suggestions for basic beginner solitary practice?

Nei Jia: the Qigong and Taijiquan Forum Qigong and Meditation
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hey gents - i was wondering if anyone could suggest to me, a starter set of chi kung that i could give a shot on my own? something general for health thatd be ok to try by myself.

background - did some wuzuquan kung fu in my mid-late teens off and on , in college did some shotokan, and some shaolin kung fu/tai chi - never got beyond the basics with any of it though, i tended to take the beginner classes over and over. basically dropped out of it all around 25, and am now 38..

never did any chi work, thought i’d give it a bit of a try and see if it calls to me. thinking back now, i kinda wish i’d stuck with some it, but, as they say, that was then, this is now.

any suggestions appreciated :wink:

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I was in a rather similar situation to yours a few years ago and I’d suggest a combination of zhan zhuang and sitting meditation. You can always build on it with movement exercises later, or in parallel.

My take on it would be that if you don’t have a teacher you don’t want to do intricate exercises where you manipulate chi. Better perhaps to do simple exercises that cultivate chi naturally and let the body open up on its own.

Here are two books that explain their subjects well enough to work without a teacher and that are “safe” in the sense that you won’t injure yourself or have a meditation freakout as long as you follow the instructions. Other people will probably have other ideas, but these two books are what I would go for. These both give you reliable, real stuff in my opinion.

The Way of Energy
http://www.amazon.com/The-Way-Energy-Mastering-Internal/dp/0671736450/

The Method of No Method
http://www.amazon.com/The-Method-No-Method-Practice-Illumination/dp/1590305752/

As a complement to the latter you could also look at the section on sitting meditation and following the breath in
Hoofprint of the Ox
http://www.amazon.com/Hoofprint-Ox-Principles-Buddhist-Chinese/dp/0195152484/

These are just a couple of ideas that you could compare with other people’s suggestions. Good luck finding what suits you best.

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I put together a collection of links here.

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Try out my ykt drills
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNAlfwK5C_Y

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I would echo rett’s words. Here is a series on zhan zhuang worth watching:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y07FauHYlmg

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I really suggest you find a good teacher. :slight_smile:

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[QUOTE=RickMatz;1195289]I put together a collection of links here.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the links. Nice page.

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[QUOTE=madhusudan;1196044]I would echo rett’s words. Here is a series on zhan zhuang worth watching:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y07FauHYlmg[/QUOTE]

Nice video, thanks!

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[QUOTE=Hendrik;1195518]Try out my ykt drills
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNAlfwK5C_Y[/QUOTE]

Hendrik, thanks for the video lesson.

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[QUOTE=Neeros;1196047]I really suggest you find a good teacher. :)[/QUOTE]

Probably the best course. But they can be hard to find. And perhaps trying to get started on one’s own is a way to be a good student.

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[QUOTE=rett;1196984]Probably the best course. But they can be hard to find. And perhaps trying to get started on one’s own is a way to be a good student.[/QUOTE]

No. It’s a way to build bad habits and which will be harder to get rid of than to train good habits from scratch. Likely it will prove fruitless entirely as there’s no partner to train with, and even if there were there’s no one to correct.

Proper instruction is the only way.

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[QUOTE=Bacon;1196985]No. It’s a way to build bad habits and which will be harder to get rid of than to train good habits from scratch. Likely it will prove fruitless entirely as there’s no partner to train with, and even if there were there’s no one to correct.

Proper instruction is the only way.[/QUOTE]

What you describe can happen, I’m sure, and I try to keep that in mind. But I believe that if you’re sensible and follow the instructions you can derive benefit from a video course like the one posted by madhusudan above, or from the corresponding book.

What do you use a partner for in zhan zhuang?

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The best thing a beginner can do on their own is go pay for some fitness instruction and get their basic strength and cardio up. Past that anything else is a hindrance rather than help. You need a teacher.

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[QUOTE=rett;1196986]What you describe can happen, I’m sure, and I try to keep that in mind. But I believe that if you’re sensible and follow the instructions you can derive benefit from a video course like the one posted by madhusudan above, or from the corresponding book.

What do you use a partner for in zhan zhuang?[/QUOTE]

Hi rett,

hope all is going well. I’ve seen videos where partner is used to correct natural feeling in the posture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUTW0CjGebw

I’ve seen better videos explaining it- but that’s the central idea [from the video]. A Partner can be an “expedient” device in your zhan zhuang.

The teacher in the video has mentioned in his videos he would rather his students do this type of “push hands” to learn standing stake skill rather than have them just do standing stake. This type of practice “internal push hands” also has strong medical implications I bet.

