Originally posted by Chen Zen I just started my Wing Chun training after years of other arts.
Welcome to the art. Hope you stick around long enough to learn it.
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Eager to test what I had learned I went to a karateka friends house and we began sparring. It seemed to me that Wing Chun was weak against attacks that didnt follow the centerline. Is this just in the beginning?
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No, it’s just you. If you had to fight now, you’d be better off forgetting what you know of Wing Chun.
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I just started Sil Lum Doa so I am not an advanced Wing Chun artist but I am a skilled fighter. What do you think? Was I applying it wrong or is it defecient? Thank you. Chen Zen [/B]
You don’t need Wing Chun to fight, but if you want to fight with Wing Chun, it requires more time than you’ve given it. I can guarantee that if all you’ve learned is SNT, then you were not using Wing Chun when you “sparred.”
Originally posted by Grendel You don’t need Wing Chun to fight, but if you want to fight with Wing Chun, it requires more time than you’ve given it. I can guarantee that if all you’ve learned is SNT, then you were not using Wing Chun when you “sparred.”
Grendel, Well said. I’ll warrant that guarantee as well.
Originally posted by Matrix
[B] Sorry Chen Zen, I think you missed my point. I’m sure that you are a quick study, however, there is a lot of things that are unseen to you at this time. Do not overlook the subtleties. Sorry to sound like a bad fortune cookie, but enjoy the journey and look beyond the obvious - there is more to the journey than focusing strictly on the destination.
Matrix [/B]
I was quite taken a back by the comment you were refering too. I thought it a bit arrogant that some one could suggest they could apply wing chun principles after a couple of months cause they were quick learners and used to sparring. I think those things will hinder your learning as one may be to tied to previous learnings to effectivly use wing chun, as the poster originaly suggested by his issues with winging attacks. Anyways, good points you made, and I couldn’t agree more with what you said.
Originally posted by tparkerkfo I thought it a bit arrogant that some one could suggest they could apply wing chun principles after a couple of months cause they were quick learners and used to sparring. I think those things will hinder your learning as one may be to tied to previous learnings to effectivly use wing chun, as the poster originaly suggested by his issues with winging attacks.
Tom,
Thanks. I don’t consider Chen Zen’s comments to be arrogant. I think he is taking his experience from previous arts and assuming that it applies equally to Wing Chun. I believe that to a large degree, you need to let go of previous belief systems that you’ve picked up from other arts. You must empty your cup or there is no room for for the new. I think it is a serious error in judgement and as you’ve pointed out, it will hinder learning beyond the most superficial concepts. I’ll chalk it up to the exuberance of youth…I remember it well.
Thanks. I don’t consider Chen Zen’s comments to be arrogant. I think he is taking his experience from previous arts and assuming that it applies equally to Wing Chun. I believe that to a large degree, you need to let go of previous belief systems that you’ve picked up from other arts. You must empty your cup or there is no room for for the new. I think it is a serious error in judgement and as you’ve pointed out, it will hinder learning beyond the most superficial concepts. I’ll chalk it up to the exuberance of youth…I remember it well.
Matrix [/B]
What’s your experience been like in letting go of previous arts you’ve studied? Biggest personal challenges? What sort of milestones are helping you realize that the “letting go” is taking place?
Originally posted by Chen Zen Hello All. I just started my Wing Chun training after years of other arts. Eager to test what I had learned I went to a karateka friends house and we began sparring. It seemed to me that Wing Chun was weak against attacks that didnt follow the centerline. Is this just in the beginning? I just started Sil Lum Doa so I am not an advanced Wing Chun artist but I am a skilled fighter. What do you think? Was I applying it wrong or is it defecient? Thank you. Chen Zen
If you’ve just started training don’t expect to have good results. Wing Chun is all about the footwork. You need to keep moving and strike once contact has been established.
Thank you all. I realize that I do not have a full understanding of the art but I think I may progress along faster than most as I have been in love with kung fu and have studied many of its concepts for some time now. Now I am simply learning how to put the concepts into motion.
Originally posted by burnsypoo What’s your experience been like in letting go of previous arts you’ve studied? Biggest personal challenges? What sort of milestones are helping you realize that the “letting go” is taking place?
