalance or a psychological condition, such as depression or schizophrenia. But advancements in technology have made it easier than ever to submit an exorcism request.
The principle belief of exorcism separates the possessed person from the evil that is possessing them, making a clear distinction. Though there have been updates to the rites, the processes and rituals have, for the most part, stayed the same for centuries. There are varying recognized degrees of demonic possession – the less severe is considered demonic oppression, which is felt more as a weight on the oppressed person. Demonic possession is more severe, potentially causing the afflicted person to speak in a different voice or to become violent. (Homes and objects, like figurines or dolls, can also become possessed.) Likewise, the act of exorcising in the Christian faith takes on several forms, generally ranging from minor to major rites. It’s minor rites that are more commonly invoked, in the form of praying over a person, place or object. Often, this successfully banishes the “demon” after one concise session. Major rites tackle severe demonic possession, which is rare and may involve taking such measures as tying someone down so that they’re not a danger to themselves or others. These types of exorcisms can take years to complete.
Turner, now 35, always knew he’d be active in ministry. He was born and raised in both Baptist and Charismatic Pentecostal parishes around Atlanta, Georgia. These types of Pentecostal churches aren’t affiliated with other traditional Pentecostal churches – they can be made up of people from various Christian denominations such as Catholic, Methodist or Presbyterian. There’s a heavy emphasis on connecting with the Holy Spirit through things like signs, miracles, healings and speaking in tongues. He started out as a student at Atlanta Christian College (now Point University) majoring in Biblical Studies and Humanities. During this time, a combination of adolescent angst and his parents’ divorce prompted him to look outside of the Pentecostal church for religious roots. “If you had said that I was going to be a priest, I probably would have asked the question: ‘At what point did I fall away?’” says Turner. Priesthood was based in the Catholic tradition, and growing up he’d been told that Catholics were all going to Hell. Catholicism, as he was taught, “was heretical at best, and satanic deception at worst.”
Nevertheless, Turner felt called to pastoral ministry. He joined the Anglican church in 2004 and rose from a deacon to a priest. One element that linked his Pentecostal upbringing and his Catholic calling together was the practice of exorcisms. “You’d see and hear exorcisms quite a bit in Pentecostal church,” he says. “I have had quite a few experiences with malevolent entities that made me very cognitive of their existence.” In his role as a priest, he was often called on to bless people or items – a light form of exorcising, if you will. He began researching and studying the history of exorcism after realizing the church was receiving requests “pretty much nonstop.”
Roman Catholics act out the Crucifixion in Roland Doe’s boyhood neighborhood during a Via Crucis parade organized by the boy’s old church, Saint James Parish, in Prince George’s County, Maryland, USA, 29 March 2013. In 1949, a Saint James priest named Father Albert Hughes first proclaimed Roland’s need of an exorcism. Roland, who was then Lutheran, converted to Catholicism and joined Saint James Parish.
A March, 2013, recreation of the 1949 Roman Catholic exorcism of a boy called Roland Doe. Jim Lo Scalzo/EPA/Redux
Bishop Bryan Ouellette’s path to exorcism was similarly circuitous. At 43, he serves as the presiding bishop at the Holy Nicholean Catholic Church, based in Cartersville, Georgia. A former Roman-Catholic-turned-Buddhist, Ouellette had what he calls a “profound religious experience” about 10 years ago when he passed out in his home for several hours, during which he heard a voice telling him he would become a priest. He returned to Roman Catholicism shortly after, but realized he was unable to become a priest as a married man. That’s when he found the Independent Sacramental Movement which lead to the creation of the Holy Nicholean, a church that serves as a sort of Catholic Island of Misfit Toys, wherein the highest-ranking bishop doesn’t have to report to a higher authority. One of the main markers of the HNCC revolves around exorcisms – which Ouellette can perform by virtue of being a Catholic bishop with valid orders and Apostolic succession, regardless of not being in union with the Vatican. The open nature of the HNCC means they got a lot of exorcism requests from people of varying religious backgrounds and practices. “They didn’t know where to go,” says Ouellette, “so they found us and said, ‘Could you help us?’ We help everyone who comes to us.”
On Order of Exorcists, a site run by the HNCC, people can fill out a form to “request an investigation” into whatever they feel is afflicting them – Ouellette says they receive about 12 requests a month. The Order of Exorcists is headquartered in California, with services offered in more than 35 states and more than 20 countries. “Not everyone has an exorcist on staff, but we have trained lay investigators all over the place that can go in and determine whether or not there is an actual demonic event taking place,” he explains. “If there is, and there’s no clergy assigned to that jurisdiction, they can sometimes try to find the closest clergy that can go and conduct the exorcism.”
