I agree, Rogue. From what they described, it’s the same as a traditional TKD sidekick once it is chambered - the on-guard stance is different, of course. Step-behind side-kick was also described.
not same as tkd
sure there are similarities between tkd and sanshou side-kicks (as well as other styles) but theyre really not the same, i’ve learned both, tkd years ago and the sanshou side-kick fairly recently. in fact new san shou students commonly have prior ma backgrounds, often tkd. everyone has to essentially relearn the side-kick when they start training with us and i havent seen anyone show up with a sidekick like the sanshou version. there was a tkd teacher at the gym the other night teaching kicks and doing kicking drills including the side-kick, and it occured to me at the time that it looked very different from what we were doing in sanshou. just my observations.
found this pic on the old hard drive, it was obscured by some other stuff, which I am NOT going to post 
Albert Pope doing (or just finished?) a side kick at the world cup…
my hip doesn’t move like that 
Nice form in that pic! Head over hip over leg. No leaning back and right on center. Makes me soooo happy.
which I am NOT going to post
Brother bukakke? yeah he’s popular.
Re: not same as tkd
OK, so what is different about it? The lead leg kick, I mean.
Better start explaining MutantWarrior because I don’t see it. Even Indestructibles side kick setup is used by many WTF TKD people who chamber their front, side and lead roundhouse kicks all the same way and that’s like a front kick.
bukakke bad, but [SIZE=4]FLANKAKKE[/SIZE] xxxxx is good.
Is that a cream pie?
I like bukkake and can’t see why everyone is so obsessed by an udon dish.
BTW, interesting thread.
In WC (which admittedly is renowned for not only lacking ability to fight tomato-filled paper bags in the ring, which is second only to its reputation for kicking like a girl) we are taught to kick without chambering generally, and I’ve been shown the following sidekicks as staples;
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Coming straight up and connecting the blade of your foot/heel with the target.
I say straight but this is usually a slight curve over the centreline, like a shallow bong gerk, to establish balance, get more of a driving energy, help prevent a stop kick/body jam, and to cover the centreline (nuts/back knee).
Stepping off at a 45 and chambering more like Ayrtn’s description provides a possibility of snagging your opponent’s footwork, and putting either of his legs in more effective range; -
The chambered downward side stomp, which can be set up somewhat like everyone else’s description or more often, and less powerfully but more directly, with a lower chamber, kind of like stepping directly onto someone’s knee.
They seem to work OK in sparring, but my questions are this:
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How do other styles do side kicks? Is it more or less chambered?
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San shou isn’t a style is it? So how come you san shouers do the side kick about the same way? Are you coached that way by someone, does it come from your mother style (in CMA or other if you have one), and do you ever use one effectively with less of a chamber?
Sorry Rogue, but I think this fits in with your thread question.
I will try to answer some of Mat’s questions…I started martial arts when I was 7yrs old starting with Judo, then Tae Kwon Do, then Hung Gar and now the Omei system. I have learned different variations of sidekicks over the years. The sanshou sidekick is the one that stands apart from the others, it’s almost like a different kick. When Rudi Ott first taught me this kick for the first month I didn’t even see the difference. I felt it though during sparring! His was stronger than mine. It wasn’t until we got into the subtle differences of pulling the leg all the way back and pushing it out as opposed to snapping it out that I began to truly learn it. It’s hard now to descirbe and really should be taught by someone who understands the differences. There are some good examples of the sanshou sidekick at:
www.sanshou.com
This is from the Worlds in Macao 2003. I’m not sure if it helps out too much as it’s easier to show and teach than it is to describe the sanshou kick in words on a forum. An exercise Rudi taught me that he was taught in Boston by Jason Yee is to stand close to a wall with your palm on the wall. Have your bottom foot pivoted so that the toes face the wall at a 45 degree angle. Pull your other leg up, knee high, toes pulled back. Pull your knee all the way back and over to your side, touching your chest if possible (this is as far back as you can go, which is the fundamental difference to this and other sidekicks) then push it out perpendicular to the wall in a sidekick. Hold it out and high for a second then bring it back. Repeat 50 times.
Hope this helps. Not sure how clear that is without pictures.
nice Aryon.
I think what they’re trying to say (I’ve never done TKD..) is that the TKD kick’s emphasis is the snapping power of speed. and the sanshou kick’s emphasis is much more on power.
Originally posted by ShaolinTiger00
[B]nice Aryon.
I think what they’re trying to say (I’ve never done TKD..) is that the TKD kick’s emphasis is the snapping power of speed. and the sanshou kick’s emphasis is much more on power. [/B]
Many taekwondoka are encouraged to “stick” the kick as well, rather than pulling it back, piston-like.
I’d always assumed that was because it looked cool. But I’ve heard people insist it’s more powerful that way. Personally, I find the piston version is stronger.
I’m not going to debate on what sidekick is stronger, or better. I think they are both useful for the application within their art. I find that the sanshou sidekick penetrates more, but the TKD sidekick is faster. I like to treat them as two different kicks.
I think mine’s a bit of both anyway. I don’t stick it but I don’t draw it quite that far back either.
By stick do you mean a full extension of your kicking leg? Seems to me that if your not reaching a full extension its more of a jab than full fledged kick.
Nope. I mean locking it out there for a second before retracting it.
By locking it out there a second, then the force will push your opponent away from you more like a shove. By retracting quickly, the force is more snapping and you lessen your chances of having someone catch the kicking leg.
I mean locking it out there for a second before retracting it.
I do not do this. I have no idea if that makes it right or wrong.
I fully extend my kick, but I don’t lick it out there for a second. It would be caught and I’d get dumped.