Richard Mantis responds to "online challenge".

In response to the “online challenge” posted here a few days ago.

What I study is open information.

Who teaches me is open information.

Where I study is open information.

None of the above information was ever hidden and it never will be.

Master Gin Foon Mark was made aware of the situation and considers any challenge on his students
as a challenge on himself and his association.

The assumption has been that Master Mark’s students act independtly of Master Mark himself.
This assumption is not only opposite of the truth, it’s also stupid.
Master Mark told me to let everyone know that his door is always open {except to those who have been
privately ordered to stay away from our school}.
Master Mark and his students stand as one.

I have been instructed by Master Gin Foon Mark to stop all internet posting as of now.

Unless Master Mark instructs me otherwise this will be my last post anywhere on the internet.

Richard Hodsdon

TO RICHARD MANTIS

richard the mantis, jook lum in your veins,

Do you need your teacher to hold your hand in the bathroom too? Aren’t you a grown man 55 years old? If you have the “personal interest” to make others private business public, don’t you have the testicles necessary to be responsible for your actions? At 55 you talk like a man but act like a boy.

Wasn’t it just two months past, that you declined a visitor at your door - after so many requests by you for them to visit so you could show them your skill? And when they show up you then cry please stay away. Why didn’t you invite them in? Oh, I know - they were privately ordered to stay away - thats laughable…

And just a couple weeks past you also failed to respond to a private challenge issued to you about this matter by email. Even though it was issued privately to save you face.

CLEARLY YOU - NOW KNOW - THERE WILL BE CONSEQUENCES FOR YOUR ACTIONS. IF YOU DONT WANT SOMEONE IN YOUR BUSINESS STAY OUT OF THEIRS.

For the record, your actions and your actions alone are the cause of this challenge. You stated “At my personal request, Master Gin Foon Mark has granted me permission to post publicly in reguards to this matter.” Repeat - “at my personal interest”. Now you want to hide behind Mark Sifu’s pants leg. Now you see your “personal interest” in someone elses private affairs has consequences.

You clearly and directly lied about the number of sites you posted someone elses private business - stating to them you only posted three sites- in reality you posted your “personal interest” on some 8 sites internationally which had consequences you may not have foreseen. Neither did you make any effort to remove your posts. Your apology was offered but to what effect as you lied at the same time.

ACCORDING TO THE PUBLIC CHALLENGE
DEFAULT: Should RICHARD MANTIS fail to reply to this KONGSAO
CHALLENGE, he will be deemed not qualified in skill or knowledge of JOOK LUM Mantis and appropriate posts will be made in newspapers, magazines and internet of his default. This is not a lethal match but a friendly competition. If you “richard the mantis” do not respond to public friendly competition you should refrain from making other peoples private affairs your public “personal interest” and you shall be deemed a coward without honor or integrity, a gossiper, troublemaker and backbiter with no understanding of or skill in southern praying mantis kungfu.

JUST FOR THE RECORD - I, David L. Whitley, nor any of my associates or class-mates, have any animosity toward you “richard the mantis”. It was not my intention to harm or maim you to begin with but rather to make an important point to you - STAY OUT OF OTHERS PRIVATE AFFAIRS. Do not consider me your enemy. I am not. Take good advice and stay out of others private business.

Remember the troublesome letter you sent in which you wrote with big letters on the back - “you aint heard the last of me” - well, unless you wish to extend your hand in friendship let this be the last heard of you. Remember, a hand clasped in friendship cannot sling mud.

Respect to Mark Foon Sifu and success to you in your future training.

Cowardice is cowardice however you look at it…

I must commend David Whitely for his actions show that the old school martial spirit is not dead in the nation of fools who sit back and hit the enter button thinking it will grant them some form of internet eternal life.

For the record I have nothing but respect for Sifu Gin Foon Mark and his accomplishments could fill many volumes. I have no hatred toward Richard Mantis or anyone in Sifu Gin Foon Mark’s school(s).

What problem I do have is when another person makes it his business to smear someone I know and respect. Sorry, but I am not going to sit back and let that happen. You opened the door to this Richard and you cannot have Sifu Mark shut it for you.

Richard Mantis started this whole thing with his making public certain things that should have stayed within the confines of school walls and peoples hearts.

Yet he flashed this information like a banner with a cry of “Here be a cretin who needs to be thrashed”.

Why?

If you do not like the person in question, why not leave the matter alone, as you Richard were not involved with this private business in any sense of the word.

Do you answer for Sifu Mark? I think not.

But then like most children, you stuck your hand in the cookie jar, and when caught redhanded you backstep with the greatest of ease and hide behind the reputation and honor of your teacher.