Bishop Ouellette has seen things that give him no doubt demonic possession is real
The Order of Exorcists team is unique from more traditional Christian exorcists in that they use top-of-the-line “paranormal investigation equipment” to aid them in the process – digital voice recorders, structured light sensor cameras, electromagnetic field detectors, a SB7 Spirit Box (frequently seen on ghost-hunting TV shows), infrared cameras, the works. They bring this equipment to the person’s place of residence (they prefer to work in-house, where they also videotape the process) and, firstly, ask around 60 questions about what they’ve felt or witnessed to determine the legitimacy of the person’s situation.
[/QUOTE]
continued next post
Continued from previous post
Next, they’re tasked with determining which of the four stages the paranormal event is in: according to Ouellette, the first is demonic interference (a relatively normal temptation), then demonic obsession (where the event becomes visible and problematic for the person), then demonic oppression (wherein you begin to see physical signs) and, lastly, demonic possession (which exhibits through severe signs of aggression, changes in voice and other unexplainable symptoms).
Then comes the praying, which sometimes involves using oils, incense and holy water. A lot of the time, that’s all it takes. “Sometimes, I think it’s placebo effect,” Ouellette adds, “but in a lot of cases, I think it really does have a way of changing the environment spiritually, so that if there was anything there, it kind of just goes away.” If that doesn’t do the trick, the next step is to heal the property, which entails sealing the property itself, similar to the process of consecrating a building into a church, making it a holy ground.
Ouellette has seen things that give him no doubt demonic possession is real – books flying off the shelves, or a person with no visible injuries beginning to bleed profusely right in front of him, seemingly from their pores. If he and his team investigate a property two or three times and is unable to vanquish the demonic presence, the recordings and videos taken are sent back to headquarters, where its head, Archbishop Ron Feyl, Chief Exorcist of the Order of Exorcists, and his team of trained psychiatrists assess the situation themselves to determine next steps by reviewing the house call footage. “Exorcism’s not something that is one time and it’s done – it’s not like in the movies,” he says. “Sometimes, exorcisms can take months or even years with the strongest of demonic attachment. There’s a process to it. It can get very complicated.”
Bishop James Long on the set of Destination America’s ‘Exorcism: LIVE!’ in October 2015. Destination America
Bishop James Long knows plenty about these more complicated cases. In his 15 years of exorcising, he’s performed more than 25 Solemn Rite exorcisms, along with hundreds of more minor ones. The Louisville, Kentucky-based bishop was brought up in a Roman Catholic family and felt called to study demonology when he was just nine years old. “I just had a desire to learn about demons,” he explains. “I wanted to learn why anyone would turn against God.” Now, he’s a member of the United States Old Catholic Church, which he explains as being more inclusive than traditional Roman Catholic churches, with the same sovereign sacraments and lineages. Bishop Long is best known for performing the first-ever live televised exorcism in 2015 (on Halloween, no less), which took place in Bel-Nor, Missouri at the residential home that inspired The Exorcist book and movie. It was dubbed, fittingly, Exorcism: LIVE! and aired on Destination America. (Variety dismissed the two-hour special as “harmless, pre-Halloween fluff.”)
As with Turner and Ouellette, Long, too, found himself being pulled away from the faith of his upbringing, feeling in opposition to certain Roman Catholic beliefs, like women being banned from the priesthood. “I could not in good faith be a Roman Catholic Priest and preach against women ordinations,” he says. “That would be hypocritical – I just couldn’t do it. I believe that priests should be allowed to be married. I believe in gay marriage.” These beliefs led him to the USOCC, which was founded in the 1870s, and which he describes as a more inclusive group that doesn’t discriminate based on gender or sexual orientation.
Long is also the founder of Paranormal Clergy, purportedly the world’s largest paranormal organization. He started it to bridge the gap he saw between clergy and the paranormal community – the organization serves as a funnel that connects cases with investigative groups across the country. He’s since stepped away from his active role within the clergy, but still receives the emails. (When we spoke on a Wednesday, he’d received approximately 1,800 related emails since the previous Saturday.) He makes a point to emphasize the disparity between those thousands of requests every few days and the fact that he’s performed just over two dozen actual major exorcisms. What was performed during the televised exorcism was a minor rite on the house itself, which Long says was “a phenomenal experience. I thoroughly enjoyed it.”
