I am new to Wing Chun. I was wondering how other people’s Wing Chun classes are structured in terms of conditioning and skills.
In my class, we seem to do A LOT of conditioning. Kicking bags, push-ups,ect. My classes are 1.5 hours long…at least 45 minutes of it is pure conditioning. In the skills part, we are usually partnered up and do things like: A will attack B with a round punch. B will defend with a Pak Sau and counter with a kick and 5 punches.
Is this typical of most Wing Chun schools? I was under the impression that there was a lot of forms training in CMA. I have only had four classes so far. I have seen the Sil Lim Tao once.
Just curious.
BTW the conditioning is killing me! Holy cow these guys are in good shape!
:eek:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=“-1”>quote:</font><HR> we seem to do A LOT of conditioning. Kicking bags, push-ups, [/quote]
In my school we dont so that.Push ups isnt wing chun.Lots of schools train like yours do and stress working out, but my sifu focuses on wing chun and not conditioning the body.He told me if i want to get in shape to do it on my own time because his school is for wing chun and only wing chun…
how many times a week do you train? if it’s only once or twice then that workout is the only work out some people are getting.
“Spectacular immaculate raps massacre cats like dracula bats, I’m snappin yer back cos I’m attackin the wack, duckin yer rapid attack, **** packin a gat, the mechanic of rap’ll give you panic attacks with his Satanical raps.” - Guess who.
I agree with you…working out and conditioning should’t be the main focus of class. I explain conditioning and go thru it several times with my students, but tell them that I will not waste their time in class doing this. This needs to be done at home on their own time.
Yes I agree with you. It seems to me that a great deal of class time is devoted to non-wing chun like activity. Even in our skills training last week my eyebrow went up when one person was to give a spinning back kick and the other was to defend against it. I guess it might be relevant in learning how to fight other styles…but correct me if I am wrong…wing chun doesn’t have a spinning back kick!
I believe as I think all of us here that training against styles/systems other than our own is the only way to learn real self-defense (what good does it do to learn to defend against only Wing Chunners?). Though I know a Wing Chun teacher who stated that after doing non-Wing Chun techniques against his students on a daily basis hour after hour that he felt his Wing Chun was suffering because of it. I would suggest training with people outside your system if and when you feel comfortable to do so. Though I also believe it is your Sifu’s responsibility to explain how your techniques work against various attacks of different styles.
Actually, I am beginning to wonder if I am in McChun..instead of Wing Chun. I arrived early one day for class and was able to see the “kung fu cardio kickboxing” that the school runs to attract the aerobic-types. The routine that they were doing looked identical to the conditioning part (which lasts 45 minutes) of my regular class.
You spend your money to learn wing chun, not do aerobics! Can you learn wing chun on your own? No. Anything other than doing wing chun in a wing chun class just wastes $$$. (unless maybe its qigong or something) There’s plenty of stuff to do without having to make it a gym class.
I agree with Kungfu Cowboy. You don’t even have to be very fit to learn Wing Chun. Your time in class is limited. Best to spend it on just learning Wing Chun without the padding and if you want to get fit, do it outside of class time.
“Even in our skills training last week my eyebrow went up when one person was to give a spinning back kick and the other was to defend against it.”
This is funny. On occasion, when we are doing our three man drills, I will throw a spin kick against the guy defending. I would never use this in a real fight, its ridiculous. I throw these in to remind that the best response against a spin kick is a foot to the arse.
I completely agree. If I ever saw someone turn their back to me in a fight I would rush em.
That is why I was so surprised. It is such a useless move. I didn’t know why we were being taught it in the first place.
as i do not train wing chun i cannot help you in that department. but i would still like to offer my point of view on the other subject. i train in northern mantis. our class is an hour long, but it frequently runs about a half an our over. depending on what we are doing we do about a half an hour to 45 minutes of warmups, which can consist of all, some, or one of these. punches(differing types mind you), endurance stances, frogjumps and rockingpushups, and a few others. then we either learn forms or body coordinations or blocking and punching. mind you i have only been training for a few months so im sure in the more advanced class, there is more to it. the point i am trying to make is, just because you are not doing wing chun and getting a workout instead, dont assume that you are not training. physical fitness is VERY important to most kungfu styles. what is the point of knowing how to execute a perfect kick, if you have no power behind it. now im not saying that anyone elses teaching methods are wrong. just a little fitness, in an MA class, is a good thing in my opinion.
I don’t think anyone is disputing the fact that you get a work out in wing chun or any martial art. Getting a good workout and being fit is an integral part to being on top of your skills, but it certainly isn’t a prerequisite. (though I do wonder sometimes when a “master” has a huge belly)
Sometimes you will find teachers who use conditioning and warm ups to eat up time in class in order not to advance a student quickly, or just because the teacher’s knowledge is not that great. This is a rarity, but it does occur.
The classes I goto last 1 hour. I go three days a week.
We start every class with Sil Lim Tao. Normally after that Sifu will give us a specific drill to start with. He stops us every now and again for pointers or to change partners. He says he wants us to get a different feel for the chi. Also some times he will change the drill all together.
I have never had to do any physical conditioning or aerobics at school. This is not to say I do not get a workout. And all the punching and pac sau’s are conditioning my arms quite nicely.
It seems to me that the foundation building is up to the student: stance, horse, punch and other such stuff. They do correct you in school but you must take the responsibility of training them on yourself.
After seeing other styles, even training in some, I found it quite hard to believe that the student could have so much input and responsibility. Not just be mechanical and muscled.
Our usual class began with everyone (everyone being my 4-6 classmates and i) warming up on our own and going through our Sup Yee Sik (12 Forms) and Kuen To (Boxing Sets). Whatever we were working on at the time would be observed by our sifu (Siu Lien Tao at first, later other forms, dummy, weapons, etc.) and corrected. While he corrected one, the rest of us would keep practicing, some doing the sets over and over, some playing dummy or doing other Lien Gung Sik (Practice Work Forms like sand bag, etc.) After about an hour of that, we’d do an hour of Chi Sao (huen sao, luk sao, bong lap sao, etc.) and San Sao (separate applications). When we made mistakes, sifu would correct and we’d practice the corrections until we’d gotten them. Then we’d Yum Cha or Sik Ye Juk
As to the rest, IMHO, if you’re going to be doing any kind of training that is not specifically WCK (be it general conditioning, meditation, legal factors in self-defense, etc.) the sifu should independantly qualified in those areas. Otherwise, seek out a qualified personal trainer or other expert to work on those areas.
You said that your class runs for a total of 90 minutes but 45 minutes of it are pure conditioning.
Now, there is something wrong with this picture. Half of the class beign dedicated to conditioning isn’t right. Let’s all be honest here, were are in a wing chun class to learn wing chun or to be fit? I am personally fit because I have my routine (jogging, weight lifting) and I came to martial arts to learn how to defend my self.
I think your school may not be the best but if it is the only wing chun school in town then your best option is to stay.
Here is the routine that we have.
*2hrs class.
*15 to 20 minutes are dedicated to stretching and some conditioning.
*The class then continue to basic drills such as practicing footwork, hand movements and so on.
The next part of the class we trained with partners and practice offense and defense and we use combinations.
At the end of the class we finish with sium lim tao.
The focus of the class is really on “street defense”
is not something to be played with. Forms are SOOOOOOOOO important, in this respect. If you don’t have your forms down, don’t waste your time with conditioning, or you’ll hurt yourself over time.
IXIJoe KaveyIXI
