Yan Lei . Yan Zi ?
Anyone train with these monks ?
Please PM me
Thanks
Stuk
Good day all
yes have trained with shifu shi yanzi…most awesome experience …if you ever get tyhe chance…i say train with shi yanzi
all the best
chris
We got Yan Lei now…
…as if the S.F. Bay Area needs another Shaolin rep :rolleyes: We’re like at three dozen plus now. I’ve totally lost count. Nevertheless, Yanlei is now teaching in Berkeley, CA. He’s come across the pond from the UK (two ponds if you go all the way back to China) and he’s submitted an ezine article for us.
Check out The Shaolin Dharma of Fighting by Shi Yan Lei
Calling BS on this ‘monk’.
He says that “most fighters don’t train in qigong and body conditioning”. WTF? They might not train ‘Shaolin Steel Jacket’ but they sure as hell train body conditioning. A Shaolin monk would say something that idiotic? And he says "I started off by allowing my opponent to attack me. I didn’t defend and I didn’t block. Because I had trained so intensely in Shaolin Steel Jacket, I found that I could harness my qi immediately. " If he just let his opponent hit him, the judges don’t score on how much pain he can endure. You score points in modern sanshou every time you deliver a solid hit. It doesn’t matter whether your opponent can take it or not, with the exception of a knock-out. That’s absurd. I didn’t see any titles on his website. There are plenty of Shaolin monks that have entered sanshou competition. They all have titles and are up front with them. Did Shi Yan Lei ever win anything?
[QUOTE=GeneChing;959663]…as if the S.F. Bay Area needs another Shaolin rep :rolleyes: We’re like at three dozen plus now. I’ve totally lost count. Nevertheless, Yanlei is now teaching in Berkeley, CA. He’s come across the pond from the UK (two ponds if you go all the way back to China) and he’s submitted an ezine article for us.
Check out The Shaolin Dharma of Fighting by Shi Yan Lei[/QUOTE]
Gene,
Loved this article, wanted to hear more about this Monk’s journey. I wish more articles were about this kind of martial mental development. Thanks again!
[QUOTE=Hebrew Hammer;961110]Gene,
Loved this article, wanted to hear more about this Monk’s journey. I wish more articles were about this kind of martial mental development. Thanks again![/QUOTE]
Glad somebody had some positive feedback on the article! An update on Shifu Yan Lei: he’s currently teaching and training in L.A. for the next month. He’ll be back in Berkeley on Halloween for a qigong workshop. If you’re in Socal and would like to meet with him, you can contact him via the email address on his website: www.shifuyanlei.co.uk. He’s a really exceptional teacher!
Halloween - how perfect. Tell me Redbean, does Yan Lei claim to be a real monk? Does he shave his head and wear robes? Is he celibate and vegetarian? And what titles has he won exactly?
Actually, Shifu Yan Lei DOESN’T claim to be a monk because he never was. His older brother, Shifu Yan Zi WAS a monk and brought Shifu Yan Lei to Shaolin temple to get him away from streetfighting. As such, Shifu Yan Lei is a Shaolin LAY Disciple. Since I feel it’s inappropriate to reveal anything more about my Master’s life, such as his diet or relationship status, I would suggest out of respect, you contact him directly or visit his website for more information. As for his fight titles, most were from China and Thailand when he was younger, so perhaps he doesn’t feel the need to use them for marketing purposes nowadays. If you actually met him and trained with him, maybe you wouldn’t feel the need to question such trivial details. I’m also curious as to why someone such as yourself feels the need to tear down martial masters (and with such little information). That’s a lifetime of work, and all that time is much better spent TRAINING, so you can become your own master and not just an ignoramus on a kungfu forum.
Ignoramus? Those are fighting words. Can you back that up?
I’m suspicious of any master that claims to have won sparring matches but doesn’t have any records to prove it. If he doesn’t need it for marketing, why mention it at all? And those fight titles from Thailand - was that sanshou?
I find it interesting to hear him use the title “Shi” which is reserved for monks, not layman disciples. Given Shi Yan Zi’s position on using Shi, I’m surprised he lets his little brother get away with that.
But now, I’m more interested in you since you called me an ignoramus. You are the one making assumptions. What do you really know about his past? What do you know about Shaolin?
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;965151]I find it interesting to hear him use the title “Shi” which is reserved for monks, not layman disciples.[/QUOTE]
not quite true. this is not only common practice in shaolin culture, but other chinese monasteries as well. chinese buddhism has a number of schools and traditions that vary on certain things. this may be one point. but it is common. 
also its not a “title”, but a “family name” for those who have taken refuge and joined shakyamuni buddha’s spiritual family, so to speak. depending on the monastery and tradition, that may require full ordination, but not in shaolin and many others, particularly in northern china.
