I’ve been asked a few times why there are so many spellings for Wing Chun. Many of you here know already so this is old news.
Hong Kong was a British colony for years. The Brits used the term “water closet” (WC) for toilet. Wing Chun people didn’t want to associate the initials WC for their beloved system so they changed the Romanization to ‘VT’. Leung Ting designated his branch with the initials, WT.
When a native Cantonese reader sees the Chinese characters for Wing Chun they will pronounce it “Wing Choon” regardless of what Romanization we Westerners use. Some people use Bil Jee. It should really be “Biu” like chew. Also there are no “R” sounds in Cantonese so larp (lop), garn (gan), gerk (geuk), are not correct. OK, rant over.
Phil
There are also dialect differences, and regional differences.
E.g, someone in Guangzhou and many in HK will pronounce the first set like Siu Nim Tao. Cetain areas in HK, however, will pronounce it closer to Siu Lim Tao (they replace initial ‘N’ sounds with initial ‘L’ sounds). This is like how some English speakers say ‘sofer’ instead of ‘sofa’.
That same group in HK will also drop initial ‘Ng’, so Ngoi (as pronounced in Guangzhou and HK) will sound closer to Oy.
And don’t even get Phil started on the difference in Toishan pronounciations… 
Don’t forget that “R” in those cases is not pronounced in non-American/Canadian English. So we can spell it “garn” and pronounce it “gahn”.
Since we are romanizing here, it hardly makes sense to me to insert silent characters. At least that’s how I see it…
I think that was an attempt to get English speakers to, for example, pronounce ‘Gan’ less like the ‘a’ in ‘man’ and more like the ‘a’ in ‘father’.
Some dialects, like Mandarin, use tonal accents as well, but they have 4 tones where Cantonese has roughly double that (which is why other use the accentls plus insertion of silent ‘h’ to indicate low tones).
Thank you for the language lesson, Sifu Redmon.
No sich tang yeti Gwandungwah– but it needs a lot of help!
I am told I have a Vietnamese accent by my mantis brothers, which is really strange considering I am a tall, lanky WASP.
Think of music with it’s Treble and Bass cleffs. There are some differences of opinions but generally Cantonese has 7 tones. Four tones are upper level (trebel cleff). Three tones are lower level (bass cleff). In order to distinguish between upper and lower level the letter ‘h’ is added to the word.
Phil
I remember hearing Moy Yat speaking Toishan when we’d go out to dinner. I was just learning Cantonese then and could catch very little. Now I’m trying to talk to people how speak Haak Ga. Rene, that’s a diffult dialect. For those of you on T.O. there’s a REALLY good Haak Ga restaurant near the bus station called Indochine.
Phil
M’goi sai. M’gan yiu ah. Ngo haih haak yahn dahnhaai Ngo sihk gong Gwondung Wah. Neih hou chungming yahn ah.
Fei Lihk (Phillip)
That’s how some of my Bahstonian friends pronounce it too.
Regards,
- kj
Phil,
I’m not musical at all. However, my point was more with respect to Steveo’s use of “r” as in garn, as opposed to gan or gahn. I don’t how an “r” would help. IOW, I was agreeing with your comment. But then again, I speak Canadian, eh. 
Man, I always keep a couple of Toonies in my pocket.
Phil
Phil:
Gong dut m chor… hou !!!
By the way, I think the translation of your name fits better with Fei Leep (instead of Fei Lihk)… the “lip” in Philip sounds better and more pronounced this way. Just a thought…
OK, I know I speak funny, but there’s no need for insults, kj!
Not at all - I find it rather endearing. You should hear our unusual Rehchester accents.
Regards,
- kj
Euh mah Gehd!
[QUOTE=reneritchie;641195]There are also dialect differences, and regional differences.
E.g, someone in Guangzhou and many in HK will pronounce the first set like Siu Nim Tao. Cetain areas in HK, however, will pronounce it closer to Siu Lim Tao (they replace initial ‘N’ sounds with initial ‘L’ sounds). This is like how some English speakers say ‘sofer’ instead of ‘sofa’.
[/QUOTE]
Cool thread.
Phil posted this thread on another thread recently and I was reading through and have a question. Isn’t Siu Lin Tao and Siu Nim Tao 2 distinctly different things (Big vs Little Idea) and not just a pronounciation thing?
JP
[QUOTE=JPinAZ;805998]Cool thread.
Phil posted this thread on another thread recently and I was reading through and have a question. Isn’t Siu Lin Tao and Siu Nim Tao 2 distinctly different things (Big vs Little Idea) and not just a pronounciation thing?
JP[/QUOTE]
I thought the difference was nim ment to think or continplate where as lin meant to practice .
[QUOTE=kj;641271]That’s how some of my Bahstonian friends pronounce it too.
Regards,
- kj[/QUOTE]For stats fans, most linguists will tell you that in fact rhotic accents (who pronounce the mid-/post-vowel ‘r’) are actually in the minority in the English-speaking world. General American English (GAm - a merger of Western American English, Central American and what is sometimes known as Standard Midwestern despite being slightly East of the centre - Michigan etc - it’s an geographical distinction, technically not an isoglossic one) is rhotic, but most NE American accents and Southern dialects are not. Approximately 2/3 of the States is rhotic, a minority in Canada (mostly limited to predominantly Irish/Scottish immigrant origin areas) and 1/3 in the UK. Australia, Africa and NZ don’t have any rhoticism at all.
[QUOTE=Matrix;641214]Since we are romanizing here, it hardly makes sense to me to insert silent characters. At least that’s how I see it…[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=reneritchie;641239]I think that was an attempt to get English speakers to, for example, pronounce ‘Gan’ less like the ‘a’ in ‘man’ and more like the ‘a’ in ‘father’.[/QUOTE]Of course, gahn is a perfectly reasonable way of transliterating, to avoid the nasal ‘ae’ of GAm ‘cat’, ‘man’ etc. ‘Garn’ also makes sense in non-rhotic accents.
Linguistics lecture over!
[QUOTE=stonecrusher69;806015]I thought the difference was nim ment to think or continplate where as lin meant to practice .[/QUOTE]
You are right. Lihn is pratice and Nihm is thought/concept/idea. In Spanish “b” and “v” are interchangeble. It’s that way in HK Cantonese according to some.
When I was in college my Cantonese professor who was from Canton, was adamant about the proper pronounciations of “l” and “n”. She always said that the HK Cantonese speakers didn’t distinguish between the two.
For instance Neui (girl), would be Leui in HK. So I can see the where there can be confusion between SLT, and SNT
Some WC lineages do use practice (lihn) instead of concept (nihm) though. Languages evolve and now I’ve even heard people from Canton saying leui for girl.
I remember learning the word Siuje which meant Miss. A Chinese friend of mine was in China and called a waitress Siuje and was told by his friends that Siuje
meant hooker in some places. I remember when a Hoe was a garden tool…lol