With exorcisms as popular as ever, it’s not surprising that popular culture has hopped on the paranormal bandwagon with more movies and shows that feature demonic possession – under varying degrees of legitimacy, of course. Turner implores those who feel afflicted to seek out knowledgeable, authentic exorcists. He also says it’s crucial for those with the power to exorcise don’t jump the gun – rather, that they remain steadfast about working with mental health professionals to ensure that the person gets the help they need, whether it’s through science or the church. “There’s a lot of hype,” he adds. “It’s very easy, I think, for even a priest to get caught up in the hype.”
Long agrees, adding that what he finds most egregious is the insurgence of “paranormal celebrities” who charge for this service. In 2014, the Daily Beast published a first-person account of a Skype exorcism that cost nearly $300 – and many, Long says, charge more. “That really is becoming a problem – as someone who has devoted my entire life to this ministry, I’ve never charged,” he says. “I have driven to almost every state in this country, but I’ve never charged a penny. This ritual is incredibly sacred, and for someone to take advantage of someone who is going through extreme spiritual distress to make a dollar, it’s an abomination.” He pauses. “I would really hate to be them when they meet God face-to-face.”
Demonic possession on the rise. This is a timely thread. 
Kind of OT…or is it??
[QUOTE=Jimbo;1298213]Kind of OT…or is it??
//youtu.be/u9nfA5qnziU
[/QUOTE]
LOL. That’s what’s left for news. LOL. What the hell are those things above her eyes ?
And win they did
Fans of struggling Chinese football club bring in Taoist priests to perform exorcism ritual on field
BY ALEX LINDER IN NEWS ON SEP 28, 2017 4:00 AM
To save their soccer club from relegation, a group of desperate fans appealed to the gods for help.
Prior to Sunday’s match against Shandong Luneng, Henan Jianye hadn’t won a match at home in more than three months. Another loss might mean that the club would be kicked off the Chinese Super League.
Hoping to get rid of all the bad mojo surrounding their club, fans invited a group of 15 Taoist priests to the Zhengzhou Hanghai Stadium to perform an exorcism ritual before the match. Photos have gone viral on Chinese social showing the priests dressed in blue and black robes praying and burning incense for the club’s success at an altar, which includes one large banner that reads: “Heaven’s will is that Jianye must win.”
And win they did on Sunday, besting Luneng by a score of 2-1.
However, the Chinese Football Association (CFA) was quick to dispel any notion that the Taoist ceremony had anything to do with the club’s much-needed victory, launching an investigation into the incident and stating that religion has no place on the football field.
Henan Jianye has agreed with the CFA’s assessment, claiming that a group of rogue but well-meaning fans had managed to gain access to the field without the club’s permission to carry out the ceremony. It has promised that such “superstitious activities” will not occur again in the future, unfortunately meaning that the fans will have to go back to relying on the skill of the club’s players and coaching staff.
Or they could always just paint their stadium gold for better fengshui. That’s what fellow Super League club Guangzhou R&F did in July following a shaky start to the season. They haven’t lost at home since.
There’s a kneeling-for-the-anthem comment to be made here but it’s surely too soon. Besides, it’s the wrong kind of football.
strange manifestations
‘Possessed’ teenager undergoes violent exorcism to rid her of evil spirit
A chilling video shows a man performing a ‘ritual of healing’ on the teenage student in a school
A ‘possessed’ teenager has undergone a violent ‘exorcism’ after she was claimed to be possesed by an evil spirit.
A chilling video shows a man performing a ‘ritual of healing’ on the teenage student in a school in Argentina.
There had been reports several teens at the school had been taken over by demons following a number of ‘strange manifestations’.
The haunting video shows the ’ healer ’ using what appear to be rosary beads and touching the teenager’s forehead with his other hand.
As the exorcism is taking place, the teenager can be seen writhing around the floor as his worried mother watches on.
The ‘healer’ said a number of children at a school had ‘strange manifestations’ (Image: Collect Unknown)
A local newspaper has reported the ‘healer’, Julio Alis, visited the school after being contacted by several parents.
After studying the possession cases, he agreed to “remove the evil spirits” from a teenager.
He has been reported as saying: “People often ignore the fact that as good exists, there is also evil, and these cases do not surprise me, because practically every day I see them and treat people who are possessed by evil spirits, the product of people who dedicate themselves to black magic or red magic.”
Alis claims to be a Catholic and insists he uses his “gift” to help people.
He also said the school had told him the girls who were “possessed” had been helped spiritually.
There’s a lot of ambiguity in this report, but follow the link to the vid if you’re curious and unafraid of possible demonic possession spreading over the internetz
ttt for 2018!
