Master TMW was a vicious mofo back in his youth.
Yeah, I have his Distance Learning tapes from years ago but no one at Tat Wong is returning emails to tell me is the program is still in existance. I was told last year they were coming back with new stuff this month but no responses lately.
So Im looking into Doc Fai Wong but dont want to duplicate so Im giving Tat Wong a chance first.
Their material would be different regardless.
I’m not going to get into specifics, because it’s not my lane, but it probably isn’t too good to study from both Master TMW and GM DFW. Conflict of interests.
Forms, Fighting & CLF Yat Ga
good CLF is good CLF, like my Hing Di deeperthantao put it to me in a recent email. “All killer, no filler…”
I agreed with Ex-J in his innitial post in terms of combination training. For tournament fighting(what ever level of contact) the most important element of CLF is to be able to “run your horse” thru at least three to four movemnts in sequence and remain on a good fighting position and maintian good structure, balance & root. Also having an experienced fighter for a Sifu is really the key, and having the personality to want to fight and really to hurt your opponent. And fighting lots obviously, but then fighters from every style know that.
CLFNole put it well a few months back ina post of his, that when teaching if you have a student with a bit of a mean streak it makes all the difference when they fight, watch the intensity of GM Lacey’s students and grand students on the recent Buck Sing Gwoon 6, no room for courtesy when fighting raw intensity and domination.
Compared to other CLF I have seen/been exposed to the major difference I see ( my own opinion as a practioner) is that Bak Hsing players rely on their aggresion to over wealm their opponets, also in terms of my understanding we release our power a little differently, that is to say our flavor is different. In terms of street fighting, my Sihing and sparring partner and I have a saying, if he’s still standing after four movements its becuase you made a mistake. This is something I’m sure Frank can agree to, no doubt:cool:
As far as forms, even though my sylabus is limited, maybe 7 or 8 CLF sets the majorty of movements repeat in all of them except one which is a stand alone palm set. Pick one or two that make sense and work for you, for me Di Sup Jee Kuen to train the stances, gung & breath coordination (as it is a very long and physically taxing traditonal set) & Lien Whan Jeen Kuen as it trains our pattened running combinations, cutting angles and continuos “lien whan jing” cyclical and returning energy as well as the root and the “six harmonies coordiantions” ie the coordination of the hands & feet, knees and elbows, shoulders and hips. It comes down to, do you know how to read the forms? If I have one set and don’t understnd it, no matter how hard I train it, it’ll never do me any good. If I have a thousand and I understand five applications of every movement in each form, then what is the problem with that? We have a limited sylabus because we believe that it is hard enough to train for the ring and work one form to perfection let alone several, our own philosophy, not uncommon in other styles or lineages. Read a quote from one of the boards antagonizers, which I totally agreed with. “You traditional guys talk to much and don’t fight enough” I’m sure all the fighters on hear can agree to that, palying forms all day long can kinda be like talking to much, Mark Ho put it well in his recent youtube interview, “forms are just the lips flapping and the arms moving” (not an exact quote) There is a cool quote on that Vid that Sifu Gus posted a while back on TCMA in south east Asia “In the school there is a sign that says, talk less, train more”
Like I said, good CLF is good CLF and bad CLF is just f-ing bad, as I get older, have started teaching, competing more and meeting more practioners I am more into the brotherhood side of things and mutual exchange. Though we strongly emphaisise that we our unique in my lineage, GM Lun Jee always told my Sifu that there is only ONE CLF.
Pce. 
Satori Science, to such a post, one can only agree.
[QUOTE=Satori Science;835100]good CLF is good CLF, like my Hing Di deeperthantao put it to me in a recent email. “All killer, no filler…”
I agreed with Ex-J in his innitial post in terms of combination training. For tournament fighting(what ever level of contact) the most important element of CLF is to be able to “run your horse” thru at least three to four movemnts in sequence and remain on a good fighting position and maintian good structure, balance & root. Also having an experienced fighter for a Sifu is really the key, and having the personality to want to fight and really to hurt your opponent. And fighting lots obviously, but then fighters from every style know that.
CLFNole put it well a few months back ina post of his, that when teaching if you have a student with a bit of a mean streak it makes all the difference when they fight, watch the intensity of GM Lacey’s students and grand students on the recent Buck Sing Gwoon 6, no room for courtesy when fighting raw intensity and domination.
