I have heard that there was an individual who was trying to claim that he learned Tai Mantis from Kam Yuen, now let me say this I know Kam Yuen personally and I also have spoken with him and his most advanced students, and they all agree that Mike Marshall is in no way qualified to teach Tai Mantis, they also go on to say that Mike Marshall couldn’t hold his own against the most beginning student in any Kung Fu art,or a person with any martial art background. He has excellent form but his talent goes no further.
If you would research you would find out that Mike Marshall was kicked out of the Tai Mantis association because he brought shame to himself and the art. In general he basically paid for his sifu credential which Kam Yuen has staed he regrets to this day. Kam Yuen disciples are real fighters and in his hey day it was said that if you got in a real fight and for some reason lost you’d be kicked out of class. There are very few qualified to teach tai mantis but if you’re fortunate to find an authentic tai mantis instructor, I need not say anymore… 
why?
Question why would anyone claim to be something that they are not? I had a student who I taught privately for 1 year! 2 years later I come to find out she opened a school near by, when I heard that she claimed to teach 8 step praying mantis I called to ask who she learned from. She made up a name and then went on to say most of her training was in 7 star! which she knows nothing about! worst off she has a lot of students who dont know any better! their should be some sorta state requirement or law against such things.M.A.A.U.T martial artists against unqualified teachers!!!
Response
This is so true, not to say anything bad about Mike Marshall he is a nice person. But unfortunately he doesn’t know the first thing about combat mantis.
I can recall a situation when Mike was trying to teach a class and a new prospective student came in to see what mantis was all about and mike tried to show the prospective student a mantis move and Mike was put to the ground.
Maybe if he had put more time into sparring, bag training, I can remember that he spent all his time on form training, even though Sifu Kam gave him every opportunity to learn to fight well, to sum this up Mike is a disgrace to the enire martial art community.
[This message was edited by socalimantis on 06-24-01 at 09:19 PM.]
Fake Sifus and Mike Marshall
This is funny and ironic as well. because when I visited Kam Yuen’s school, " Shaolin West" in Canoga Park in 1996 and spoke with Sifu Mike Marshall and we were speaking of and demonstrating sets and invited them to the tournament that my sifu at the time was sponsoring, He was teaching class and said that he was getting paid or exchanging services to teach classes by Kam Yuen and was known to be affiliated with this group for a long time. And now that something happened that we dont know about all of a sudden he is not legit. Thats funny.
" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"
Funny Huh???
well back then I can recall that he started to train at the Torrance school, at the beginners level, stayed for about 3 months or so and then he disappeared for years, and all of a sudden he popped up at the woodland hills school.
He was a young kid at the time and he was supposedely certified in a year by Sifu Kam, Sifu felt sorry for him and thats why he allowed him to work there in exchange for his services, and if you’d ask him back then he’d say the same he says now that Mike Marshall has excellent forms but in a real fight his advice to mike would be to run. I wont get into the specifics of why Mike was kicked out of the Tai Mantis clan but all I can say is that he is a real DISGRACE!!!Sifu Kam Yuens real students dont compete in tournaments, are taught traditional Kung Fu and to my knowledge they all are real Kung Fu fighters. Sifu Kam wouldn’t have it any other way.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=“-1”>quote:</font><HR> Sifu Kam Yuens real students dont compete in tournaments, are taught traditional Kung Fu and to my knowledge they all are real Kung Fu fighters [/quote]
just curious… isn’t manuel marquez a student of kam yuen? because his students dress up like monks and run around at tournaments doing contemporary wushu in traditional divisions… this always confused the $%*& out of me as i have heard nothing but good things about kam yuen.
???
Sifu Kam Yuen is in my opinion one of the only traditional Kung Fu masters around today. This person you speak of took some classes from Kam Yuen and he has incooperated it into his own style of martial arts.
The only students that I am aware that Sifu Kam Yuen has placed his name on and has said “Yes these students can Fight as well as teach this system as it was taught to me” are Rob Moses and Scott Cohen he has given the keys to his most advanced student which is Scott Cohen.
What I never understood was why Kam Yuen teaches Tai Chi Praying Mantis, but is not a part of the Chui Chuk Kai Tai Mantis Federation (I’m not sure if I got the name right…at any rate, it is the group that the “Twelve Successors” of which the last grandmaster belong). Does he not have his own Tai Chi Praying Mantis association, completely separate from the others? What really confuses the issue for me, an outsider to the system, is that in Paul Eng’s books, he claims his Seven Star Praying Mantis lineage from Kam Yuen. However, Paul Eng is also President of the aforementioned federation (the one with all of Tai Chi Praying Mantis sifu who were given permission to teach by Chui Chuk Kai). If Paul Eng and Kam Yuen know each other so well, couldn’t Paul Eng simply put Kam Yuen in the “official” Tai Chi Praying Mantis Federation? Ah well. Don’t you just love kungfu politics? 
“Sifu Kam Yuen is in my opinion one of the only traditional Kung Fu masters around today.”
yeah its real funny. it’s real funny. You should get out more.
" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"
[This message was edited by KickingMantis on 06-25-01 at 11:39 PM.]
Politics
Kam Yuen is a very humble person and besides he has a medical practice to operate. He is Paul Eng cousin.
Welllll…
This is interesting.
Its too bad Sigung isnt alive today to put an end to this… oh wait!
Thats right… Sigung is recognized by most of the traditional Northern Praying Mantis masters in Shantung… But because Grandmaster Chiu altered the style, none of his students are recognized in this fashion as “authentic” or “official” masters of the Tai Chi Mantis line…
Who is to say who is legitimate…
goodness… politcs at their finest…
oops…
Telephone interrupted that last…
What I mean is, that the Kungfu we learn form Ly Sifu is by no means “fake” just because someone in Shantung does not want to call him the official lineage holder…
They still respect his Sifu and his kungfu.
I know I have the real deal.
What seems to be the issue? I guess Thats what confuses me.
Politics
Kam Yuen is the real deal…
Social Mantis said:
In general he basically paid for his sifu credential which Kam Yuen has staed he regrets to this day.
Did Kam Yuen return the money after he kicked him out? I’m just wondering…
I am a big beleiver in luck. The more I work, the more luck I have.
No Refund
I cant say Sifu Kam actually did that, but I can say that if it was me I would have never gave him a dime because Sifu Kam treated him as an adopted son he allowed him to come to his home, allowed him to work in exchange for training you can’t put a price on the training that Sifu Kam taught and besides he also gave him free meals and gave him spending money also.
He even gave him the opportunity to train with him and David Carradine, when David would train.
What else could a person ask for???
It appears as if this is a Kam Yuen, Shaolin West & TaiChi Mantis family affair.
But its typical human relations issues that happens in and out of the martial arts. When you on good terms with someone and every one is getting along. Every one is good and dandy, once people stop getting along they are the worst, their credentials are no good, and they bought or learned everything they know from video tapes.
" Moss Never Grows on a Rolling Stone"
DAVID WHO!?!?
Look, I don’t know any of the folks involved personally, but if Mike Marshall was trained alongside DAVID CARRIDINE, he’s gotta be like a god or something!
Seriously though, why WAS Mr. Marshall granted the right to teach if he wasn’t any good? Trust me my friend, this little controversey is making your school look far worse than any lack of skill on Marshall’s part could have done.
Your slander reflects a lack of character, and a deficiency in YOUR training. Who knows? YOU might be next on the list of the “recently dropped”.
“Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone”
trust me brothers!
If you would have known what Mike Marshall did you all would agree and want to kick his ass too.
He got b**** slapped by Kam Yuen, so he must have did something very awful for Sifu Kam to do that, Sifu Kam knew Mike couldn’t last with him not even 5 seconds in a real fight so he just humiliated him and kicked him out.
Like I said before Sifu Kam regrets it to this day, the association he had with Mike Marshall. You must remember we are all human and we make mistakes too.
You could ask any student of Kam Yuen lineage and they all will agree that Mike Marshall has never been a sifu and never will be.
The pudding is in the cake.
Ask mike why he cant fight. Why he could never break down any forms into applications, why he could never spar. I could go on and on about Mike but if you weren’t there you have no business commenting on something you know nothing about.
As far as the association it is highly recognized from Hong Kong to America and Sifu Kam Yuen and his cousin Paul Eng is one of the only recognized teachers of this rare and aggresive art.
Huh?
Sorry buddy, but it ismy business, and everyone else’s on this forum. You brought up this topic! Many people who read your post are going to be forming an opinion now either for or against Mike Marshall. You have provided no details whatsoever to back up your opinion that he “sucks”, and “can’t fight”. Furthermore, you haven’t told us why he was kicked out of your organization. For all I know, he could have left on his own free will.
This blatant attempt to slander Mr. Marshall on the grounds that he isn’t any good is frankly laughable! You have admmited in the Tai Chi Forum that you have not yet even decided what style you would like to study! On what basis do you feel qualified to judge anythingabout Marshall’s skill?
Again, I assert that you are displaying a gross lack of character. If you are really so concerned about your schools Rep’, please don’t mention your teacher’s name. I am certain that any respectable Sifu would be embarrassed by your actions.
I know of a nice bridge in the KF Forum where billy goats occassionaly cross. Perhaps you’ll find better company under there.
SIFU’S
I don’t know alot about the situation but it reminds me of something…
A long time ago I studied Kenpo. One of the Senior students, an extremely talented guy, had just returned to the school.
A short time later I had heard he disrespected the sensei and got his can kicked in to the point of tears and ejected.
Apparently they made up and now the disciple has opened his own school with full blessings.
The fact is our Sifu’s, Sensei’s and what not invest alot of time in developing us. It’s not always about the money. Like any good father the push, pull and mold us to the best of their experience. Sometimes we let them down, make them cross or even angry.
It seems in this situation to many people are speculating. This is between the Master and Mr. Marshall. Maybe they will patch things up. Too much of this kind of crap happens in the MA in general. The only ones who lose are us all.
Peace :rolleyes: