Sifus, When are they of age?

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Shaolin Kung Fu
21

Devils Advocate

They need a devil’s icon on this board…

As you know, I find nothing wrong with your age or you teaching. Also, I am not saying that Shaolin Dynasty actually believes what I’m about to rant about but a line in his post struck a pet peeve of mine.

He wrote: “It was’t a question of credability more of battling stereotypes.”

rant on
Well the question is one of credability because to battle stereotypes you have to change all of the type you are grouped with. Somewhere in not so distance past, we americans started believing that they could get other people to stop using their past experiences to make on the spot judgements.

If the question is “When is a Sifu of age” then the answer is, age doesn’t matter. If the question is, “why can’t I get any respect becuase I’m young” then the answer is because a large percentage of young folks are not responsible or mature and you have to deal with it.

People will judge you on what they have experienced and heard. It’s human nature and it’s actually a good instinct. If we had to start fresh on every interaction, we’d get no where.

Is it bad to be cautious because car salesmen are “sterotyped” as trying to trick you into paying more for your car then they would be willing to sell it for?

Of course not all stereotypes are good but nothing is absolute. (Taiji lesson there for you
:smiley: )

I just get peeved at the victim mentality that is so prevalent these days. Life isn’t fair and it won’t be fair. If it was fair, there wouldn’t be a food chain. Some will have to work harder then others. Not everyone can win. This is what makes life a challenge and enjoyable. Adversity brings out the best in humans and isn’t that what kung fu is really about?

At least your situation is your choice. If you don’t like being a young sifu, then wait till you are an older one. Nothing you alone can do will change the stereotype.

end rant

We can now return to our normally scheduled discussions.

22

Huh

I wasn’t complaining. I just used myself as an example so we would have something to base this conversation on. I never meant this to really be about me. The harder life is on me the better, hardship builds character. I never met someone pro sterotypes before, but whatever. Never said I can’t get respect of anyone, just people I have never met face to face and that does’t really bother me. I’ll say it again I never wanted to be the topic of this disscusion I wanted to know what you guys thought of young Sifus in general.

Witness the Dynasty!!!
www.shaolindynasty.itgo.com

23

Ive been in your situation…and did teach for a while. But the thing is, when i was teaching i didn’t have ALL the answers…and quite honestly i felt that although i was good fighter, i was by no means a Sifu. I felt like a rip off shitty teacher… I felt like the people whom i was teaching deserved more, they atleast deserved the quality that i had recieved. The school i was in said i should teach… In the end i moved on and went back to being a student again (best decision i ever made). The whole “Sifu” thing is an ego trip if you not ready for it. You might need to do it though to see for yourself… After 1 year you will know.

24

…oh yeah, and im from australia too, so that ATTACK came quite naturally. (We are all the same!!!) :rolleyes:

25

20 yrs old

I have studied Martial Arts for over 15 years of my life ( MMA , Boxing , TKD , a small amount of White Crane , and I finaly settled with the Southern Five Family Fist/Emperor’s Long Fist styles), and I must say ShaolinDynasty, that yes I believe you may be very well qualified to teach. However, I do feel that to attain the name “Sifu” , it must be appointed by your Sifu. We have the 6-9 hours a day training at our school as well ( and it is called College Courses) and I believe it is a very effective method for producing great Martial Arts Instructors. The training that you get from being with yout Sifu and the Head Instructors for those long amounts of time is priceless. I have seen average Kung Fu stylist go from average to allmost stunning in 6 months of this kind of training. Chinese Medicine is taught as well in these classes, but takes another four years to get a degree.
I know it isn’t required, but I believe to open your own school and be deemed a Sifu, that one must also have experience teaching in the school that they attend for a few years, and only then trying on their own. After the experience is there , and your Sifu approves, then you are ready. Doesn’t matter what anyone else believes.

( and for the note: I am not an instructor by no means at all, this is just an opinion.)