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;965151]
I find it interesting to hear him use the title “Shi” which is reserved for monks, not layman disciples. Given Shi Yan Zi’s position on using Shi, I’m surprised he lets his little brother get away with that.
My Surname is Shi since I am a Shaolin lay disciple. I can back it up too. I have a certificate, issued by Shaolin Temple as most disciples do, to prove it.
To abandon your family name is very serious in China. While there are plenty of wannabe monks, Confucian ideals prohibit surname changes to be taken lightly. Shaolin can be ambigous on this point. This is very ambiguous with the Wuseng since they are a class of monk at Shaolin, but only take laymen disciple vows. A Wuseng can call himself a monk and I’ve not know any who have not. Abbot Shi Yong Xin has been trying to regulate this, but the task is beyond him. All of his direct disciples honor it. Granted the Abbot has a lot of honorary disciples, but Shi Yan Zi is not. Shi Yan Zi has been well within the Abbot’s inner circle, unless that has changed very recently. I will concede this point for now.
I will also concede the vegetarian and sexual abstinence comment. But Miss Redbean not being forthcoming about that even after she said that Yan Lei was a layman is very telling.
My initial argument against Yan Lei stands. I have never known a real Sanshou champion who was not be forthcoming about his fight record. If they really won something, why wouldn’t they say what? I would challenge such a claim with anyone, no just a Shaolin layman disciple. His comments that Sanshou fighters don’t condition and that letting opponents strike his Steel Jacket are absurd.
De Ru is similar. He has claimed to be a Sanshou champion but has not produced any fight record. He has also claimed to be a monk. On the other hand, he avoids using the Shi surname and has produced Sanshou champions. He has even produced a UFC fighter.
I know Shaolin monks and disciples can be successful Sanshou fighters. Shi Yan Qiang placed 1st in Sanshou in the Hebei Porvince competition. Shi Yan Zhen placed 1st in Sanshou at 5th International Jingwu Competition. Shi Yong Hao placed 1st in Sanshou at the 1995 International Shaolin Wushu Festival. Shi Yong Yao placed 2nd at the 1978 Shandong Sanshou championships. All of these Shaolin monks have fight records that can be verified. They are forthcoming about it.
Care to respond to the ignoramus, Miss Redbean?
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;965853]To abandon your family name is very serious in China. While there are plenty of wannabe monks, Confucian ideals prohibit surname changes to be taken lightly. Shaolin can be ambigous on this point. [/QUOTE]
i dont think you understand the process of triple gem refuge and discipleship. no one actually changes their family name. they just receive a dharma-name. most laymen, whether shaolin or other, only use it in contexts associated with shaolin/buddhism. elsewhere it is irrelevant and in no way a legal name.
This is very ambiguous with the Wuseng since they are a class of monk at Shaolin, but only take laymen disciple vows. A Wuseng can call himself a monk and I’ve not know any who have not.
thats because the character seng comes from the sanskrit word sangha, meaning the buddhist monastic community. they are by all means monastic although secular in precepts. that is why they are not called heshang, the word for a fully ordained monk.
I will also concede the vegetarian and sexual abstinence comment. But Miss Redbean not being forthcoming about that even after she said that Yan Lei was a layman is very telling.
even if yanlei were a wuseng it wouldnt matter, since they take no vows of vegetarianism or celibacy. unless they choose to take the bodhisattva precepts (includes vegetarianism) or are on temple grounds and take the 10 precepts (includes celibacy).
anyhow, if i were yanlei being asked this kind of question, i would kindly ask you to mind your business. seriously, who asks another person about their sex life or lack thereof? especially since from your last post we can tell you knew warrior monks take only lay precepts, unless you are unfamiliar with what those are.
My initial argument against Yan Lei stands. I have never known a real Sanshou champion who was not be forthcoming about his fight record.
i will give you that, however. this is a legitimate an unassuming question. of course yanlei doesnt need to use records for advertisement, as previously stated. but i agree, if you’re going to claim something at least provide the proof.
If Yan Lei doesn’t need his records to advertise, why is he claiming to be a sanshou champion like his brother with his steel jacket? Why even mention it? He’s using that claim to advertise. Don’t even try to deny that.