Your a coward, Richard. A coward who talks big and then when it comes time to prove your mettle, you have some sort of Zen Satori-like Enlightenment and realize you are in way too deep for your own good, whether mental or physical.

Richard says he does not act without the approval of his teacher. I really do not think Sifu Mark told Richard to post what he did at all on all the sites where I found it. It was rather alarming and dissapointing. I for one am not numb to the actions of the trolls and clowns who have made the Martial Arts community a place many shun instead of respect.

Sounds like Richard has a little problem with obsessive compulsive actions on his own behalf. Not a good sign at all.

You were told privately of all this and ignored those who brought this up. What, you cover your ears and make clucking sounds until the people leave you alone? You show real maturity, Richard. Then when those involved made this public, you brush it off like dandruff off your shoulder.

If your skills are so good, then come show them to those that issued this challenge to you. This is not a fight to the death.

Your honor as a man, a student of Jook Lum, is put into question. And your going to walk away even though you started this all?

You disgust me. Your like most of the other people who go around and wave their sash at people and talk big about this and that, but when it comes time to express it you run away like a ****roach evades the light.

I am but a man, Richard. You are not. Like David said, you are the shining example of how so many boys pretend at being men.

Look in the mirror, and do some soul searching. You need it rather badly.

In Boston,

Dale Dugas

An open forum

All:

Being that this topic is being aired-out in a public forum, I feel obligated to put my two-cents worth in.

Richard Mantis has been accused of many things the past few days.

  • A coward
  • Backstabber
  • Hiding behind his sifu
  • Being a child and not a man

These are very strong accusations and it seems somehow wrong to have this conversation over a public forum. Both sides respond with passion and conviction and if you were to just read the letters from one group, you’d be inclined to think the absolute worst about the other. Problem is, very few of us reading this forum have any idea who Richard Mantis or David L. Whitley are. But most of us have at least heard of Master Mark and Sifu Hagood. Both of these men command incredible respect and I have to believe that neither enjoy having their names dragged into this mess.

In defense of Mr. Mantis - do you not think that Master Mark will not deal with this in-house as he sees fit? I have no problem believing that Richard Mantis told him about the challange - I can almost see Master Mark slowly closing his tired eyes and saying, “Richard, stay off the net and be done with this crap.” I’m sure he was a bit more elequent about it, but that was likely the message that came across.

I respect that Mr. Mantis has enough regards for his sifu that he will do whatever he requests in this situation. Mr. Mantis has made no secret of who he trains with and where he trains. If anything he has said in the past few days is untrue, do you not think that Master Mark will also serverely deal with that in-house?

Sincerely,

John

B.T.W.
Before someone angerly flames me with a “who the hell are you?” I am just a lover of the Martial Arts who comes from a Karate background but is fasinated by the Chinese Martial Arts. In fact, I have even applied for membership in the spm private forum and was denied membership my Mr. Mantis because of my lack of experience in spm. I reveal that to show there is no reason for me to have some sort of alliance with Mr. Mantis.

Hello John,

Your lack of experince is something that time will overcome. Part of gaining experience is seeking out the right people from whom to get it.

The thing about public forums is that people eventually reveal themselves intentionally or otherwise for whom they are and for what their real agenda is.

You couldn’t go wrong in SPM from calling at Master Mark’s school, speaking to him and his Senior Students personally. If a recomendation means anything, I would recommend that you call at a school headed by a Chinese elder. Master Mark is one in the USA, there are others too. They are good people, and are ‘good’ for their art.

If people get to know you, doors open. Doors close for people who have proven themselves insufficient in character.

No doors have closed with respect to you in SPM, but, it is up to you which ones you may choose to try.

Please keep in touch. Speaking personally, I would be very interested to hear of your training and progress generally.

Kindest Regards,

Steve Richards
Forum Admin (SPM Private Forum).

Good Stuff

Steve - I see you’ve gone ahead with the real, authentic, traditional and with verifiable lineage referral process :slight_smile:

Certainly GM Gin Foon Mark is an excellent choice and it behooves anyone in his area to get on board quickly as there is no telling when he will close his hands.

It’s a good thing that he has taken the measures necessary to insure a clean, uncontested, passing on of his line to his hand picked designated heir.

It’s a real hoot to read where people who have no formal and recognized association with the man refer to him as “Mark Sifu” and some have even gone so far as to employ this same dishonest tactic to the name of the late Lum Sang. Just goes to show that wannabes, miscreants, poseurs and losers always attempt to ride on the coat tails of the famous.

