7*Mantis Grandmaster?

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Northern Praying Mantis
1

Anyone ever heard of this guy?

http://www.chinwoomen.com/kaiuwepel.html

"Master Kai Uwe Pel was born in Recklinghausen, Germany in 1964. Kai Uwe Pel has been deeply involved in Chinese Martial Art since he began his formal training in Hong Kong at the age of sixteen. Since that time, he has studied with many noted Masters both in this country and in the Orient and has himself taught for more than 20 years.

While in Singapore, Kai Uwe Pel also took the opportunity to study with his respected Praying Mantis Kung Fu and Taijiquan Grandmaster Koh Kim Kok.

Traditional training in Master Koh’s class was very arduous. Students were expected to attend seven days a week, beginning with a class in the early morning and then between two and three hours in the evening. After many years, Master Pel was initiated as Master Koh’s disciple meaning that their relationship became as close as that of father and son.

Since starting to teach Kung Fu, Master Kai Uwe Pel has striven to not only pass on Praying Mantis in its traditional form but to ensure that his western students grasp the importance of the moral and philosophical teachings that ensure that this potentially lethal martial art is fully respected and that practitioners behave with respect towards the art, themselves and other people.

“My goal is to introduce Praying Mantis Kung Fu to as many people as possible, at the same time maintaining the high standards set by my own master and his predecessors,” Master Pel says. “I believe one of the most efficient ways of doing this is to teach students who are willing to dedicate their lives to learning Praying Mantis Kung Fu full-time”.

Today, Master Kai Uwe Pel still teaches a select group in Shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today."

2

“Today, Master Kai Uwe Pel still teaches a select group in Shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today.”

:rolleyes:

Skard1

3

Grand what?

Re:

Today, Master Kai Uwe Pel still teaches a select group in Shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today."

‘cough-cough’, awkward silence etc…

                                                                      B.T
4

I take it this guy is bogus? Anyone heard of this “World Famous” master? :smiley:

5

Dont know if he is bogus, but this line:

"He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today"

is worthy of a…“ok sure there buddy”

Skard1

6

Hi Brendan and All,

<<<Grand what?
Re:

Today, Master Kai Uwe Pel still teaches a select group in Shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today."

‘cough-cough’, awkward silence etc…

B.T>>>>

No argument from here. * I think this is a first * :D:D:D

Brad,

His name does pop up from time to time. This time is the first time that I am aware of his claim to be a GM and inheritor of LGY’s style which is an enormous claim by any measure. Isn’t there a difference between practitioner and a inheritor? I also don’t know how they define most knowledgeable. A lot of people on this board are very knowledgeable if not some of the most knowledgeable of their respective styles of PM. The PM history article that they have doesn’t impress me as having the most knowledgeable insight. I mean anyone can find that kind of info on the net these days. Since I am a lowly practitioner of a quite different lineage, I guess it is up to their higher ups in their own lineage to figure it out and clarify.

Warm regards

Mantis108

7

Why LGY? He could’ve just said that he was the true inheritor of Wong Long’s system and that Wong Long taught him while he was tripping on Peyote. It’s amazing how many sub 40 year old white guys that LGY taught, considering how dead he was when this guy was born.

I don’t know, PM is getting waaayyyy tooooo political. Thank my lucky 7 stars that I’m somewhat isolated from all that BS.

“Grand Master” is becomming somewhat of a false term almost as much as the word “sifu” has become. Crapulence, pure crapulence…

8

Today Master Kai uwe Pei still teaches a select group in shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in the Northern Praying Mantis Kung fu Circles and without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis Master alive today…

Maybe It’s just me but I was under the impression that Mr.Steve Cottrell & Mr. Jon Funk were the most knowledgeable not to mention the leading authority’s on the 7Star Mantis System.

