I am not trying to cover up anything. On the contrary, I want it to be laid out in the open. How many times do I have to say that I do not speak for the Chen Family. I speak for myself, so please do not try to say that the Chen family is trying to discredit the history of CLF as seen by you, I am talking as an individual person, not as a representative of any branch or family.
There may be many differences between Great Victory Hung Sing and Heroic Victory Hung Sing, but they are only stylistic variations with a distinct CLF flavour. We should concern ourselves with the similarities more than the differences. The tank is half full not half empty!
Coming back to your claim that Chan yiu-Chi changed his grandfather’s birthday by 10 years, if you ever have the chance to visit the King Mui Village, Chan Heung’s grave has a headstone that sets out clearly his birth and death dates. It would be an insult to say that the grandson would dare to change the date on the gravestone just to suit whatever you have in mind, wouldn’t you say?
What about Kong Hing, do you still believe that he scolded Chen Yong -Fa? Did you ask him in Futshan?
You may believe in something but your belief alone would not make it true, if it is not true. Otherwise, I could easily believe that you are full of **** and that makes you are full of ****.
Frank, What I am trying to say is that just because I believe you are full of ****, it doesn’t meant you are full of ****, we have to come close to you to smell you before we can say definitely whether you are full of **** or not. Do you get what I mean?
So if you are going to make any more claims or tell stories about people, please back them up with facts, will you?
If you want to be an expert in Chinese history, go and study some elementary Chinese first, please!
“Siu” in Siu Ping Kuen and “Tai” in Tai Ping Kuen are not a couple of pairing words. Siu (Small) goes with Dai (Big) and not Tai (Great). “Tai” has an extra dot in its character compare to “Dai”.
The rebellion was called Tai Ping Rebellion, but the CLF form is called Dai Ping Kuen. There is subtle difference to someone who knows the language.
Frank
No I don’t have any books on the Hung Mun as it s difficult to get specialist history books even in the UK general Chinese history yes special subjects no. I have often wondered about the connection between the Hung Sing and the Hung Mun or if they was also a possible connection with the Red bout opera’s
Joseph
You can’t really get the meaning of the names of most kung fu forms by literally translating the chinese characters you some times have to look behind them. Lets face it if any CLF practitioner ever wrote down the characters for Tai Ping they would be very quickly executed by the Ching government. I mean why is Moi Fa called Moi Fa and Bak Mo called Bak Mo, have you ever seen a plum blossom fight and Bak Mo is often translated as white hair referring to old man. However most versions of Bak Mo that I have come across are so physically demanding that even young fit men have difficulty doing this form.
PS just because some thing is not written down does not mean it could not have happened .
Fear not the man who has learned one thousand kicks, fear the man who has practiced one kick a thousand times.
If people like Frank care to study a little about the Chines language and culture then the questions you asked would not be too difficult to answer. Moi fa is a flower, therefore its name does not refer to how a plum blossom fights but it refers to the pattern of movement and the lightnes of movement when moi fa scatters in the wind. Many of the CLF forms have moi fa preface for that reason - pattern and quality for the form. Bak Mo refers to the golden hair orangatang, a very precious and agile creature treasured by the Chinese. Bak Mo when done properly, its movement is a bit like monkey boxing without the exaggeration. In China names are usually given for a reason, they don’t just make them up randomly.
I agree with you that when something is not wriiten down then it may still exists. However, it is not usually the case with history, especially recent history. 200 years is not a long time, we can check the history of CLF very easily if we bother to ask.
The problem with Frank is that he only looks from the view point of his own history. He has not bother to check out the facts with other sources. He pretend he know the Chinese language yet he can not tell the difference between two simple characters. He makes outrageous clamis but can not or does not bother to back them up with facts.
He just keep pouring the **** out hoping some of them will stick. Sadly, by the look of things, some of them did stick.
I know now that you under stand that we have to look to the meanings behind the written Chinese characters and not the literal translation. However Bak Mo cannot refer to the Orangatang as golden hair surly, the Chinese character white and the character for gold or golden are not the same. In addition, they do not even have a similar pronunciation.
Fear not the man who has learned one thousand kicks, fear the man who has practiced one kick a thousand times.
Have you ever heard of the term “Bak Gum” or white gold in Chinese? Have you ever seen a blond dacing in the morning light? To look behind the meaning of a word you have to use your imagination. Let us not dwell too much on this right now, we are side stepping the real issue here. Good try.
Joseph,y-w-t and Ironsilk-
Im not nearly an expert, but looking for some enlightenment here.
Tarm Sarm was known to be a great fighter. From my understanding he only taught 3 forms for the Buk Sing CLF, he did not even spend much time with weapons- I heard. He was more interested in his fist fighting techniques. From what Im getting off this board is that he was the 1st and only Buk Sing CLF propagator of his generation. I am aware of the reasoning behind the name and the lineage. Can any of you share anything more about T.S. -did he rally only teach 3 forms and no weapons. Why is there no pictures of him? I have painted portraits but no photographs.-Too old, no camereas back then? Please share any info on the Buk Sing you can.
Joseph
I think you are using artistic licence as well as imagination LOL.
Shaolin36
Have look at this story about Tam Sam on my website there is also a picture of Tam Sam there. http://alecmorris.topcities.com/baksing.htm
Fear not the man who has learned one thousand kicks, fear the man who has practiced one kick a thousand times.
for and indept history of master tam sam go to buksing.com and check out master vince lacey’s website. that is an incredible webpage, with lots of information on the buk sing branch.
I have a question on CLF history. I in my surfing around the net I have come across various versions of the CLF origin. All state that Chan Heung learned from Chan Yeun Wu, Lee Yau San and Choy Fook. All versions agree with this no problem there. One version states that Chan Heung went to learn from Choy Fook with a letter introduction from Lee Yau San and that Lee Yau San knew Choy Fook from the Shaolin temple. Another version states that both Lee Yau San and Choy Fook went to seek Choy Fook and become his desiples. However my schools version says that Chan Heung went seek Choy Fook neither with Lee Yau San or a letter of introduction. which one is corect.
Fear not the man who has learned one thousand kicks, fear the man who has practiced one kick a thousand times.
The reason for the CLF history question is that according to Chen Yong Fa’s version or translation Lee Yau San and Chan Heung both went to seek Choy Fook. But according to a translation by Chan Yiu Wun (fellow clans and a student of Chan Yiu Chi from king mui) from an old kung fu magazine Chan Heung was sent to Choy Fook with a letter of recommendation by Lee Yau San.
Fear not the man who has learned one thousand kicks, fear the man who has practiced one kick a thousand times.