LB,
That was an inspired post. Too bad it was wasted on the likes of worblehead. I know your Si Gung and you would never know he had a stroke.
Krazy Filipino,
T’ol, pinoy rin ako!!! I was just curious what style you study? Who is your sifu and from what lineage are your from? As for myself, I am a practitioner of Bajiquan, Piquazhang, and Seven Star mantis. My lineage comes from Sifu Su Yu Chang, Sifu Adam Hsu, and the late Grandmaster Liu Yun Qiao. Anyways, hope to hear from you and ingatz!
Pao
You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet.
The last time I was working on this
my computer internet connection timed out
and booted me out and I lost my reply posting.
I’ll try to be quicker and not so wordy
this time around.
This is specifically geared to the
chat member WORD.
Usually I don’t like to speak bad to someone
that I am not familiar with, however,
either you haven’t been taught properly
by your WHF lineage Sifu or you’re not
a good student.
Also, you’ve never answered some of the other
member’s questions - especially the ones related to why / how / what your reasons are,
what your skill level is, for making your statements about Sifu Lai.
Please provide us with this information.
Nor have you directly identified who your
WHF lineage Mantis Sifu is.
Why don’t you do so ?
Also, it is very unusal that you don’t
understand about Chut Sing Gwat Sao
and need to have this “translated in English”.
I don’t know whether or not to expect an
answer to this posting being that you’ve
not done so to some of the other member’s
questions.
Anyway, just my input / questions about this
matter.
Thanks.
Word, I request that you stop this idiocy on the behalf of your sifu, whomever it may be(If you actually have a sifu).
No sifu should have to deal with a disrespectfull student as yourself.
It is quite obvious by your posting that while you seem to have a grasp on some of what you are saying, you have not actually participated in a Lai seminar, nor do you have a full grasp of what you are talking about.
Anyone can talk a good game when the masks are on…
[This message has been edited by BeiTangLang (edited 07-24-2000).]
EricsepIshii,
You made my point. As you know , “chut sing gwat sao” is a very basic move and can be found in Sup Ba Sao (18 elders) which is a very basic form . It can also be found at the end of Bung Bo (crushing step) the mother form of all northern mantis styles (w/ the exception of Wah Lum)as well as in many other forms. You can do do it in line drills alternating left and right sides with Tong Choy. It is interesting to see that such an “expert” would not even know what this means.
Sorry Word, but you need to fess up. 
Peace
[This message has been edited by loki (edited 07-24-2000).]
Explain to me where that movement is in bong bo and I will be delighted to explain the application. Is it the 7 star chop the waist? At the end of bong bo? After this movement that you won’t transalate is it a left hook and a left backfist? Followed by a left mantis trap, and right punch?
Well here..
My right foot is at 45 degrees. My left foot is in the 7 star stance. My left hand is pulling the guy. My right hand is chopping his waist or kidney I would be pulling the guy towards my left shoulder in a downward motion.
If Wing Lam had 7* mantis videos out, that would be the exact app he would display. It’s in every book, video and article ever published. It is also the most simplistic and benign application that exists for that movement and the one a mantis shi fu would teach to a student that they didn’t really value…
Word, I still wonder why you haven’t responded to Loki’s last post.
Just curious
If you have nothing to do, don’t do it here!
word is an IDIOT
In Bung Bo it’s 2 moves before Tong Long Bow Sim.
Peace
I have read that Brendan Lai is also a master of Tai Chi Mantis. Is that true? If so, does he sell any vidoes on it?
Loki,
You keep saying these Chinese names. If you would actually translate them and explain then we would actually get somewhere. Get it in your head that I need english translation.
This is reply to the question by
the chat member Curious.
Sifu Lai is not a Tai Chi Mantis Sifu.
He had known Master Chu Chuk Kai who was
a very famous Tai Chi Praying Mantis Sifu.
Sifu Lai is specifically a Wong Hon Fun
lineage Sifu.
As far as I know, Sifu Lai isn’t selling
any videos concerning
Tai Chi Praying Mantis.
Hope this helps, however, you should have
asked this as a separate post rather than
be a part of this thread that Word started.
Thanks.
Word,
It really is not important. If you were really serious and knowledgeable about the mantis style surely you would know even the most simplest of terms whether in english or in chinese. You hear these terms constantly almost from day one. Before you criticize other people and the way they do their art you should know a little something about the style which you profess to know so well. I wish you could see that I am really not trying to knock you. The problem is that you pose all these questions to our fellow posters and continually dis them but yet you still remain a mystery to everyone. You have never answered any of the questions which have been asked of you. Why not? If you and your Sifu are that good, why not let us know who you are? You should be very proud that you have a Sifu that is ‘better’ than all of our Sifu and tell everyone who he is.
With regards to the terms…and let me point out that I did say the last two moves before Tong Long Bow Sim (which you definitely should have known) and the first move in Sup Ba Sao ( you mean you don’t know the name of 7 * mantis’ most basic form?)I will gladly translate for you.
1-Bung Bo (crushing step) Not the most basic but normally the first form taught in the system
2-Sup Ba Sao (18 elders) Usually the 2nd form taught. My Sifu teaches it 1st because it is a very basic form compared to Bung Bo.
3-Tong Long Bow Sim (Mantis catches cicada) A very well known term even by those outside mantis. It is the finishing move in the majority of the forms .
4- Chut Sing (7 Star/stance) You should have at least known that.
5- Gwat/Diu Sao (hook hand) The mantis hook . It is not the hook itself as that is Diu. It is the action that is done w/Diu.