This is rather dated but an echo of it popped up on my newsfeed randomly and so I chased down the source. This is the earliest I found.
Yoga is the work of the devil, says Vatican’s chief exorcist (and he doesn’t like Harry Potter much either)
And you’ll never guess what his favourite film is…
By Nick Pisa for MailOnline
UPDATED: 12:50 EST, 25 November 2011
Outspoken: Don Gabriele Amorth, the Chief Exorcist for the Vatican for the past 25 years, spoke of his dislikes at a fringe event of the Umbria Film Festival
Father Gabriel Amorth has carried out more than 70,000 exorcisms in his capacity as Chief Exorcist at the Vatican.
The 85-year-old can boast 25 years in the post after being appointed by the late Pope John Paul II.
At a conference today, he surprised the delegates by revealing some of his greatest dislikes - yoga and Harry Potter.
Father Amorth, a colourful and often outspoken personality, said:‘Practising yoga brings evil as does reading Harry Potter. They may both seem innocuous but they both deal with magic and that leads to evil.’
He added:‘Yoga is the Devil’s work. You thing you are doing it for stretching your mind and body but it leads to Hinduism. All these oriental religions are based on the false belief of reincarnation.’
Father Amorth, speaking on the subject of People And Religion at a fringe event at the Umbria Film Festival in Terni, spoke of his distaste for JK Rowling’s young wizard.
He said:'People think it is an innocuous book for children but it’s about magic and that leads to evil. In Harry Potter the Devil is at work in a cunning and crafty way, he is using his extraordinary powers of magic and evil.
Twin terrors: Yoga turns devotees towards Hinduism, believes Father Amorth - while
'Satan is always hidden and the thing he desires more than anything is for people to believe he does not exist. He studies each and everyone of us and our tendencies towards good and evil and then he tempts us.
‘My advice to young people would be to watch out for nightclubs because the path is always the same: alcohol, sex, drugs and Satanic sects.’
It is not the first time that Father Amorth has raised eyebrows with his forthright views - last year he said that the ongoing child sex scandals rocking the Catholic Church were evidence that ‘the Devil was at work in the Vatican.’
[QUOTE]‘Satan studies each and everyone of us and our tendencies towards good and evil and then he tempts us’
While in 2006, Father Amorth, who was ordained a priest in 1954, gave an interview to Vatican Radio in which he said that Nazi leader Adolf Hitler and Russian dictator Josef Stalin were both possessed by the Devil.
According to secret Vatican documents recently released the then wartime Pope Pius XII attempted a ‘long distance exorcism’ of Hitler but it failed to have any effect.
It is also not the first time that Father Amorth, who is president of the International Association of Exorcists, has spoken out against Harry Potter saying in the past that it opens children’s minds to dabbling with the occult and black magic.
Horrific: Satan at work in the 1973 film starring Linda Blair which is perhaps unsurprisingly Father Amorth’s favourite film
Today Vanda Vanni, of the Italian Yoga Association, said:'A Satanic practice? Pardon the pun but that is an accusation that is neither in Heaven or on earth. Father Amorth’s accusation is completely without foundation.
'It is an outrageous thing to say - yoga is not a religion but a spiritual discipline. It is about freedom and a search to find one’s inner self. It does not touch religion and has nothing to do with Satanic sects nor does it encourage people to join them.
Giorgio Furlan, who runs the Yoga Academy in Rome, said`:'There are some paths of yoga which do lead towards Hinduism but other paths are more philosophical but their is no direct link with religion and certainly no link with Satanism.
'To say such things shows you have no idea of what you are talking about - yoga controls violent impulses of the nervous system and subconscious - to be honest with me it had the effect of bringing me closer to Christianity and in particular the Catholic Church which I had abandoned as a youngster.
[/QUOTE]
THREAD: Yoga
THREAD: Exorcism
THREAD: Harry Potter
It sounds to me like that Father Amorth needs an exorcism himself (is he even still alive anymore?). Those who are religiously self-righteous and point the finger at others as ‘in league with the devil’ never consider that three of their own fingers are pointing right back at themselves. If he sees ‘the devil’ behind every bush, around every corner and within every person with an opinion or belief system that is different from his own, then the problem is within himself, and he really needs to look in the mirror.
The Vatican-backed International Association of Exorcists
They should offer an online course.
Vatican to hold exorcist training course after ‘rise in possessions’
Critics warn exorcism can be a form of spiritual abuse as priests report jump in possession claims
Harriet Sherwood
@harrietsherwood
Fri 30 Mar 2018 09.00 EDT Last modified on Fri 30 Mar 2018 10.46 EDT
A still from the 1973 film The Exorcist. A Christian thinktank said exorcisms were a booming industry in the UK, particularly among Pentecostal churches. Photograph: Rex/Shutterstock
The Vatican is to hold a training course for priests in exorcism next month amid claims that demands for deliverance from demonic possession have greatly increased across the the world.
