[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;897002]Actually, they typically have only one MA coach and one trainer and while I agree that having 8 hours to train a day would certainly shorten the learning curve, I think its safe to say that it shouldn’t take people YEARS to be able to functionally do their chosen MA, when other can do it in far less time.
Also, don’t forget that I am not referring to the stunts, which are probably done by stunt men anyways, I am, typically refering to how they LOOK doing standard MA moves.[/QUOTE]
Well, considering the fact that I am just starting my MA journey at the age of 30, I hope it doesn’t take me years to be functional either. It sounds like from those with a lot of experience in MA that a lot of schools teach this philosophy? I don’t think I would have chosen my school if my Sifu told me it would take years before I would be able to effectively use what he was teaching me. I just don’t have that kind of time
It seems like every day that passes I am am becoming more convinced that I chose the right type of school for me. Which is really more a matter of luck really (and some good advice), since I had no idea what I was doing.
[QUOTE=;896965]
Although I consider that movie revolutionary, the fight scenes in the first one didn’t really strike me as action packed. I actually liked the second one better.
[/QUOTE]
But…
But…
Burly Brawl…
The horrible memories…
Can’t… get… them… out…
Unclean, UNCLEAN!!!
Simonm is escorted off by the kind men in white coats.
I believe J-Lo said she spent 8 months with a personal coach, several hours a day to be able to pull off believable choreographed fight scenes.
Big difference between that, and actual fighting skill.
That being said,
you can learn a heckuva lot in three months of Muay Thai, or Boxing.
it also depends on the individual’s natural abilities, instincts and most importantly, desire.
What movie did Jennifer Lopez have coreographed fight scenes in?
(I am of the opinion that the worst thing Jennifer Lopez ever did was transition from film to pop music. She actually was pretty good in some of her movies.)
[QUOTE=SimonM;897062]What movie did Jennifer Lopez have coreographed fight scenes in?
(I am of the opinion that the worst thing Jennifer Lopez ever did was transition from film to pop music. She actually was pretty good in some of her movies.)[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;896214]Luke Goss, the actor that played the BAD GUY in Blade 2 and Prince Nuada in Hell boy 2 has NO MA background !!
:eek:
Question: Don’t you have a martial arts background?
Goss: No. Blade II was a huge help for me. We did 10 weeks of training and then a couple of other movies after that, and it’s an asset that you’ve done a lot of fight training. You acquire an ability and makes sense to kind of encourage it any time you can.
Old thread but since gene bumped it…..Goss and his twin were singers and dancers in their teens, I still have nightmares over their big UK hits, I owe you nothing anyone? Statham was an international level diver, so both these guys are used to physical stuff and picking up new moves and athletically gifted, its probably easier to choreograph someone totally new to MA who has a good background in physical arts than it is someone who is already trained and bias in how they move
[QUOTE=Frost;1206939]Old thread but since gene bumped it…..Goss and his twin were singers and dancers in their teens, I still have nightmares over their big UK hits, I owe you nothing anyone? Statham was an international level diver, so both these guys are used to physical stuff and picking up new moves and athletically gifted, its probably easier to choreograph someone totally new to MA who has a good background in physical arts than it is someone who is already trained and bias in how they move[/QUOTE]
Yep, add to that that movie fighting is NOT real fighting and that,many times, real fighters have to go against their training to look good in the movies.
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;1206943]Yep, add to that that movie fighting is NOT real fighting and that,many times, real fighters have to go against their training to look good in the movies.[/QUOTE]
yep i remember kickboxer, van damme looked way better than the guy playing his brother who was an actual thai fighter lol
There are many examples of excellent known fighters or MAists in real life who didn’t really look good in the movies:
Joe Lewis
Bill Wallace
Saskia Van Rijswijk
Don Wilson
Steve Sanders
Etc.
There were also some who, with the right choreography, looked very good in the movies:
Benny Urquidez
Richard Norton
Pete Cunningham
Cung Le
Louis Neglia could arguably have been said to have looked good, or at least decent, in Sun Dragon, his only movie appearance, AFAIK. Bob Wall didn’t appear exceptional move-wise, but he had an outstanding ability to react/respond to Bruce Lee’s strikes/kicks and play his foil.
