iron ‘crotch’
you would be hard pressed to find any two schools
of thought that converge on how to obtain iron X.
with that said, honeysmacks… if you are learning
hsing-i at this time because of your senseis
interest, then you my friend are going to be
hella surprised when you learn of hsing-i iron
‘whatever’ training.
you may just go back to kenpo 
[This message was edited by cagey_vet on 07-24-01 at 05:08 PM.]
I’ve actually seen this on TV during prime time!!! I think it was CFMT network where a Chinese master went on stage to perform live in front of a studio and television audience. He tied a 500 pound weight to his hanging member and proceeded to lift the weight off the floor and swing in a clockwise path 
Other people, such as Shaolin monks just stand there and ask random people to kick them as hard as they can in the crotch. A good method for permanent contraception if you ask me
IronFist
You can find Kungfu Qigong at some Borders and Barnes & Nobles (if you don’t see us there, ask!) Both stores recently increased their orders with us. You can also subscribe…
Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com
The Iron Crocth article is on stands now
Don’t try this at home…
Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com
This thread is indicative of what commonly occurs on Martial Arts forums… Dabblers in Martial Arts speak as though they have some legitimate idea of what is authentic, healthy, useful, accepted, or the like when more often than not they are utterly talking out of their collective ass.
It’s amusing to see most of this thread shot down by the Magazine staff themselves, since Kung Fu Magazine clearly accepts the legitimacy of this ancient Nei Kung practice. It’s would be sad if it weren’t so obnoxious to see what parades as “Internal Practice” today. People think because their hands turn red when they run the Long Form that they have reached something notable in terms of Nei Kung.
Iron Crotch is real and it will destroy you and devour your ashes.
2001 called, it wants it’s dead thread back…
[QUOTE=BenDavid;817891]This thread is indicative of what commonly occurs on Martial Arts forums… Dabblers in Martial Arts speak as though they have some legitimate idea of what is authentic, healthy, useful, accepted, or the like when more often than not they are utterly talking out of their collective ass.
It’s amusing to see most of this thread shot down by the Magazine staff themselves, since Kung Fu Magazine clearly accepts the legitimacy of this ancient Nei Kung practice. It’s would be sad if it weren’t so obnoxious to see what parades as “Internal Practice” today. People think because their hands turn red when they run the Long Form that they have reached something notable in terms of Nei Kung.[/QUOTE]
and BTW, what, exactly, would you consider “something notable” in terms of so-called “internal practice”?
2001 called, it wants it’s dead thread back…
[QUOTE=BenDavid;817891]This thread is indicative of what commonly occurs on Martial Arts forums… Dabblers in Martial Arts speak as though they have some legitimate idea of what is authentic, healthy, useful, accepted, or the like when more often than not they are utterly talking out of their collective ass.[/QUOTE]
and let me guess, you are one of the elite few who has a “legitimate” idea and speaks out of the correct orifice?
[QUOTE=BenDavid;817891]It’s amusing to see most of this thread shot down by the Magazine staff themselves, since Kung Fu Magazine clearly accepts the legitimacy of this ancient Nei Kung practice. It’s would be sad if it weren’t so obnoxious to see what parades as “Internal Practice” today. People think because their hands turn red when they run the Long Form that they have reached something notable in terms of Nei Kung.[/QUOTE]
and what, exactly, do you consider to be “something notable” in terms of so-called “internal practice”?
I’m guessing that you’ve had a recent systemic autonomic response to something you’ve done “internally” and now feel “enlightened” :rolleyes:
Whatever i am, i am someone who follows my impulse at venting simultaneous amusement and annoyance with people who come on to a Nei Jia forum and don’t believe that the Nei Jia are anything “Nei” at all (a little bit of heat, if you are lucky, and otherwise, just axial mechanics). What i’m not is someone who cares to argue with you or prove myself. Venting and arguing are two totally different things: all done.
[QUOTE=BenDavid;818396]Whatever i am, i am someone who follows my impulse at venting simultaneous amusement and annoyance with people who come on to a Nei Jia forum and don’t believe that the Nei Jia are anything “Nei” at all (a little bit of heat, if you are lucky, and otherwise, just axial mechanics). What i’m not is someone who cares to argue with you or prove myself. Venting and arguing are two totally different things: all done.[/QUOTE]
I’m going to place your location somewhere in the area of Cincinatti Ohio…
Am I correct?
[QUOTE=BenDavid;817891]This thread is indicative of what commonly occurs on Martial Arts forums… Dabblers in Martial Arts speak as though they have some legitimate idea of what is authentic, healthy, useful, accepted, or the like when more often than not they are utterly talking out of their collective ass.
