I learned them from a white guy and he does not teach the chinese terminology. I was wondering if someone could tell me which punches are which in chinese/ english . Thanks.
[QUOTE=tattooedmonk;836045]I learned them from a white guy…[/QUOTE]
Funny. 
May help everyone if you give the English names you were taught imo. This ‘white guy’ did teach the English names didn’t he? 
on punches
Dont know who the "white"guy is or what he does.. Classifications can vary…
and context is relevant.
here is one set that I am reasonably familiar with:
Kuen = fist or punch
8 families of Wing Chun punches are
- chair kuen = pulling vertical punch
- chaap kuen = low punch
- ngoi faan kuen = inside whip punch
- hoi faan kuen = outside whip punch
- doi gok kuen = diagonal punch
- chour kuen = hammerfist
- joong-lo kuen = drilling punch
- tai kuen = raising punch
There are variations depending on structural and positioning details.
Back to the thread.Dont know whether it will go south.
joy chaudhuri
joy chaudhuri
Hi Joy, I’ll look up the Romanizations for the punches you wrote. There are no “r” sounds in Cantonese.
Right Phil
I just say cha kuen or something like that.
joy chaudhuri
[QUOTE=Vajramusti;836083]Kuen = fist or punch
8 families of Wing Chun punches are,[/QUOTE]
Some familiar terms in your post Joy, with or without the right Romanization! I really don’t know if this is what tattooedmonk had in mind, as I too have heard many terms for the fist depending on it’s purpose.
Chaap Kuen (threading fist) is very common in Lee Shing family I believe.
This white guy here has only heard of one punch! It’s vertical or something thereof and it (usually) goes to the centreline/nose.
Best,
Kenton Sefcik
couch sez
This white guy here has only heard of one punch! It’s vertical or something thereof and it (usually) goes to the centreline/nose.
The “vertical” punch is the foundation punch- developed via the slt stage . It gives rise to other punches depending on gates, levels and the ma-s for further development…and evolves
depending on whether a live person is before you and what else is happening in relationships of positions, distance and vectors.
joy chaudhuri ( not a white guy-but it doesnt matter-as Gertrude Stein probably meant or should have said- a punch is a punch is a punch <g>)
[QUOTE=Phil Redmond;836084]Hi Joy, I’ll look up the Romanizations for the punches you wrote. There are no “r” sounds in Cantonese.[/QUOTE]
I thought, in the yale romanization, that an ‘r’ at the end of a word was silent and indicated a certain pronounciation…but my Cantonese is poor.
serioiusly
let’s not be RIDICIROUS
[QUOTE=AmanuJRY;836392]I thought, in the yale romanization, that an ‘r’ at the end of a word was silent and indicated a certain pronounciation…but my Cantonese is poor.[/QUOTE]
Nope, no 'r’s in Yale Romanization. That’s the one I learned in college and our Prof. who was from Canton, was adamant that there is no ‘r’ in Cantonese.
[QUOTE=Phil Redmond;836471]Nope, no 'r’s in Yale Romanization. That’s the one I learned in college and our Prof. who was from Canton, was adamant that there is no ‘r’ in Cantonese.[/QUOTE]
Where did the R in Gar for arts like Hung Gar come from ?
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;836475]Where did the R in Gar for arts like Hung Gar come from ?[/QUOTE]
It’s Hung Ga, not Hung Gar. Think of it like this. People who didn’t know how to Romanize the Chinese language just used approximations. I will say it again. THERE ARE NO “R” SOUNDS IN THE CANTONESE DIALECT. There are “r” sounds in Mandarin.
Yale University’s Romanization is considered one of the best for Cantonese. The U.S. Dept. of Foreign Service uses it. That’s the one I learned. I’ve even heard a story that Bruce Lee made one of the writters on The Game of Death mad so he added lots of “r” sounds to Bruce’s dialogue to mess him up. My Sifu uses Larp sao but says lop sao. A native Chinese speaker doesn’t learn Chinese with Roman letters so they basically write what they think a westerner might understand. Remember Lethal Weapon 4
Uncle Benny: Flied lice? It’s fried rice, you plick. That was a play on the fact that Cantonese has no ‘r’.