In all fairness I would like to hear what Mr. Cottrell & Mr. Funk have to say about Mr. Kai uwe pei & his claims of being the most knowledeable in the 7 Star Mantis System etc.etc…

Since Mr. Cottrell & Mr. Funk are Legends in there own mind’s :rolleyes:

9

… “Today, Master Kai Uwe Pel still teaches a select group in Shanghai. He is regarded as a living legend in Northern Praying Mantis Kung Fu circles and is without doubt the most knowledgeable Praying Mantis master alive today.”

Tall claims.

UM.

10

small fish, very big pond…

Maybe It’s just me but I was under the impression that Mr.Steve Cottrell & Mr. Jon Funk were the most knowledgeable not to mention the leading authority’s on the 7Star Mantis System.

Not even close.

Let’s not forget about the Chiu Luen line, the Lai line, Sifu Henry Chung and his line, and the most knowledgable… Sigung Chung Ho Yin (retired). These people are in the US. You also have a ton of extremely knowledgable Sifu in Texas all trained by Sifu Raymond Fogg (Brandon Jones, John Cheng, Jeff Hughes, Richard **an, I know I’m missing a few) — guys, there are a lot of very knowledgable 7 Sifu out there. Cottrell and Funk are just the best at self promotion.

11

Well, thanks for the info. I was talking to someone in Shanghai who told me this guy accepted him as a private student recently. Frankly some things he started telling me didn’t quite check out. For example, he tried telling me that the Chin Woo we know of wasn’t legit and that this was the “real” Chin Woo. When I talked to him about the Chin Woo World Championships, he said that his teacher recently “gave them permission” to use the name. He also said that Chin Woo in Shanghai called him in to bring back traditional wushu to Shanghai Chin Woo as all they practiced there was modern “gymnastic” wushu, but then he was fired for being white… It sounds like this guy enjoys overstating his importance.

12

This whole thing got started with me talking about Shanghai Chin Woo modern wushu, lol. Thought I’d get a better idea of where he was coming from by checking out what sort of teacher he has. Well, I think I’m going to just warn this guy to be checking into his teacher’s background himself and then go on with my life pretending I never heard of the guy. The last thing I want to do is get involved in some kind of praying mantis “lineage war”, as I’m not even a praying mantis practitioner :stuck_out_tongue:

13

Maybe It’s just me but I was under the impression that Mr.Steve Cottrell & Mr. Jon Funk were the most knowledgeable not to mention the leading authority’s on the 7Star Mantis System.

I would not say that Cottrell and Funk are the most knowledable ones in mantis today.

14

Originally posted by cha kuen
[B]

I would not say that Cottrell and Funk are the most knowledable ones in mantis today. [/B]

Perhapse not, but they are in the forefront (note: I did not say the only ones) of Mantis Sifu that openly share their information with others not only of their own style, but with the MA world in general. BTW, they are both very knowledgable in their respective families of 7* even though their directions of thought are not parallel.

Besides,…what do they have to do with Kai Uwe Pel or claiming mastery of anything?? In all my years with Sifu Cottrell, I have never heard these words from him nor seen him write anything even similar.

There are several very good/great Sifu of the 7* line in several families. Seek them out & learn from them. I have done this in the past & have always come away with usefull information.

Best Wishes to all,
BTL

15

There are several very good/great Sifu of the 7* line in several families. Seek them out & learn from them. I have done this in the past & have always come away with usefull information.

Right on and Kind’ve my point.

I think that 7* is getting so huge and so widespread that anybody claiming anything outside of their own line is a bit distasteful. Besides, if you start to claim anything, you start to close doors to a lot of wonderful opportunities to learn.

16

Shifu Pel

For Reference Please Read:

http://forum.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19222&perpage=15&highlight=Steals%20the%20Peach&pagenumber=3

For my answer, I shall compare Sifu Pel to RAYNYSC:

Shifu Pel has actually done Tanglang research.

RAYNYSC has proven that he does NOT do the research he claims to have done and cannot be believed at face value whenever he makes any statements. (Including those about me, apparently).