It’s like anything; film fighting is a skill that some have the talent for and others don’t. Being a champion fighter or not has little to do with it. It’s all about selling it, and the ability to project enough charisma onscreen. Also, the ability to follow a good choreographer’s directions. People who think that because they’re great fighters that that will automatically translate onto the screen are usually in for a rude awakening.
I remember Jaguar lives with Lewis and the Force of One with Wallace ( VS Norris of course).
Don’t recall Sanders and never liked Wilson.
IMO, one of the most memorable fights was Benny and Cusak in Gross Pointe Blank.
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;1206967]IMO, one of the most memorable fights was Benny and Cusak in Gross Pointe Blank.[/QUOTE] I know, right? And Cusack was the good guy. Which just goes to show that movies are movies, obviously.
I did the Goss interview as part of a promotion for Death Race 3. Initially, the rep offered an interview with Danny Trejo, which I was more into as I like his work and he was a former boxer. To be perfectly honest, I didn’t know Goss from Adam, so after the interview was switched, I was very amused to find this old thread of yours, s_r. The experience was fun as Goss liked my Kruger reference, and it gave me an excuse to indulge in Death Race 2000 again, which is a true Corman masterpiece.
But enough back story - back on topic. Those of us who have been involved in the filmmaking process know what a challenge it is to make magic. Movie magic is just that - so many things must come together. A great movie fight scene need not be done by great fighters. This is just one reason why we have yet to see a great MMA flick. A great movie fight scene is made by great moviemakers.
[QUOTE=GeneChing;1207002]I know, right? And Cusak was the good guy. Which just goes to show that movies are movies, obviously.
I did the Goss interview as part of a promotion for Death Race 3. Initially, the rep offered an interview with Danny Trejo, which I was more into as I like his work and he was a former boxer. To be perfectly honest, I didn’t know Goss from Adam, so after the interview was switched, I was very amused to find this old thread of yours, s_r. The experience was fun as Goss liked my Kruger reference, and it gave me an excuse to indulge in Death Race 2000 again, which is a true Corman masterpiece.
But enough back story - back on topic. Those of us who have been involved in the filmmaking process know what a challenge it is to make magic. Movie magic is just that - so many things must come together. A great movie fight scene need not be done by great fighters. This is just one reason why we have yet to see a great MMA flick. A great movie fight scene is made by great moviemakers.[/QUOTE]
Look at the Bourne movies or the latest Bond ones or the Taken series.
Take great actors and great choreographers and you get great action/fight scenes.
As long as the choreographer knows what looks good, what sells and the strength and weaknesses of his actors, they fights will be good.
Speaking of which I am NOT a big fan of the whole “Keysi” methods that Hollywood is starting to do more ( First it was the Batman trilogy and now Jack Reacher).
Let’s not forget Benny’s fights with Jackie Chan, too.
Steve Sanders had a fight scene with Ho Chung-tao (Bruce Li) in Dynamo.
I forgot to mention Billy Chow as a former WKA kickboxer who made a very good transition into movies.
Casting non-actor fighters in movies, especially in roles requiring speaking or any character development, is akin to having a UFC program featuring non-fighter actors in the fights. Before I became involved in acting myself, I had only the vaguest inkling of the process. In any film, TV show or commercial, anyone who has even a small speaking role has to make it through a casting process that often/usually means getting past around 300 other actors vying for it. The odds are heavily against your typical unknown actor, many of whom are quite good.
Although you can still see straight-to-DVD movies starring UFC fighters, IMO, the days of movies being made around non-actor fighters are mostly over…remember the '90s and all the movies starring former full-contact karate/kickboxers in the $2 bin?
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;1207012]Look at the Bourne movies or the latest Bond ones or the Taken series.[/QUOTE]
I agree, which is one reason why I review so many action films that are only peripherally related to martial arts (also because I like going to screeners and the cross-over is crucial for a niche brand like us). But I would say that these stand outside the martial arts genre. That’s an important distinction. It’s like a thriller can have a good scary scene, but you wouldn’t classify it as a horror flick.
[QUOTE=Jimbo;1207016] akin to having a UFC program featuring non-fighter actors in the fights. [/QUOTE] I’d actually watch that. You’d probably learn more about street fighting than with UFC.