Great questions. It has been a tough road I would say, but getting somewhat easier with time. It’s not trivial to over-write years of training and I’m not getting any younger. So many times I have thought that it would have been better to never have trained in anything else before. Entering the art with a completely empty cup, and starting much earlier with no “bad habits” to break.
Biggest Challenges? Learning to relax, really relax, and not depend so much on physical strength. Also, just letting things happen as opposed to having a preset series of techniques to use in a “what if” set of conditions. I am not a naturally gifted Martial Artist, not like some people I know, so every day is a challenge. But I’m fine with that. I just love to get out there and see what the day has to offer.
Milestones? Nothing that distinct. It’s as if you just come to the realization that you are doing things without much effort when you used to struggle. Looking back you can see how far you’ve come. Looking forward, you see that there is so much further to go.
Originally posted by Chen Zen Thank you all. I realize that I do not have a full understanding of the art but I think I may progress along faster than most as I have been in love with kung fu and have studied many of its concepts for some time now. Now I am simply learning how to put the concepts into motion.
Well, it is good to know the rest of us arn’t in love with kung fu. LOL. This is part of the arrogance I was talking about earlier. Few have a full understanding of wing chun, which can only come after years of training with a really good teacher. Wing Chun is not like other arts and its concepts are quite unique in many ways. It takes a very long time to ingrain these training methods in my opinion. I don’t mean to sound discouraging, but I don’t think you can simply be in love with martial arts and “simply learn how to put the concepts into motions”. And this shows with the intial comments. If it was so easy, more people would be doing it.
the centerline really works against everything. its really awsome. with looping attacks you face the attack with your centerline (with a few exceptions). but yeah, it just tacks some getting used to and figuring out how to really use it. but once you have it down its almost like holding up a shield.
Why does a comment make you arrogant or immature. Just because I just started the physical aspect of wing chun does not mean that I dont know anything about it. I have studied philosophy and concept longer than most people have been practicing. I dont need people to tell me that you cant learn this or that this fast or apply it this quickly. BS. I can I will and unlees you know me and my background do not assume otherwise. Thank You.:mad:
Originally posted by Chen Zen Just because I just started the physical aspect of wing chun does not mean that I dont know anything about it. I have studied philosophy and concept longer than most people have been practicing. I dont need people to tell me that you cant learn this or that this fast or apply it this quickly. BS. I can I will and unlees you know me and my background do not assume otherwise. Thank You.:mad:
Most of us speaking from experience realize that we too started with the hope and expectation of learning Wing Chun fast, but because it is an internal art, and for most Westerners, especially men, involves unlearning a lifetime’s habits, we find ourselves frustrated at each plateau of learning.
The difference between mediocrity, average ability, and true mastery is measured in millimeters and many intelligently spent hours.
Without knowing you, I can say that if you think what has been written doesn’t apply, then from experience I can predict what success you will have in “learning” fast.
The secret of Wing Chun is hard work. Few find the right teacher. Few have what it takes.
If you don’t see the arogance in your posts, then I don’t know what to tell you. Look up arogance in the dictionary and then reflect.
Hey, if you can it, great. More power to you. I would be truely impressed if you can just start learning wing chun and then apply it well.
But this leads me to ask why you asked the question you did to start the post off? Didn’t you say you had a problem with cicular attacks? Didn’t you have questions about the center line? Obviously you didn’t study this concept as much as your telling us.
Wing Chun is not at all like other arts. You asked a question and the resonse was that it takes time to learn. Having experience in other arts does not translate to wing chun. Trust us. Many of us here have also studied other arts. You seem to think different. Fine. But you shouldn’t get angry when you ask a question and people respond.
First off the question I posted was asking if there were techniques in Wing Chun that dealt specifically with circular attacks. I have no problem with people answering my posts but you have called me arrogant one to many times for me to bite my tongue as I did the last time. I am here to learn new information NOT to justify my ability especially to a total stranger. I KNOW what I can do whether or not you believe it or if is faster than you caught on. Just because it took you as long as it did doesnt mean that it will take me that long or even half that long. Its all relative to how you train, how long, and how hard and I train longer and harder than anyone I know. Its post like yours that made me leave the last forum I belonged to. Because people cant choose there words a little more effectively. You could have said “I dont think you are grasping the whole concept” instead of calling me arrogant. Instead of belittling me you could have made your point with offense to no one. I hope your Martial Skills aren’t as sloppy and half assed as your reponses. -Chen Zen
