Didn’t recognize any of your footwork in your vid as wing chun. Is that standard Cheung advanced footwork or whatever you call it, is it your own development of WC or is it an abandonment of WC?
Just wondering.
Sorry, in case it wasn’t clear Victor, it was the vids from the vids thread… page 20 or so.
Look carefully once again at three of the vids…specifically…the one that starts with my opponent throwing two hook punches at my head…wherein the first part of my counter consists of double bil saos…LOOK AT THE FOOTWORK attached to those bil saos - that’s vintage William Cheung TWC sidestepping footwork.
Also look at the footwork on the vid wherein I hurt my fingers against the metal bars on his facemask while throwing a palm strike to his face (btw - catch the bong sao in the middle of that encounter)…
and the vid where I counter a single left hook (before I picked his leg for a takedown).
BUT MOST OF ALL…as I’ve said a number of times…this FIRST set of clips was meant to only convey a few themes…and one such theme was that I PURPOSELY played a counter-attack role.
On the next set of vids I will be much more aggresssive - and the result will be much more TWC footwork and “wing chun” strategy and technique in general.
Cheers for the reply, I’ll check them out again. 
"and one such theme was that I PURPOSELY played a counter-attack role.
"
This is interesting though. I although I would have thought attack is more an imperative than counterattack in wing chun, I wouldn’t have thought wing chun footwork excluded counterattack. I know you weren’t saying that, because what you were actually saying is that you were using wing chun footwork, so I think I must be missing the point of why you included this in your explanation… 
…unless it’s to say that if on some occasions you weren’t using recognisably wing chun footwork, the reason was because you felt that some other footwork was better suited to counterattack…?
I could keep guessing… oooooorrr, you could take the time to answer that for me. If that’s OK. It’s interesting.
“…unless it’s fair to say that if on some occasions you weren’t using recognisably wing chun footwork, the reason was because you felt that some other footwork was better suited to counterattack?”
YOU’RE GETTING WARM.
If I’m going to go on the attack right from the outset - then the footwork will be much more recognizable TWC…perhaps some shuffling boxing-type footwork somewhat…but NOT ANYWHERE NEAR as much as what you saw on those first vids - it will indeed be very TWC.
But if the opponent attacks first - and especially if he’s bigger and stronger (Myron goes 6’ 2.5" and weighs 205…to my 5’ 10" and 170) - then you have to be more elusive - which was what I was doing from the counter-attack perspective.
Purposely did it that way.
I really have a problem with the oft-repeated wingchunner attitude that all you have to do is simply “GO IN” all the time.
That’s not reality fighting.
You’re not always going to be the first one “in”…someone could get the jump on you - and if that someone is bigger and stronger - and he attacks first - oftentimes you HAVE to play a different footwork game.
I wouldn’t say you have to play a different footwork game. The Wing Chun I have learned has lots of evasive footwork for one to get out of the way and recoupe, counterattack…
James
Yes…but since the wing chun you’ve learned doesn’t include hard contact sparring on a regular basis…
IT’S MORE THEORY THAN REALITY.
The hard sparring was done and the theory was tested, therefore it is no longer theory. Just because you can’t make it work doesn’t mean it is not effective, it just means you can’t do it.
James
Is that why you’re not coming to Cleveland?
Because you don’t want to see that I can’t make it work?
…or is the truth something along the lines of: I’m afraid whatever he’s doing is way beyond what I’m doing?
(So I think I’ll stay home)
Agreed. Why is your wing chun footwork lacking in evasive footwork? BTW, I don’t mean this in a smartarse Sihing kinda way ( 
) I mean it sincerely as somebody who until recently sparred regularly full-contact, because I’m interested in your approach. When I’m attacked by a big guy a sometimes use aiki footwork (which is very good for evasion but not so good for counterstriking) sometimes boxing which is good short counters, sometimes shooto (er, like when he’s shooting!)… but often for standup I find that I can use wing chun footwork evasively, and to get counterstrikes in.
So before you have another pointless slanging match with Sihing, go on, open up, give me another answer!!! PM me if you don’t want to do it on the board!