Shifu Pel does try to share his information on Tanglang with anyone wishing to share, debate or learn about the nature of Tanglang techniques or the differences between styles (though he does have strong opinions).

RAYNYSC has indeed acted as if he WERE an authority, (something I have never claimed to be, lol) in order to deceive people as to the nature of Tanglang. Though when called on it, he immediately attempts to retract his statements (when I have been proven wrong, I LEARN).

Shifu Pel does not engage in attacks against anyone, that I know of. He has strong convictions concerning the nature of Tanglang and one must be ready for this when discussing things. (The same can be said for many of us).

RAYNYSC has and does engage in personal attacks, misrepresenting the truth and fabricating research in order to attack the WHF line in general.

This is my opinion of RAYNYSC and Shifu Pel.

My opinion of Cha Kuen and Mighty B:

For Cha Kuen and Mighty B to take the clearly farcical and sarcastic comments of RAYNYSC and try use them to make a statement about me says a great deal more about them than it does me. And, if all that they can say is that I am not the “most knowledgeable” about Tanglang, I can, and did, laugh. It was like a clown, (RAYNYSC), doing something funny and here were two people actually taking the joke as fact and trying to run with it. Gentlemen, when you follow someone’s lead, be certain that, in many ways you link your reputation to theirs, in this case more so. It was a poor choice. I hope you can see that now.

Thanks RAYNYSC for affording me this opportunity.

Sincerely,

Steve Cottrell, (not the leading authority on Tanglang, LOL!!)

17

I believe in the good nature of people in general. So when a person share sensible information with me or with the public, I would think that person being generous rather than think of that person being self promoting. But then is self promotion really a bad thing?

Sifu Cotrell has impressed me as geniuely kind and sincerely helpful person. Also very humble which can be seen in his usually carefully worded posts. If there is one fault about him, he’s just too darn polite! (sorry Steve, can’t help it) :slight_smile: . I would like to see a little spark, a little colorful Sifu Cotrell online sometimes. LOL…

Jon Funk, although I have only briefly met him a long time ago, is a slightly different story. I don’t doubt him having the good intention of promoting PM yet at the same time he is equally interested in selling you his approach to 7 Star PM. I don’t find his approach agreeable but that doesn’t make him bad. It is just different. His ability in reaching out to people is quite remarkable. For that, this is a man worth the attention. He deserves the recognition whether we like his work or not.

As for Shifu Pel, it could just be his entourage’s doing in putting him in the spotlight. I have nothing personal against him but having a tall claim such as the single most knowledgeable exponent on Praying Mantis Kung Fu is a bit much. It does more to turn me off in listening to him then to pay attention to him.

Just a few thoughts…

Mantis108

18

Stevie

You didn’t get my point. What I was saying is that it is pretty much impossible to be the “most knowledgable” or anything outside of your own line. Praying Mantis is too huge. It’s actually a good thing because it pretty much means that you can never get bored with it because it’s a life long commitment. Also, when looking at a style, don’t stop with the people who right articles. There are others out there that don’t write articles or lurk on forums. They will share… although they don’t give their mantis to just anyone, even mantis practicioners. Now about you guys who write articles, you included Steve, thank you. I do respect the thorough research that all of you have done and have been doing. If you’ve read some of my past posts, I have referred people to your website because your terminology page is well written and thorough. I always place the disclaimor that I don’t often agree with you, or anybody in mantis or martial arts in general. I’m just that way. Don’t take my cynisism too seriously.

19

Reply To Mighty B

You didn’t get my point.

Quite the contrary Mighty B, I understand your purpose completely and I illustrated it for all to see in my previous post.

However, your attempt to retreat from this now deserves to be answered in more detail:

  1. Your initial post reference me, “small fish in a big pond” (your words in your title) states clearly what you wish to say about me to the people reading this message board. It was neither the topic under discussion nor was I even participating at this point. This action by you was pathetic opportunism and damages any pretense you might make now or in the future as not having a negative bias towards me. I, and anyone reading this, will know this about you.