Compared to other CLF I have seen/been exposed to the major difference I see ( my own opinion as a practioner) is that Bak Hsing players rely on their aggresion to over wealm their opponets, also in terms of my understanding we release our power a little differently, that is to say our flavor is different. In terms of street fighting, my Sihing and sparring partner and I have a saying, if he’s still standing after four movements its becuase you made a mistake. This is something I’m sure Frank can agree to, no doubt:cool:
As far as forms, even though my sylabus is limited, maybe 7 or 8 CLF sets the majorty of movements repeat in all of them except one which is a stand alone palm set. Pick one or two that make sense and work for you, for me Di Sup Jee Kuen to train the stances, gung & breath coordination (as it is a very long and physically taxing traditonal set) & Lien Whan Jeen Kuen as it trains our pattened running combinations, cutting angles and continuos “lien whan jing” cyclical and returning energy as well as the root and the “six harmonies coordiantions” ie the coordination of the hands & feet, knees and elbows, shoulders and hips. It comes down to, do you know how to read the forms? If I have one set and don’t understnd it, no matter how hard I train it, it’ll never do me any good. If I have a thousand and I understand five applications of every movement in each form, then what is the problem with that? We have a limited sylabus because we believe that it is hard enough to train for the ring and work one form to perfection let alone several, our own philosophy, not uncommon in other styles or lineages. Read a quote from one of the boards antagonizers, which I totally agreed with. “You traditional guys talk to much and don’t fight enough” I’m sure all the fighters on hear can agree to that, palying forms all day long can kinda be like talking to much, Mark Ho put it well in his recent youtube interview, “forms are just the lips flapping and the arms moving” (not an exact quote) There is a cool quote on that Vid that Sifu Gus posted a while back on TCMA in south east Asia “In the school there is a sign that says, talk less, train more”
Like I said, good CLF is good CLF and bad CLF is just f-ing bad, as I get older, have started teaching, competing more and meeting more practioners I am more into the brotherhood side of things and mutual exchange. Though we strongly emphaisise that we our unique in my lineage, GM Lun Jee always told my Sifu that there is only ONE CLF.
Pce. :D[/QUOTE]
Satori Insight is your new name:) Thanks for that post, there is many good ideas in what you wrote…Run your horse…does that imply drills shifting through the horse stance?. horse to cat to bow to twist to horse, etc?..never heard that term before.
Cheers,
James
[QUOTE=diego;835255]Satori Insight is your new name:) Thanks for that post, there is many good ideas in what you wrote…Run your horse…does that imply drills shifting through the horse stance?. horse to cat to bow to twist to horse, etc?..never heard that term before.
Cheers,
[/QUOTE]
Your welcome, glad it was well recieved. As far as running horse it is tough to explain via typing. It is our own way of using the footwork to evade and control the opponet. while it can involve and stance per say it is our “fighting horse” stance that is used in sequsesive combinatoins while litterally Running towards and around the opponent and still maintaing a tall, but stucturally sound stance and root.
check this vid it may help, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLNWHtHH3yY
cheers,
[QUOTE=Satori Science;835274]Your welcome, glad it was well recieved. As far as running horse it is tough to explain via typing. It is our own way of using the footwork to evade and control the opponet. while it can involve and stance per say it is our “fighting horse” stance that is used in sequsesive combinatoins while litterally Running towards and around the opponent and still maintaing a tall, but stucturally sound stance and root.
check this vid it may help, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLNWHtHH3yY
cheers,[/QUOTE]
Makes sence. You have kick range, and then punching range, and then the clinch…a good example of running the horse is maintain punch range-structure while pummelling him through the clinch range…the whole basics in the hop gar I do is all about using the side bow stance to ram through him shuffling through while delivering long arms at the clinchimg range, and then as he is broken you clinch and drop down with him to put him to sleep.
You know what shocked me most about the video, is that the running horse and what you can do with it IMO was always something to keep quiet and NOT let others know outside your school. But thats the old way.
But the running horse is great, at the Hung Sing Kwoon under my sifu we call them “FIGHTING HORSES” because they stop becoming just a stance.
[QUOTE=hskwarrior;835330]You know what shocked me most about the video, is that the running horse and what you can do with it IMO was always something to keep quiet and NOT let others know outside your school. But thats the old way.
But the running horse is great, at the Hung Sing Kwoon under my Sifu we call them “FIGHTING HORSES” because they stop becoming just a stance.[/QUOTE]
Traditionally we have kept it quiet as well, but showing and explaining are two different things. Even for students of ours who have been around for years, this is still a very difficult tech. to use and apply. The traditional way worked in its context but times have changed, ie Youtube…
when we apply we call it running horse, the stance itself is the “fighting horse”
One,
Same Same, you say potato i say potahto…
But it’s something i think is not too focused on with some schools.
But i love the look of pain on peoples faces when you execute things properly. The feel of joints bending in opposite directions is theraputic to me…Just kidding.
But it’s one great way to take the attention away from your opponent to create more openings.
oh well, what we refer to as running horse is always in movement…but when applying it we call it fighting horses because it takes on a whole different purpose.
So if I enjoy hurting those who deserve it…does this mean I should stop doing CLF, Frank?
NO! that means you need MORE CLF!!!