But what has all this no ‘r’ madness got to do with the 8 Punches of Wing Chun??!!
[QUOTE=LoneTiger108;836636]But what has all this no ‘r’ madness got to do with the 8 Punches of Wing Chun??!! [/QUOTE]See romanization of punch names in post 4.
I teach one punch just as I teach only one kick, the various applications and directions of using the energy of punches and kicks in my mind do not make the the essence of the punch of kick different.
The mechanics of the basic punch/kick remain simple and repetitive, I teach many methods of getting the punch/kick to the point of contact and as I focus on the application of energy in strikes almost at the point of contact, the path of the fist/foot does not make the punch/kick any different, otherwise we would have an infinite number of punches and kicks from all angles and intents, down to the 360 degrees of a circle and each degree divided into the 60 minutes and each minute 60 seconds.
Keep it simple and a simple mind like mine can remember when it hits the fan what to do!
Either punch or kick the person trying to inflict injury upon me.
Asking me to flick through my Hong Kong book of Kung Fu to enact the most specific punch/kick to use in any given scenario, in my view takes up brain time with thinking rather than reacting and therefore leaves you vulnerable to seasoned fighters with fast hands and experience.
As far as the rest of the discussion goes I prefer to keep my “R¨s” out of harms way if possible. :eek:
[QUOTE=CFT;836637]See romanization of punch names in post 4.[/QUOTE]
I did see Joys post CFT, but still can’t understand what all the fuss is about with regards to the 'r’s? It really doesn’t matter imo, as you know, we should be comparing characters! When I learnt we were specifically told not to follow any standardized versions of Cantonese/English as we hadn’t formerly studied at college/uni. We were encouraged to ‘create our own’ as long as it helped us in our pronounciation.
The list Joy supplied is good, it’s just not what I would consider to be Wing Chuns ‘signature’ punches. Are there really eight? Interesting…
[QUOTE=LoneTiger108;836697]I did see Joys post CFT, but still can’t understand what all the fuss is about with regards to the 'r’s? It really doesn’t matter imo, as you know, we should be comparing characters! When I learnt we were specifically told not to follow any standardized versions of Cantonese/English as we hadn’t formerly studied at college/uni. We were encouraged to ‘create our own’ as long as it helped us in our pronounciation.
The list Joy supplied is good, it’s just not what I would consider to be Wing Chuns ‘signature’ punches. Are there really eight? Interesting…[/QUOTE]
You are right. We should be discussing the punches but since you brought
up the importance of language and pronuonciation I have to clarify my
position. Each to his own opinion with regard to pronounciation of WC terms. To you it may not be important and that’s all good but I come from a background in NYC’s Chinatown where the prevailing opinion was the Westerners were not to be accepted or
weren’t able to get the nuances of Chinese martial arts. One of the things used against us was language. I was lucky Cantonese classes were offered at my college/univ. I’m a member of the ACA (Association of Chinese Americans), so I’m in contact with lots of Chinese. I usually get a look of disbelief when people find out that I teach a Chinese art. They just don’t think we can do it. I’m sure others here have experienced that same thing. One of my Chinese students loves to tell other Chinese that I’m his Sifu so we see the looks on their faces. We get a laugh out of it.
When I do something I want to do it right. When I talk about WC I want to be able to know what I saying and not to sound like some lo fan who hasn’t a clue.
Now this is simply my POV and I know that others have theirs. I apologize if this thread has gone OT.
My Chinese is basically non-existant, back in 1985 I attended a Wong Shun Leung seminar and after a discussion with the host Nino, my Sifu pulled me up asking why I said I did not know the fundemental “stay with what comes, follow what retreats and if nothing there attack”, I replied off course I knew it, the problem was Nino asked me if I knew these words in Chinese format and though I knew the meaning and practice I did not know it in Chinese.
I have stayed away from using Chinese terminology apart from the very basic terms because in my mind there is too much personalisation in the translations, I use the movemnts and theories of the forms to guide my thinking and teaching, but that is just my way.