  2. You then listed in detail only Sifu Fogg’s affiliates as examples of this larger community, (a shameless and clumsy attempt at promotion of your favored group). Isn’t it funny that you try to accuse me of being self promoting, (as if that is negative and I would debate this), when you are clearly making such attempts on behalf of your own. Else why mention names at all or especially only of them. (And it is not because they are in Texas, Sifu John Cheng is in California, has been for years, but is in Sifu Fogg’s line and so you promote him too). Such hypocracy!

You carry on in your last post inviting people especially to seek out those not in the magazines or on line participating in discussions, (again promoting indirectly those on your list, your hypocrisy continues…).

  1. In your last response you answered me using the diminutive form of my first name as a title. As I have taught children’s classes I know that this is the last stop before real name calling for most middle-schoolers, indicating clearly your negative bias towards me. This should convince even those naive persons online reading this that might hold out for this exchange being a misunderstanding of your position, thank you.

  2. Incredibly you then tried to retreat from your previous posts, saying some half hearted positive things and ending it all with “don’t take my cynicism too seriously”. This is your way of saying, “Let me imply falsely to everyone on line that you hold yourself above other practitioners, attack you for such statements as if you had said them, promote my own favored group repeatedly while criticizing you for being self promoting, and do it all without you holding me to account”.

I am sorry. The print media is not like a school yard argument. The inconsistencies in your statements and duplicity of purpose are clear for all to see. You have damaged your credibility and reputation for honest intent in this discussion.

Clearly, the sifu with whom you have been associated in the past had to have taught you better critical thinking and sense of honor than what you have displayed today. I take no pleasure in this but I must defend myself or be defined by such as you and that would mean I was being remiss in my own responsibilities.

I hope for more productive discussion in the future.

Steve Cottrell

20

Oh no…

I’m helping to turn this forum into the lineage bashing forum that the Wing Chun one has become…

As I have taught children’s classes I know that this is the last stop before real name calling

No, the next step is burping the alphabet or some other thing like that… And No, I won’t revert to name calling. OK, I will revert to name calling, “yo mama” snaps, gross associations, rash generalizations, bad grammar and spelling, and just about anything else you can imagine. I’ve been doing it on this forum for a couple of years now.

Yes, I do have biasis- It’s human nature- but I don’t hold anything personal against you. Heck, I met you only once and really it wasn’t long enough to form any opinions about you. I’m starting to form one now though. The people that I mentioned I mention for 1 reason— I know that they are good, I know they know a ton about 7*— way more than I’ll ever care to know, but, they all have one thing in common, they don’t write articles or anything else. Again, that was my point. I say don’t stop writing and researching, it’s good that people do that. But, I also say to people who read these things that there are a lot of people out there with the knowledge who don’t write about it.

You carry on in your last post inviting people especially to seek out those not in the magazines or on line participating in discussions, (again promoting indirectly those on your list, your hypocrisy continues…).

No crap? So, when you research, do you just hang out with the other writers having tea parties? No, you go out and seek people who are more knowledgable than you. Do they write? No, if they did, you wouldn’t have an article topic would you? Yes I do tell people to seek out people who are not in magazines or on line.

Your number 4 makes me out to be a strategist like Sun Tzu. I didn’t really intend all that, but cool. I didn’t know that I was so devious. My next big trick will be to get all you forum members to start sending me money.

On another note. Last night I met a 7* man who really knows his stuff. He’s been teaching for a long time, yet he doesn’t allow just anyone to call him Sifu-- not even his beginner students. He only allows dedicated students of his to call him “Sifu”. I’ve never seen that before ever. Usually the term “sifu” is thrown around so much so that it’s starting to lose its meaning. It’s similar to my profession where anybody with a camera calls themselves a Director of Photography. The term DP used to carry a lot of weight, now it doesn’t because, as a producer, when you hire a DP, unless you’ve worked with him before or have got a positive referral from someone you trust, you really don’t know what you’re getting.