So , Chut Sing Gwat Sao is the action of hooking the hand w/ a mantis claw/hand while in a 7 star stance. It is the very 1st move in 18 elders which is followed by a chopping fist and 2 moves before the end of Crushing step which is followed by a straight punch in a 7 star stance.
Hope I have been very clear and please think about what I said.
Peace
I don’t need to think about what you said. In 18 ancestors the mantis hook is done with my left hand in an outside circular motion. The real quality of that movement is in the snap of the wrist. Catches the cicada is in the beginning of bong bo and at the end. I won’t explain this application because I know not many people know it. All I can say is that I end up trapping both of your arms with my left hand and have my right hand free to do whatever I want. What are your questions on bong bo?
- cat stance right punch
- jump back into a cat stance, mantis catches cicada
- crushing step, left palm strike
- jump and righ tgrab with left punch, crane stance
- elbow, kneeling stance(locks the guys elbow)
- both arms at the left, right kick to the left
7 horsestance, arm bar
8, left mantis hook, right hammer strike - 1-2-3o move
10, cat stance take down ( looks like uppercut) - left palm strike
- step up in right front stance, right punch,
13, go back to horsestnace, arm bar - crushing step, left grab, chop the waist
- shuffle up, left uppercut
- crane stance …and SO ON!
Wow! You were just waiting for me huh? Ok, so don’t think about it. You show the quality of your Kung Fu by the way you carry yourself and the way you talk. Let me tell you, it is very low caliber.
Let’s see now, you left out the straight right punch in a right bow and arrow in between moves # 3 & 4. In move # 5 , locking the elbow is a valid interpretation of the technique but very basic. Can you think of anything else that can be done there? In move # 10, I could see the action of the hand as a possible throw/takedown but it would not be the natural thing to do and since most of the techniques flow from one move to the next that would not fit in with the context with which it is being done in the sequence of the form. “Looks like an uppercut”? Why, that is exactly what it is my friend.
I’ll be happy to discuss any of this further with you but look this over first and and see what you can come up with.
Peace
[This message has been edited by loki (edited 07-26-2000).]
[This message has been edited by loki (edited 07-26-2000).]
[This message has been edited by loki (edited 07-26-2000).]
It looks like an uppercut but it’s actually a takedown. Most people do an uppercut but I guess that’s alright. The locking the elbow move is from 2 man bong bo. Yes, I learned the 2 man version as well. I was just simply going through the movements to show that I know that form. I hate typing about technqiues so I won’t go into extreme detail. You can’t judge someone’s martial arts ability by the way they talk. There are many sifus who think they are the shit and show it too. Some of them are actually good. Are you saying that good sifus don’t have egos? Bruce Lee was good and he had a big ego.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=“-1”>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kookyguy:
word you idiot Brenden Lai had a huge storke some years back its incredible he can do kung fu at all.[/quote]
I had heard the same thing about his stroke. About a year later, I saw him shopping at a dept. store. His face was reddish/purple, his arm was limited in movement, and his speech was slow but deliberate. A few more years passed and he was talking normally and he had the gait of a young man - you would not have known he even had a stroke.
Having been acquainted w/BL since 1976, I suspect his stroke may have been dietary. In those days, who knew about cholesterol and nutritrous dieting. Your sifu may remember that his wife, sister, and BL often ate a meal of fatty soup noodles w/very little veggies. This was when the kwoon was on Divisadero St. and Al Novak use to help BL sell martial art supplies there. Today, we know the diet is very important w/serious training. He must have a great determination and physical therapist to come out of his paralysis.
Bruce Lee would have told you to your face if he thought you were no good.
You may know the ‘ling’ for two man bung bo but that is the basic version for doing 2 man forms. Ling are simply ‘matching’ forms. This means that your partner simply places his arms w/ open hands in certain places throughout the routine while you apply the techniques. There is a more advanced version
( can’t remember the term ) which has both people doing the techniques from the form on each other. This version is more alive and more practical. Like I said before , the elbow lock application is ok but remember that you are going from one extreme to the other. You are going from a high position , Bak Sae Tou Sik ( White snake spits out it’s tongue) which you translate as grab & punch in a crane stance to a low kneeling stance w/ an elbow. It makes more sense to grab and strike then immediately go into the kneeling stance and strike the opp.'s lead inner thigh w/ the elbow. The following move is a bong choy ( crushing/back fist ). In keeping w/ the sequence of the form after the elbow to the thigh you can apply a single leg takedown w/ the bong choy move.
The uppercut move is the end portion of a trapping sequence. After the grab and hammerfist, the opp. blocks. You do the 1-2-3 or hook, grapple, pluck sequence. Assuming this is also blocked (the logical defense here being a pak sao) you would proceed to pull in ( your outer arm is on the opp.'s inner arm) as you slide the uppercut in. To say this technique is “actually” this or that is to limit yourself to the possibilities that are available to you. It is not so much the techniques that are important but the principles. Mantis is very, very high on principles and cannot be limited to just one way of doing something. Oh, and BTW, now that you know what move I was talking about, how would you use it?
Peace
Back to the original statement of the thread; how do you know what Sigung Lai does Word?? Have you ever been tossed to the ground by him? Thrown into a lock by him? Stood there going through a series of movements with a fellow student while he is there watching with an evil grin saying “Faster! More power!! Bah!!! You would already be dead!”? I doubt it. I would venture to say that he can handle himself quite well even today. He has a very short & powerful jing that he uses quite well. Which is why I ask you, WORD, what do you base your opinion on?