26

To Sifu or not to Sifu, that is the question - So learn Chinese!

If you look at the word “sifu,” or “shifu,” in Chinese (Cantonese and Mandarin respectively), you will see that there are two characters making up the word, and two ways to write the word using a different second character.

The first (“si” or “shi”) means master/teacher. This character remains the same with both words.

The first “second character” means teacher as well, giving the meaning of a Master Instructor, implying someone who has really mastered his subject.

The second “second character” means FATHER, and implies a familial relationship as a father to his children…

This is what makes it tough to consider a 19 year old a “sifu” in the second sense of the word.

No matter how many years of training you have, and I don’t doubt your skill at all, at the ripe old age of 19 you would be hard pressed to fully qualify for the first sense of the word either. You simply lack (as do I at 32) sufficient life experience both in teaching, training, fighting, and LIVING to present yourself as a sifu (and doing that is just kinda tacky anyway… “Hi! I’m Master Billy!”).

However, and here is where I, without knowing anything about you, give you the benefit of the doubt and honor and respect whatever skills you may have, if your STUDENTS call you sifu without you telling them to do so, then you have earned it… Ultimately, the perception is in their eyes. If they feel you deserve it, then you do.

A TRUE master would never call himself one…

Matt Stone

27

It’s Okay!

Dynasty, don’t worry about the age. It seems to me that you have your teachers blessing and he feels you are skilled enough to represent his arts.
As long as you teach the best way you know how and continue to learn as best you can, you will to grow into these big “Sifu”
shoes. But, if you you feel, even for a moment, that teaching is distracting you from your own development, stop and assess what is most important to you. When you are most at peace with yourself, you will be most able to show the way to others.

Regards, Pete.

28

My Sifu was only 18 or 19 when he began teaching, and he has been going strong at it for 27 or 28 years now. You are ready to teach when your Sifu says you are, if you have people come to your school who are uncertain of your credentials maybe you should post a letter from your Sifu showing your lineage. This would serve to demonstrate your abilities toothers and be a source of pride for you.

29

Ok

Part of the reason for me to teach is the area I live in. There is (besides my Sifu) no other kungfu in the area. My Sifu is very busy with his muscle therapy center so I have been basically running his classes for the last year. He “certified” me to teach up to a certain point of the material. I still work with him teaching his classes but besides this I am begining to start classes of my own. My teaching has happened gradually over the past year. I did not wake up one day and say “time to start teaching”. My fellow students have never questioned my ability to teach over this past year and my Sifu has said I am ready so that is all I need. If there were any better Kungfu teachers in my area I would not be teaching I would send my students there I only care about development in Kungfu it is not a matter of ego or money with me(Ibarley make anything anyway). I started teaching to give people in my area some better opportunities to train.

Bai He- I thought long and hard about it myself. I find that teaching forces me to analyze my techniques more and ask myself questions as a result I am learning more about myself and my style than ever before. When you teach you will also train more because you are always on dispay.

Tsui- Great idea but I teach at the local park district and in local parks(no rent!).

YiLIQuan- If you lack life experiance at 32 when will you have it? Also how old was your Sifu when he started teaching? How do you know if you have sufficient life experiance? These ideas are good but to abstract to actually base anything from.

Witness the Dynasty!!!
www.shaolindynasty.itgo.com

30

SIFU

You must be very honored. Be proud and make your Master proud. Spread the seeds of good Gong-Fu in your area and turn out good students. That’s how Gong-Fu stays alive.

Congrats.