It’s also a good reason why the private SPM forum should serve as a clearinghouse and referring resource. Given the scope of the private SPM forum, which is global in nature, we really owe it to the “newbies” to help them whenever possible. Since many of the Elders on the private forum, particularly those here in America, choose to speak through one of their computer literate disciples it may take some time to convince the Elders that this is a good and necessary thing for us to do. I’m sure they will eventually come to see the wisdom in this approach as they have demonstrated a remarkable willingness to engage in open conversations about matters never before taken beyond closed doors.

Question

Dear Steve and John,

I’m just curious and others have asked also - do either of you in your posts above make an indirect reference to Mr. Hagood, any of the Assn. students, or the Chinese seniors or elders with whom we are associated?

Hello Jack,

Yes, its the same for the UK Elders too. I am authorised by Great Grandmaster Lee-Yin-Sing’s blood Hakka family to post on the internet in their name. They are of course as you know, fully aware of the forum, its aims and objectives in promoting the art of SPM.

Cheers,

Steve.

References

Hello Dave:

I swung by this post on my way off of public forums and thought I would make a quick response.

Speaking for myself, I don’t engage in oblique references to anything or anyone as that only leads to speculation and misunderstanding.

As someone who has worked long and hard to obtain some level of skill I’m sure you will appreciate the fact that those of us who walk the path of this thing we call TCMA are direct in our dealings with people regardless of station. It becomes our nature by virtue of the overall training process and the fact that this directness is found in so many TCMA leads me to conclude that it is probably a universal phenomena.

I’ve never had cross word one with Roger. It seems that in the past I have been wrongfully accused, or the insinuation of accusation created, based on erroneous information. From what I know it appears Roger has suffered similar experiences as well.

It is the “nature of the beast” to have great pride in one’s association, unit, company, whatever and this often times spills over into other areas. As an old ex-101st Air Assault troop Roger is well aware of this fact. Even to this day, in an allegedly unified US Army, Paratroopers and Air Assault troops still “throw down” for the sake of unit pride. Just part of human nature.

Roger has a standing offer to take any problems he may have with me directly to me and he has agreed to reciprocity in this arrangement.

Therefore, if there was a concern on the part of your teacher he knows he can bring it directly to me. As Roger and I are of the same generation this arrangement is the proper place and way to address your stated concerns.

This is my final word on this matter.

In reply

John,
As you know I’m sure, SPM has more than its share of two-faced cowards and backbiters - anonymous trolls if you will.

I’m aware that you and Mr. Hagood have been acquainted for a number of years.

I know you also recently spoke with him on the phone directly about this very same issue. And so did Steve by email who assured Mr. Hagood there were no indirect references made to us on one of the longer threads.

I’m sure you would agree that its better to cultivate brother-friendships.

Jack,

See you on the private forum.

Cheers,

Steve.

To Steve

Steven,
Would you be so kind as to answer my question regarding the above post?

I know you and Mr. Hagood have communicated frequently, especially of late.

I’m not a SPM guy, but this public challenge humiliation game is unbecoming of kung fu fighters.

If you have a beef, David Whitley, go to Minnesota to challenge Richard Mantis. He’s open to all, including you.

Walk the talk and jump on a plane - lest we accuse you of being Ralek’s protege.

OM MA NI PEH ME HUNG

Pride is one of the 5 poisons. Those who hurt our ego are our providers, those who give us a chance to repay some debts and make us better people.

Though we can clearly see friction… I hope you all find peace.

Nobody important…

Life is just a moment to space

Hum…

The illusion serves you well.

There’s no harm in wishful thinking…

Re: Question

Originally posted by David Whitley
[B]Dear Steve and John,

I’m just curious and others have asked also - do either of you in your posts above make an indirect reference to Mr. Hagood, any of the Assn. students, or the Chinese seniors or elders with whom we are associated? [/B]

David:

I’m not sure I understand your question. If you are asking if I am somehow attempting to disrespect or insult Mr. Hagood, than the answer is a definitive, no. Which brings me to my second comment. Your post that read:

John,
As you know I’m sure, SPM has more than its share of two-faced cowards and backbiters - anonymous trolls if you will.
I’m aware that you and Mr. Hagood have been acquainted for a number of years.
I know you also recently spoke with him on the phone directly about this very same issue. And so did Steve by email who assured Mr. Hagood there were no indirect references made to us on one of the longer threads.
I’m sure you would agree that its better to cultivate brother-friendships.

David:

Please understand that I believe you have me confused with another John. I live in Minnesota and have never spoken with or met Mr. Hagood in my life. In fact, and please do not take this as an insult, it is simply a matter of fact, I had never even heard of Mr. Hagood until I started reading about this whole challenge post.

Sincerely,

John

What is it you guys say when you’ve said all you care to say about a subject?..

This is my final word on this matter.

Clarification

Sorry John - I should have been more specific. I was posting to John Springer - JF Springer.