IMO, a proper teacher will teach you standing stake such that the posture will naturally open -this is my experience through Master Wu/De Jian at least with my Zhan Zhuang.

Solo zhan zhuang is powerful cultivation

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Matthew, howdy :slight_smile: Thanks for the video and ideas. It reminds me of some of the ways they use push-hands methods to test standing structure in the taiji group I attend. So I stand corrected.

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[QUOTE=rett;1197325]Matthew, howdy :slight_smile: Thanks for the video and ideas. It reminds me of some of the ways they use push-hands methods to test standing structure in the taiji group I attend.[/QUOTE]

I know there are videos of other teachers doing that too - notably I can remember a couple videos of Chen Xiao Wang doing it.

As I understand it - it works for healing too - when someone has tension at a point in their spine/body, you can push through to that ‘spot’ (the kink in their posture that allows you to “push” them as it were), and instead of actually pushing them off balance, quickly release it using the opposite vector to that which you pushed it with - with I think helps release the tension there…

Similar to using reverse pressure to “suck” out the tension if I am explaining that at all.

[QUOTE=rett;1197325]So I stand corrected.[/QUOTE]

I really appreciate the punniness :smiley:

and my post wasn’t aimed at your previous discussion with other folks, I merely interrupted and posted what I saw as relevant FYI.

Solo Zhan Zhuang is very important for full benefit and..

IMO, one can absolutely practice Zhan Zhuang without a teacher and see great benefit as long as they follow natural method, as you touched on!

I really agree with you about your point in trying complicated things without a teacher too

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[QUOTE=5_fists;1195260]hey gents - i was wondering if anyone could suggest to me, a starter set of chi kung that i could give a shot on my own?

never did any chi work, thought i’d give it a bit of a try and see if it calls to me. thinking back now, i kinda wish i’d stuck with some it, but, as they say, that was then, this is now.

any suggestions appreciated ;)[/QUOTE]

Hi 5_fists. I realized in responding to rett, I might just elaborate for you on Zhan Zhuang since I believe it can benefit.

Firstly I want to say, dropping preconceived notions about qi gong, qi, internal this or that, etc was very hard for me to do and took me actually meeting my master to do - there is a tendency to not fully believe/fully commit to something you read online and a greater tendency to mix various things, which yields far less benefit IMO.

I really believe in following the natural method (ZiRan) whether or not one has a teacher.

That is to say - not trying to move Intent, Qi, not trying to tense certain parts of the body, not trying to visualize magic anything, and practicing especially as long as there are not continual discomfort or pains.

I’d say trying anymore than this before you were comfortable could be too much for beginners, elderly, sickly, or those used to external practice:

-breathing should always be comfortable, not forcing deep breath at all.
-allow your breathing to slow
-Drop your tailbone (“tuck the butt”) such that the lower spine is straight up and down
-Knees not locked (slightly bent) - this isn’t the movies, starting very low will not help and is not natural.
-Weight is dominately over bubbling spring (front part of feet)
-Feet at one-foot’s-width apart (directly under your hip joints)
-relax body (joints, spine, limbs, anus)
-natural breathing to start
-slight chin tuck (to raise back of the neck more vertical)
-hands can be at the side or slightly infront of the Dan Tian (just below below belly button)
-teeth together/mouth closed with tongue softly touching the roof of the mouth
-eyes can be a small bit squinted/focused if comfortable

I’d also follow what you read here: http://www.chanwuyi.org/showroom/model/T0303/templateCustomWebPage.do?webId=1233929329351&editCurrentLanguage=1235069892126&customWebPageId=1285509549671457351 - and read the following few pages which includes elaboration on Zhan Zhuang)

Stand as you are comfortable. If that is only 2 minutes then do it 2 minutes - if you can for 10 minutes, do it for 10. Beyond this there are further adjustments to zhan zhuang that can be practiced.

Once you are entirely familiar with the above methods- simply add in these 2 breathing focus points:

  1. When inhaling, put focus on your dantian/lower abdominal area.
    When exhaling, put focus on your nose.

  2. Exhaling is akin to pushing a ball under water. you exhale, but the inhale rises of its own accord, not forced.

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That’s a really nice list of key points, thanks:)

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i am considering a zz program at www.apricotforesthall.com .
see also mit qigong.

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Until You Get a Teacher[needed]-ish; Listen to Your Pulse with Your Mind

Until you get a teacher in this, since it’s breathing and breathing wrong could mess you over, listen for your blood curculating. Visualize a place infront of the pulse. When you can listen to your pusle with your mind and tag the in-front of it. Tag the just after of it. Thiese practices/this practice might be something-or-otheruntil and when you meet an authorized teacher of Chi Kung/qigong.

No_Know