It’s amusing to see most of this thread shot down by the Magazine staff themselves, since Kung Fu Magazine clearly accepts the legitimacy of this ancient Nei Kung practice. It’s would be sad if it weren’t so obnoxious to see what parades as “Internal Practice” today. People think because their hands turn red when they run the Long Form that they have reached something notable in terms of Nei Kung.[/QUOTE]
true enough. can;t argue with you on these points. i think when it comes to internal people just think about the movies and not the practical. they think they gonna learn some david coperfeild sh!t. when from what i learned in my last four or so years in the internal is that its just extremely sophisticated mody mechanics, combined with the bodies own intrensic energy used to cultivate health. i’ve had defferent feeling from practicing and sometimes i had none at all. my sifu would tell me don’t worry about feeling chi, its there its always there. anyway don;t know what this thread is about just saw your post and agreed with your points. later
[QUOTE=doug maverick;818436]true enough. can;t argue with you on these points. i think when it comes to internal people just think about the movies and not the practical. they think they gonna learn some david coperfeild sh!t. when from what i learned in my last four or so years in the internal is that its just extremely sophisticated mody mechanics, combined with the bodies own intrensic energy used to cultivate health. i’ve had defferent feeling from practicing and sometimes i had none at all. my sifu would tell me don’t worry about feeling chi, its there its always there. anyway don;t know what this thread is about just saw your post and agreed with your points. later[/QUOTE]
I don’t know if “practical” is a good designation for swinging weights from your junk to attain sexual powers, Taoist immortality or “spiritual powers.” There’s not really any practical martial use for iron crotch. How many nei jia chuan masters have you heard of now or a hundred years ago that were/are purported to have done so? Meanwhile there’s many that speak on its dangers.
After over half a decade of slumber, Iron Crotch returns to wreak havoc upon the unsuspecting weak-genitalled masses…
[QUOTE=Zenshiite;818474]I don’t know if “practical” is a good designation for swinging weights from your junk to attain sexual powers, Taoist immortality or “spiritual powers.” There’s not really any practical martial use for iron crotch. How many nei jia chuan masters have you heard of now or a hundred years ago that were/are purported to have done so? Meanwhile there’s many that speak on its dangers.[/QUOTE]
Actually this is a very common practice and MOST Nei Jia masters throughout the centuries have practiced this. The practice is documented in the Shaolin Temple, as well as by Daoist hygienists for over 1000 years. The Celestial Masters and the Yellow Turbans specifically responded to groups that grew too aggressive from this practice and became “Qi Vampires” raping women. The practice existed, but is generally only taught to Inner Door students.
Name just about ANY Xingyi teacher of notoriety and they practice this. Mantak Chia practices and teaches this as well. The “big names” who DON’T practice this are in the minority.
i’d be curious as to what specific Nei Jia masters in the past two hundred years have actually decried this practice.
As for saying “There’s not really any practical martial use for iron crotch,” the moderators and owners of this site disagree with you. Stick around in the Nei Jia scene for a while and you’ll find out just how inaccurate that statement is
[QUOTE=BenDavid;818498]Actually this is a very common practice and MOST Nei Jia masters throughout the centuries have practiced this. The practice is documented in the Shaolin Temple, as well as by Daoist hygienists for over 1000 years. The Celestial Masters and the Yellow Turbans specifically responded to groups that grew too aggressive from this practice and became “Qi Vampires” raping women. The practice existed, but is generally only taught to Inner Door students.
Name just about ANY Xingyi teacher of notoriety and they practice this. Mantak Chia practices and teaches this as well. The “big names” who DON’T practice this are in the minority.
i’d be curious as to what specific Nei Jia masters in the past two hundred years have actually decried this practice.
As for saying “There’s not really any practical martial use for iron crotch,” the moderators and owners of this site disagree with you. Stick around in the Nei Jia scene for a while and you’ll find out just how inaccurate that statement is :)[/QUOTE]
Uh huh. And you’ve been in the Nei Jia scene just how long?
Been training in Martial Arts since 1994 and specifically the Nei Jia since 2000. i am a multi-lineaged instructor in two styles of Xingyi, one of Bagua and two (working on the third), of T’aiji, i’m employed by local parks (which offer courses), and Career Centers on a regular, quarterly basis, as well as teaching for my Shifu.
As a Daoist lineage holder i’ve been taught “Iron Crotch,” practice it mildly (usually not using over 50 lbs), and i teach it as well. In addition to this, i have studied (and continue to study), historical Daoist cultivation methods at the University level with a Harvard Graduate PhD who is far more knowledgeable about the historicity of these practices than myself.
[QUOTE=BenDavid;818396]Whatever i am, i am someone who follows my impulse at venting simultaneous amusement and annoyance with people who come on to a Nei Jia forum and don’t believe that the Nei Jia are anything “Nei” at all (a little bit of heat, if you are lucky, and otherwise, just axial mechanics). What i’m not is someone who cares to argue with you or prove myself. Venting and arguing are two totally different things: all done.[/QUOTE]
so you were just venting, huh? ok, fair enough…as to arguing, there is no argument - you come on as an unknown individual to a forum with an air of superiority making some statements critical of how many people perceive / embody internal practice, in a way that implied that you are “in the know” as to what the real deal is; I’m simply asking what qualifies you to take that posture; certainly, you are under no obligation to “prove” anything, but if you present yourself as someone with some authority on a subject, then it only follows reasonably that others will ask for you to support your claims; what is interesting is that after coming on in a rather opinionated manner that you default to the old “I don’t have to prove anything to anyone” bit instead of stating straight out what the nature of your experience and background is; so hey, answer, don’t answer, no difference really, that’s certainly your purview; of course, sooner or later everyone’s perspective becomes apparent either directly or otherwise via their posts here, so it all comes out in the wash one way or another
[QUOTE=BenDavid;818639]Been training in Martial Arts since 1994 and specifically the Nei Jia since 2000. i am a multi-lineaged instructor in two styles of Xingyi, one of Bagua and two (working on the third), of T’aiji, i’m employed by local parks (which offer courses), and Career Centers on a regular, quarterly basis, as well as teaching for my Shifu.