The Vatican-backed International Association of Exorcists, which represents more than 200 Catholic, Anglican and Orthodox priests, said the increase represented a pastoral emergency.
According to a priest from Sicily, the number of people in Italy claiming to be possessed had tripled to 500,000 a year, and an Irish priest has said demand for exorcisms has risen exponentially.
Last year, the Christian thinktank Theos reported that exorcisms were a booming industry in the UK, particularly among Pentecostal churches.
But some warn that deliverance ministry can be a form of spiritual abuse. Critics also say LGBT people and those with mental health issues are targeted for deliverance in the belief that their sexuality or psychiatric problems are the result of demonic possession.
The Vatican training course, which will be held at the Pontifical Athenaeum Regina Apostolorum in Rome between 16-21 April, will focus on exorcism and the prayer of liberation, a prayer commonly used for deliverance from possession.
The fight against the evil one started at the origin of the world, and is destined to last until the end of the world, Fr Cesare Truqui, one of the speakers, told Vatican News.
But today we are at a stage crucial in history: many Christians no longer believe in [the devils] existence, few exorcists are appointed and there are no more young priests willing to learn the doctrine and practice of liberation of souls.
Fr Benigno Palilla, an exorcist from Sicily who reported a tripling of demonic possession cases on the island, acknowledged the issue was controversial, but added: The demoniacs suffer a lot.
Training in deliverance was essential, he told Vatican Radio. A self-taught exorcist certainly makes errors. I will say more: it would also take a period of apprenticeship, as happens for many professionals.
In Ireland, Fr Pat Collins said he had been inundated, almost daily, with people seeking help to deal with what they believed to be demonic possession and other evil, and called for more training in exorcism.
Its only in recent years that the demand has risen exponentially, he told the Irish Catholic. What Im finding out desperately, is people who in their own minds believe rightly or wrongly that theyre afflicted by an evil spirit.
I think in many cases they wrongly think it, but when they turn to the church, the church doesnt know what to do with them.
Pope Francis has said if a priest becomes aware of genuine spiritual disturbances he must not hesitate to refer the issue to those who, in the diocese, are charged with this delicate and necessary ministry, namely, exorcists.
The Church of England offers guidelines on deliverance which say that for some people going through times of suffering and anxiety, or when distressed by what seem to be continuing experiences of evil within or around them it may be right to ask for Gods saving help through the churchs deliverance ministry.
The guidelines, which were updated in 2012, say caution must be exercised and the ministry of exorcism and deliverance may only be exercised by a priest authorised by the diocesan bishop.
Such priests should be trained in deliverance and should not minister alone. They should be covered by adequate insurance, the document says.
Language, body language and touch should be courteous and considerate No one should receive ministry against their will.
The guidelines say doctors, psychologists and psychiatrists should be consulted where appropriate, and that deliverance should be followed up with continuing pastoral care and should be done with a minimum of publicity.
According to Anne Richards, the C of Es national adviser on such issues: Exorcism in a technical sense is incredibly rare. I dont think Ive ever come across a case thats been authorised.
Each of the C of Es 42 dioceses has at least one person experienced and trained in deliverance, she said.
The church was extremely concerned that deliverance and healing should be undertaken in collaboration with professionals, such as doctors, and in the context of good safeguarding practice, she said.
But, she added, I accept in some cases people get together and do something ad hoc. It shouldnt happen it needs to be a proper process.
According to Christianity and Mental Health, a report by Theos, demand in the UK is being partly driven by immigrant communities and Pentecostal churches which are very open about their exorcism services.
Ben Ryan, its author, said charismatic and Pentecostal churches, particularly in areas with large west African communities, were advertising healings and exorcism outside their premises.
But, he said, some Christians are sometimes treating mental health issues as if everything is spiritual. So if someone tells a church leader they are suffering from depression, sometimes the response is that everything can be treated with prayer. The extreme end of that is exorcism.
The report quoted one chaplain, who said he had never seen anything I would say that looked like demonic possession, but Ive seen plenty of people who have been told thats what theyre experiencing by other Christians.
Priests in the US have also reported a growing demand for exorcisms in recent years.
The shortage of clergy trained in exorcism has led to a growing number of independent operators in Europe, who will rid people and properties of demons for up to 500 a time, according to the Economist.