It’s just usually, regardless of Sihing’s experience, I find what he says slightly fantastic, and I often agree with you. In this case, I was wondering the same thing as he was.
I really have a problem with the oft-repeated wingchunner attitude that all you have to do is simply “GO IN” all the time.
Yep, it’s bollocks. It’s a good way to get run-over and face-stomped in the street.
YOU’RE GETTING WARM.
If only you knew sir, I’m sh!thot 
“Why is your wing chun footwork lacking in evasive footwork?”… When I’m attacked by a big guy I sometimes use aiki footwork (which is very good for evasion but not so good for counterstriking)…sometimes boxing which is good for short counters…but often for standup I find that I can use wing chun footwork evasively, and to get counterstrikes in." (Mat)
I find that WHEN IN AN OPEN SPACE - as opposed to a place where lot’s of room to maneuver doesn’t exist - that a more up on your toes and mobile footwork - like what you saw on some of the vids…produces better results in terms of evasion and counter-striking.
But when in a more closed space - and a bigger guy gets the jump on me - then I do use a TWC footwork approach to evasion and counter-striking.
The reason should be obvious: A bigger, stronger man - if given the chance to “load up” more with his strikes, kicks, and forward momentum - because he has the room to prepare a launch while gaining momentum from the type of footwork you saw Myron using…
will have much more POWERFUL weapons coming at you than if he didn’t have the room to “prepare”…and he’s also quick enough (and has enough room) to back out of a counter-attack that isn’t done extremely fast (as in up on your toes fast).
Hence, imo, the need for a more evasive footwork than what wing chun provides - AT THAT MOMENT. Putting the two types of footwork together is the key. You have to know when to use this or that type of footwork - something that only regular and consistent hard sparring will reveal.
I don’t care where it comes from - what style of fighting.
I’m not married to the idea that something within wing chun HAS to provide the answers to the fighting problem in front of me to be solved.
That’s why I laugh when some people who don’t do hard sparring regularly - and all the time - as opposed to…“Well years ago I did it but now it’s no longer necessary”)…
try to tell me that I (Victor) don’t “do” certain aspects of wing chun because I “can’t.”
That’s such a pretentious joke!
(Not talking about you, Mat).
I see I am not the only one here.
Nelson Marcellino (Sirus):
Your FALSE interpretation of this thread should be obvious in the following manner:
Mat’s last post on this thread was February 28, 2005…some 8 MONTHS AGO !!!
And I explained myself very thoroughly after that post by Mat - and he has not responded since then.
Furthermore, Mat and I have discussed many things in the past, including AFTER February 28th - on other threads - and Mat has never demonstrated any problems in being able to speak his mind.
So if Mat was not satisfied with the answer I gave him within my last post on this thread - HE WOULD HAVE SAID SO BY NOW !
In other words, Nelson…since Mat is someone who spars regularly (including occasionally with one of my best students - who happens to be in Japan right now…where Mat lives)…
Mat understands my answer to his question.
You, on the other hand…HAVE NO SUCH UNDERSTANDING. :eek:
Sorry Victor, guess I was busy round then… i did remember reading your post and it answered my question very nicely thank you.
Not actually meeting your man at the moment… we were both busy then we were both free and I got pneumonia and a bulging disc. :eek: 
:o :rolleyes: etc…
After the pneumonia I developed (acute) asthma for the first time in my life! I’m sure when I can use my lungs and my spine again I’ll be ready to spar with your student! In fact, if he’s got time I’ll drag him along to my shooto school, see if he’s so fast and accurate with some 14 oz pillows on his hands! 
Sounds cool, Mat.
Sorry to hear about all your present ailments!
UltimatewingChun. STOP USING MY NAME IN YOUR POSTS. I DON’T POST ANYMORE ON THIS SITE
Who said that!? :eek:
Bit of a shame Nelson. Although I disagreed with a couple I liked some of the things you said. Looks like you let the political **** and mud-slinging in!
You and me both!
It’s all life, and therefore it’s all kung fu!