The only thing holding me back from my blue belt is my weakness in finishing from the back… and I admit, it’s my least favorite position… though I’ve been forcing myself there to improve.
Taking someone’s back in BJJ is very powerful, which is why guys are screaming from the sidelines to take it and sink the hooks. But as much as I’ve been accused here of being a sport-head fighter, I’m first and foremost a martial artists. And on my back, with a guy sitting in my lap, with my hooks in or not, is not the place I want to find myself anywhere other than in the SAFETY of the cage or BJJ matt. I just don’t think it is a wise position to place oneself, because it leaves one so vulnerable. And also because it is very committed. One you take it and sink the hooks, your ability to disengage and engage elsewhere, defend other fronts, is very compromised.
So I’m learning it. Because I want to be a great BJJ player some day, but it’s just one of those things. Taking the ability, the gained experience and knowledge and applying out how and where you like.
When I train Hsing-I, Taiji is the most stupid style. When focusing on Taiji it takes care of the shooting wrestler so fine and MMA beats them all, because it’s all inclusive. Or something like that or nothing like that. It is what it is but “Kung Fu” still sucks
[QUOTE=Ray Pina;902276]The only thing holding me back from my blue belt is my weakness in finishing from the back… and I admit, it’s my least favorite position… though I’ve been forcing myself there to improve.
Taking someone’s back in BJJ is very powerful, which is why guys are screaming from the sidelines to take it and sink the hooks. But as much as I’ve been accused here of being a sport-head fighter, I’m first and foremost a martial artists. And on my back, with a guy sitting in my lap, with my hooks in or not, is not the place I want to find myself anywhere other than in the SAFETY of the cage or BJJ matt. I just don’t think it is a wise position to place oneself, because it leaves one so vulnerable. And also because it is very committed. One you take it and sink the hooks, your ability to disengage and engage elsewhere, defend other fronts, is very compromised.
So I’m learning it. Because I want to be a great BJJ player some day, but it’s just one of those things. Taking the ability, the gained experience and knowledge and applying out how and where you like.
When I train Hsing-I, Taiji is the most stupid style. When focusing on Taiji it takes care of the shooting wrestler so fine and MMA beats them all, because it’s all inclusive. Or something like that or nothing like that. It is what it is but “Kung Fu” still sucks :p[/QUOTE]
I weigh 167 lb and am usually the smallest guy in the gym, so I learned to fight from my back out of necessity. Consequently, the triangle is my bread-and-butter, and I have a pretty good half-guard game as well.
Oh, I love guard. And I think it’s critical. My triangle is $hit, but I have a couple good arm bars and sweeps from there.
To me, the guard is different… you’ve been knocked down, and the man remains aggressive. You keep your contact, and pull him in and secure him. Even on the street, it is not ideal, but you can use the man as a shield a bit… and I often break guard to get up and scramble anyway. It’s just my way.
Taking the back is different though. I’d rather hang out and threaten the guillotine, drop my weight in a sprawl and pound the back of the head/neck, work the ribs and look for a foot to grab and roll him over. To me, that’s remaining aggressive but retaining positional awareness and mobility. Jumping on someone’s back and rolling them over, yea, I guess you could still shield with them, but to me I feel sluggish, not as quick to pop up and go and face someone else, run.
But that’s the thing, right? Everyone finds their own flavor from within the framework of a sound system.
I’m pretty good at taking the back in training, especially from the half-guard (thanks to some tips I got from Carmine Zocchi when I was at NY San Da). But you saw my last match. When I had the chance to take the guy’s back and sink in the RNC, I went too fast, didn’t secure the hooks, and slide off to the side and out of position.
Pretty much any ground fighting leaves you vulnerable in a real fight. But if push comes to shove and it hits the ground, I’d rather be on his back, with the hooks in, lifting his legs up with my heels like a rocking horse, than underneath him.
[QUOTE=MasterKiller;902278]I weigh 167 lb and am usually the smallest guy in the gym, so I learned to fight from my back out of necessity. Consequently, the triangle is my bread-and-butter, and I have a pretty good half-guard game as well.[/QUOTE]
[B]Arm triangle or with the legs?
I’m very comfortable on my back given my rudimentary experience with grappling. [/B]
[QUOTE=Water Dragon;902607]Look at it this way, Ray. It’s a tool, just like anything else. Just cause you have the tool in your toolbox, doesn’t mean you HAVE to pull it out.
Better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it, so take the back, sink the hooks, and choke the $hit outta 'em.[/QUOTE]
Or, you can do like TenTigers and carry around some of those “Relaxed Fit” conundrums.
[QUOTE=Water Dragon;902607]Look at it this way, Ray. It’s a tool, just like anything else. Just cause you have the tool in your toolbox, doesn’t mean you HAVE to pull it out.
Better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it, so take the back, sink the hooks, and choke the $hit outta 'em.[/QUOTE]
On the other hand, you will fight like you train, so why develop a habit that is ONLY good in the ring?
[QUOTE=Water Dragon;902607]
Better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it, so take the back, sink the hooks, and choke the $hit outta 'em.[/QUOTE]
That is the position I have ultimately taken. Plus, I’m a kook. I have to learn as much as I can. My coach says jump and I go for the sky.
[QUOTE=jet64;903207] Just wanna ask why you say taiji is the most stupid style? [/QUOTE]
Because of all but one teacher I’ve met have been kooks. They all tell you not to use power in push hands… yea, because when I use power I throw them around like the weak, baseless, martial artists that they are.
I know. I know… you’re not supposed to USE power in the training. You’re not supposed to use power in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu either. For the same reasons.
The difference is, if you want to exhaust yourself squeezing like an animal to hold a bad position, or try to bench press me off when I have you pinned, please do! Waist your energy. My technique, leverage and position is what has you pinned… not my “power.” I have that too though, if I should or want to dig it in a bit.
Only STUPID Taiji would reprimand a martial artists, boxer, fighter, for using power.
I know that’s not a true statement. Good technique is always effortless. And I know that’s what Taiji means. But what is stupid Taiji going to do about it?
I wish that were true! Good technique, like the Judo saying, maximizes effectiveness while minimizing effort, certainly. But boy do I wish it were effortless!!!
[QUOTE=Ray Pina;903587]
I know that’s not a true statement. Good technique is always effortless. And I know that’s what Taiji means. But what is stupid Taiji going to do about it?Get my point?[/QUOTE]
Good technique is only effortless if your opponent’s skill level is way below yours.
I understand your point. Anyways, here’s how you can test a real taichi. Ask for a sparring session, you attack as fast and as hard and try to hurt the taichi guy. If the taichi guy is for real, you wont be able to get a hard blow. Sometimes you can feel hitting the target but its soft touches only. Thats the way to test it, Push hands are BS I tell you.
[QUOTE=Mas Judt;903576]On the other hand, you will fight like you train, so why develop a habit that is ONLY good in the ring?[/QUOTE]
A couple of reasons. First, you learn it so you can learn to defend it. Second, I don’t think that technique is only good for the ring. It’s a good position for smaller guys to fight bigger guys from, and it works very well strategically. I like using it to go from guard, around the back, to mount. Slao, even if I don’t use the strategy, I might teach someone some day who will be very good with it. In that situation, I have to be at least good enough with it to demonstrate it.
I get what you’re saying though, but I don’t think it applies as much to the ground game as the stand up game. Things are slower on the ground, and there’s a lot more cognizant (sp?) thinking going on as compared to stand up.
