You mentioned that you found your instructor from his website? Was he apart of the ones that Patterson approved of or the general other listings ?
Just wondering.
Also, what sifus you hear about depends on which martial art circles you are in. I used to be in a martial arts circle (talking about wing chun) only heard about Yip Man, wong shun leung, Leung Ting , Edmin Bozotepe.
Now that I’m in a different circle I hear a lot about other sifus such as Tsui Seung Tin, Chan Jing Chong, Mike patterson, Steve martin, Ng Chun Hong, and others others others.
Every school or teacher has his own “circle” that he’s exposed to.
BTW- Mike Patterson’s guys dominate the fighting matches at the great lakes tournametn every year. I’d put him up there as one of the best in the US.
chakuen, it doesn’t really matter if Patterson’s group dominates some tournament. Like I said earlier, fighting abilty is not equal to internal abilty. Since Patterson is an internal martial arts teacher we should be more worried about if he can move internally rather than if he can fight. And we are not good enough to really tell if he moves internally or not from his clips.
I was just replying to the question of " Why should we know patterson? What has he done that’s significant in the MA?"
But fighting ability does matter because , to me, whether you practice internal or external, you should be able to apply it and be a fighter. (if that is your focus)
True , Ii’m not good enough to tell whether he’s connected or not. I just hear from other people who are, that he is really connected.
Walter,
I agree . You can have your own opinions and this is what a board is for, sharing your thoughts.
Just FYI, living in the Golden State, I hear quite a lot about Patterson and his students. I’ve never met the man or anyone who’s trained with him long-term, so I don’t have a personal opinion on him. But that being said, he does have quite a reputation locally, both in regards to his personal skill level and his ability to train full contact fighters.
Pretty much anyone living here practicing nei gung knows of Patterson, Tim Cartmell, and Jason Tsou, and they are (at least in my experience) very well respected by the local cma community.
Mind you I’m not weighing in on the video clips (I don’t have much to add), I just thought I’d give a local perspective.
From what I’ve read, Mr. Patterson received quality instruction in Hsing-I from well regarded teachers in Taiwan, whose internal skill is not questioned. He started training as a teen-ager, and I think he spent close to ten years, maybe more, maybe less, learning hsing-i. SO, if he didn’t learn real internal skill, who out there is learning real internal skill? My point is that he has a better chance of having ((l)earned) the skill than most people.
He was probably exposed to a much more raw version of hsing-i instruction than most people would get these days - getting his ass beat was probably a little more acceptable when and where he trained vs. where most of us train.
So, out of sheer curiosity, I’m trying to figure out - how do we learn these internal skills? I thought it took correct teaching (not necessarily secrets) + ***doing the work/gong practice. Lotsa gong -> gong fu, no?
All I know is, it seems to be working for me…time is my only obstacle…
I agree. Internal training is not easy and all those “monks” with spears in their throats are representing stupid chi kung, IMHO. I read an article by Gene Ching on the kungfumagazine.com and i thought it was ridiculous but hey, kfo has to make money right? The journal of asian martial arts seesm to be a better resource but even that has some sifu articles on iron palm. (That guy isn’t good at iron palm)
Learning the posture and practicing that to get rooted will take you a year or more. Then you have to learn how to issue power. Most of that doesn’t interest people when all that interests people are speed, power and fah jing or ging. They’re not willing to workfor it and there’s not enough people who know how to lead you down the road for it.
I was taught to stand. That is the core. When
I don’t have time or room to practice quan, I practice qigong. I barely practice quan 5 times a week (I know - weak) but I do a decent amount of
single movement exercises.
I have a buddy who weighs at least 40 pounds more than I do, and has been training martially for the past 5 or 6 years (mostly karate), we’ve both been training taiji for the same time. I took a 10 year+ hiatus from martial training, so it was like I was starting over.
Because of differences in schedule, responsibilities, perhaps discipline, I have more time to practice standing, plus I know that it is more powerful than doing tons of empty quan.
Just yesterday we were working out. I didn’t see him do any standing at the session, I doubt he had
done any that day. For the first time, I was able to uproot him when pushing hands. Granted, we’re both crappy at pushhands, but not absolute beginners. We could both use a lot of work on
neutralizing energy.
Until now, I’ve felt like a little b!tch when we touch, but this time, it was different. And no one was more surprised than I was when I was able to uproot him over and over. But my ass will be humbled the next time I push with the teacher, of course.
My point? No secrets. Just practice. Move less, think more. If my scrawny ass can learn to do it, anyone can do it. Internal = mind power. This is just the beginning. I am still standing outside the door.
All I can say is…if Mike Patterson does not have good Xingyi, the bar has been raised to unrealistic heights. Yes, there can always be better in anything, but lets get real.
I have his video on Hsing-I Five Fists. Whether you think he has internal skill or not, he can use Xingyi with great speed. Taking into account that he has lot of real fighting experience, I would trust his application and teaching over most others.
BTW, his Serving Tea video clip does not look very external to me. That should give you a clue as to how he works power into his form.
Yeah, that’s what I was trying to get at…if not someone like Mike, than who? There was a similar thread going on @ Emptyflower about how Chen Xiao Wang does not have real taiji skill. Ok, than who does? Who has put in more work, and has had access to more authentic teaching? Very few…