Ask Yan Lei’s master, Abbot Shi Yong Xin if anyone other than heshang or wuseng should be using the surname ‘Shi’. On the record, he may be elusive because that’s just the way he is. But off the record, especially within his close disciples, he’ll be very clear on this point.
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;966812]If Yan Lei doesn’t need his records to advertise, why is he claiming to be a sanshou champion like his brother with his steel jacket? Why even mention it? He’s using that claim to advertise. Don’t even try to deny that.[/QUOTE]
i dont know. i’m just saying he’s obviously tough enough to not need records for advertisement. maybe he doesnt have a confident self-image? i doubt that, but i’ve never met him. but i agree with you on this point.
Ask Yan Lei’s master, Abbot Shi Yong Xin if anyone other than heshang or wuseng should be using the surname ‘Shi’. On the record, he may be elusive because that’s just the way he is. But off the record, especially within his close disciples, he’ll be very clear on this point.
well for one, yongxin is influenced by buddhist monastics external to shaolin, mainly from the pureland tradition. he doesnt have the experience with the old shaolin chan masters. so his opinion, being that of others external to shaolin, hardly matters. after all, he was never voted into his position.
but regardless, he has several other secular disciples that use the “shi” surname. and if that were a problem, then secular disciples also shouldnt have a generational dharma-name from the zibei used for monastics. they would have secular dharma-names with their own secular generation characters, just like many chinese families do for their children. other chinese buddhist schools do it like this as well. they have separate generational dharma-names for monastics and laymen.
but… as i said before, shaolin tradition doesnt do it like that. and there are also many other unrelated buddhist monasteries in northern china that do the same “shi” + generation-name + given name for laity too!
Abbot Shi Yong Xin’s opinion doesn’t matter in this? :rolleyes:
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;967497]Abbot Shi Yong Xin’s opinion doesn’t matter in this? :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
seriously? how long have you been following shaolin? 2 years?
[QUOTE=shaolinexecutioner;967497]Abbot Shi Yong Xin’s opinion doesn’t matter in this? :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
NO.
Shaolin tradition matters in this, something Shi Yongxin Abbot has flipped on it’s head a few times.
Anyway, the guy is legit. I know plenty of fighters who train with him, a couple of my gongfu brothers are working with him while they are out there, and not only do I trust their word, just look at the freaking guy.
Your ‘argument’ is basically saying a mack truck on the lot isn’t a ‘real’ mack truck because it hasn’t hauled a load off the yard yet. At the very best your argument only stands on ignorance- you don’t know if his fight record is legit, nor do you know if he has a record which is not officially kept lol, which is actually the record which would interest me most if that was what I was interested in.
And so who are you anyway? I mean, my friend, how do we know your claims aren’t just made up hoopla and how do we any of us even know you would know a fighter if you saw one. Just saying mind the coin or the sword that cuts both ways.
Have you produced a body of literature? A body of students and loyal disciples? Vouched for by a brotherhood of insane martial artists? What do you look like?
In the present world of IMA/CMA and market segmentation, wearing the robe is akin to standing out and showing you have soemthing out of the ordinary!
On one hand we say the clothes does not make the man but in IMA/CMA, it is the clothes that makes the entrance, or a sheep in wolf’s clothing or vice versa.
Whether you judge a book by its cover or not is a personal decision but if you have 2 people, one wearing a monks robe and the other a suit and they both know Shaolin methods and training, it is the one with the monk’s clothing that wins out. IT WORKS!
Now all the Shaolin monks in USA or Europe (for the most part) realize that, to be taken seriously, leave the suit and the jogging uniform at home. That is just the marketing reality!
amitofu
[QUOTE=mawali;968643]In the present world of IMA/CMA and market segmentation, wearing the robe is akin to standing out and showing you have soemthing out of the ordinary!
On one hand we say the clothes does not make the man but in IMA/CMA, it is the clothes that makes the entrance, or a sheep in wolf’s clothing or vice versa.
Whether you judge a book by its cover or not is a personal decision but if you have 2 people, one wearing a monks robe and the other a suit and they both know Shaolin methods and training, it is the one with the monk’s clothing that wins out. IT WORKS!
Now all the Shaolin monks in USA or Europe (for the most part) realize that, to be taken seriously, leave the suit and the jogging uniform at home. That is just the marketing reality!
amitofu[/QUOTE]
I’d say it’s a little bit deeper than that. for more insight as to why the robes can be a big deal for some you have to go back through some of the history and persecution. At least for some, it’s not exactly fair to say it’s marketing.
He’s a disciple. He has every right to wear what he does, and say what he is saying, as far as I know of him.