As a Daoist lineage holder i’ve been taught “Iron Crotch,” practice it mildly (usually not using over 50 lbs), and i teach it as well. In addition to this, i have studied (and continue to study), historical Daoist cultivation methods at the University level with a Harvard Graduate PhD who is far more knowledgeable about the historicity of these practices than myself.[/QUOTE]
now there ya go!
just a follow-up question: what exactly do you mean by “lineage holder”? and what sect do you hold it in?
[QUOTE=cjurakpt;818641]so you were just venting, huh? ok, fair enough…as to arguing, there is no argument - you come on as an unknown individual to a forum with an air of superiority making some statements critical of how many people perceive / embody internal practice, in a way that implied that you are “in the know” as to what the real deal is; I’m simply asking what qualifies you to take that posture; certainly, you are under no obligation to “prove” anything, but if you present yourself as someone with some authority on a subject, then it only follows reasonably that others will ask for you to support your claims; what is interesting is that after coming on in a rather opinionated manner that you default to the old “I don’t have to prove anything to anyone” bit instead of stating straight out what the nature of your experience and background is; so hey, answer, don’t answer, no difference really, that’s certainly your purview; of course, sooner or later everyone’s perspective becomes apparent either directly or otherwise via their posts here, so it all comes out in the wash one way or another[/QUOTE]
Yep, just venting; and trying to dodge debates, to be honest. i’ve seen plenty of tautological debating on the internet, and it usually doesn’t benefit anyone.
My take is that MOST people into Nei Jia ARE IN THE KNOW that there IS more to the Nei Jia than advanced mechanics and a mild increase in circulation of qi to the extremities. i don’t claim to be “in the know” of something that isn’t common knowledge amongst most well known Nei Jia instructors.
What i do claim to be in the know of is what many message forum frequenters are not in the know of. This isn’t meant to single anyone specifically out… i just saw it as being the case with a lot of the posts on this thread. i don’t normally frequent this forum (or any for that matter), but this thread was brought to my attention by someone who i taught the practice to.
Unfortunately, many people take a seminar here and there, and then speak like they have some authority with which to dismiss advanced Nei Kung practices. Frankly, this is both irritating and is a disservice to instructors and students of Nei Jia. There is MUCH that we can ALL learn if we open our minds to the possibilities that the arbitrary limitations we have come to place on our practices are not necessarily anything but self-imposed limitations.
As i said, i don’t know of ANY Xingyi teachers who do not either practice “Iron Crotch” or accept that it is a very beneficial Nei Kung practice which they should do more often. This is not some obscure practice, nor is it dangerous if one has been taught how to do it properly (just as most of Martial Arts are dangerous if not properly instructed). i’ll be the FIRST to admit that the first time i heard of it i thought it was a joke (literally, as in made up). i also didn’t take “Iron Shirt” practices very seriously in the beginning.
What i hate to see is people imagining that the Nei Jia are just a different approach to mechanics and some mild use of Qi Kung (when in fact all Chinese Martial Arts employ Qi Kung to some extent). Unfortunately, in the U.S. (and perhaps elsewhere), there is a new generation of Nei Jia practitioner who dismisses much of the potential of the systems as legend. That’s fine, this is only their loss (and is perhaps Nature’s way of selecting who attains what level of skill), but for whatever purpose, i felt the impulse to comment on the matter when the thread was shown to me.
now there ya go!
just a follow-up question: what exactly do you mean by “lineage holder”? and what sect do you hold it in?
At first i thought you meant which Nei Jia styles am i lineaged in, so i listed them (all of them being Daoist in origin according in one manner or another). i study and am lineaged in other systems, but all three of the “Nei Jia” as Sun, Lu-T’ang characterized them, and as relevant to this forum.
…however, after posting, i re-read and it seems you mean “Daoist” lineage in and of itself. While i meant primary lineages in Hebei Xingyi, Yang T’aiji and Cheng Bagua (as well as other variants of each, which i had listed), i think - as stated - that you might mean what Daoist sect itself. If this is what you mean, this is another issue altogether, and one that i’d be happy to discuss through email, as it’s not an Order that has historically been public about itself (practically, or in terms of being Daoist), nor is it any major sect of Daoism (though it is Daoist). As such, i don’t want to open up tangential avenues of discussion on the same thread.
dude i wasn’t talking about none of that swinging **** from your c ock nonsence. i was just saying that his thoughts were a bit insightful. my sifu never did that (one of his sifu’s wang shu chin did thou, at least thats what i was told)