31

Sifu title

Northern mantis is slow right now, thought I’d check out this forum. You think being a Sifu is bad?. You have plenty of people who call themselves Master or GrandMaster with about the same amount of training. Personally I believe you shouldn’t get the title of Sifu until you are at least in your mid 20’s. I have been in Wahlum Praying Mantis for over 10 years training 3 days a week, and next year I will attempt my test. I don’t believe skill goes with age. If you had a kid who was a expert marksman at 10 years old, would you let him carry a gun around all the time because he is an “expert”?. Of course not because emmotional inside he is still a 10 year old and will stilll act like a 10 year old. Get my point?. :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool: :cool:

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You tell 'em Miami Mantis. :smiley: :smiley: :smiley:

The title “Sifu” comes with age and dedication.it takes years to achieve such a geat deal undrstandng and hard work.It takes years to fully understand kung fu and the the theory of tachniques.That’s why I feel I don’t have what it takes to be a Sifu.

“Always be ready”

33

miamimantis

only 3 days a week? tisk tisk..

34

MiamiMantis

Why in the mid 20’s?

Witness the Dynasty!!!
www.shaolindynasty.itgo.com

35

Sifu age

I believe by then you are emmotionally mature, and you can handle the business side of running a school. Being a sifu, people look up to you and will ask your advice on not only training but on other topics, as they respect your thoughts. :smiley: :smiley: :smiley:

36

my opinion…

FYI- i began my martial arts training when i was 9 y.o. in TKD. i am now 18 y.o. and have been training in the jow ga style for over the last two years. as a child myself, i would honestly have to say that at 19, one’s kung fu skill and knowledge might be extraordinary! i actually have a sihing who is 1 and has been training kung fu since he was 4 y.o. under the same sifu. he’s sure one hell of an instructor. but, theoretically, if i was to start over and meet him first, would i honestly consider him to be my SiFu? i mean he’s barely old enough to operate a car by himself. much less buy a pack of cigarettes or a 12 pk of beer. not to take away from any of his aquired skills or knowledge of the world, but i honestly myself couldn’t allow myself to be called a SiFu at this age. even if i was in it since i could first walk and talk. i am all for anyone, with the blessings of their sifu, opening up a school and teaching. but for your own sake, with that title comes the territory. either expect all the responsibilities of a sifu or leave that title in the closet for a couple of more years. also expect a lot more trouble headed your way for those ignorant enough to challenge your validity. good luck to you though and god bless you in your efforts.

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FOOD FOR THOUGHT!

if a 40 y.o. man with 9 years of solid kung fu experience was mandated by his teacher to go out and start his own school, would you support or recommend him being considered a sifu if his sifu gave him this title? this is jus theoretical based on the question raised in this forum. (let’s see what kinda responses we get now!)

38

Most definitely - if he could fight effectively using the classical concepts of his chosen style.

The ability of a true traditional kung fu master is unmistakeable. Their jing is such that when they touch you, you KNOW.

If a guy can manifest such power, I don’t care how young or old he is - I want to learn how to do the same thing.

39

1st post Mysteri- I don’t think buying beer and cigaretes(can do in this state legally, driving cars(can do at age 16 in IL) has anything to do with my Kungfu teaching. As a matter of fact if I was buying cigaretes and drinking beer alot that would have a negative effect on my Kungfu wouldn’t it.

2st post Mysteri- That is one of my reasons for this post. I believe that the reason people object to a younger person using the title Sifu has just to do with the fact they feel more comfortable with an older person. Therefore people may go to a person with the same martial arts experience just because he is older. I do want to see more responces to that question!

Some of you guys have the wrong idea of a Sifu. A sifu shouldn’t have or give you all the answers. A good Sifu needs to teach you how to search and learn on your own. There shouldn’t be a point you stop learning/training and just teach. I believe your kungfu should evolve. This means there are many grades of Sifu. Some Sifu may have a higher level of kungfu than others but that is ok. The sifu’s job is just to point the way. I believe that age or the number of years of training aren’t as important as the Sifu’s understanding of what he is teaching. I continue to learn from my Sifu and when my students have 5 years of experience I will have an additional 5 of experience added to me. This raises an even more interesting question if Kungfu is so endless how can even the best Sifu be considered “advanced”.

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