Li Hongzhi is insane ...

Nei Jia: the Qigong and Taijiquan Forum Qigong and Meditation
1

At first, I thought that perhaps Falun Gong might be a good practice to follow, and that everything that PRC was saying about Li Hongzhi was a load of crap… however, after reading this interview with him, I am shocked.

http://www.time.com/time/asia/asia/magazine/1999/990510/interview1.html

Here are a few selected tidbits:

TIME: Have you seen human beings levitate off the ground?
Li: I have known too many.

TIME: Can you describe any that you have known?
Li: David Copperfield. He can levitate and he did it during performances.

…

TIME: Where do they come from?
Li: The aliens come from other planets. The names that I use for these planets are different . Some are from dimensions that human beings have not yet discovered. The key is how they have corrupted mankind. Everyone knows that from the beginning until now, there has never been a development of culture like today. Although it has been several thousand years, it has never been like now.

The aliens have introduced modern machinery like computers and airplanes. They started by teaching mankind about modern science, so people believe more and more science, and spiritually, they are controlled. Everyone thinks that scientists invent on their own when in fact their inspiration is manipulated by the aliens. In terms of culture and spirit, they already control man. Mankind cannot live without science.

The ultimate purpose is to replace humans. If cloning human beings succeeds, the aliens can officially replace humans. Why does a corpse lie dead, even though it is the same as a living body? The difference is the soul, which is the life of the body. If people reproduce a human person, the gods in heaven will not give its body a human soul. The aliens will take that opportunity to replace the human soul and by doing so they will enter earth and become earthlings.

When such people grow up, they will help replace humans with aliens. They will produce more and more clones. There will no longer be humans reproduced by humans. They will act like humans, but they will introduce legislation to stop human reproduction.

TIME: Are you a human being?
Li: You can think of me as a human being.

TIME: Are you from earth?
Li: I don’t wish to talk about myself at a higher level. People wouldn’t understand it.

…

TIME: But what is the alien purpose?
Li: The human body is the most perfect in the universe. It is the most perfect form. The aliens want the human body.

TIME: What do aliens look like?
Li: Some look similar to human beings. U.S. technology has already detected some aliens. The difference between aliens can be quite enormous.

TIME: Can you describe it?
Li: You don’t want to have that kind of thought in your mind.

I don’t think I could take part in an activity that is headed by a man like this.

How do you other practitioners of Falun Gong cope with the type of things Li Hongzhi is saying that seem insane? I am not trying to insult anyone at all – but upon reading the statements above and several others, my impression of the man is not the best. What is it that makes you believe in him?

_Joe

“You are never dedicated to something you have complete confidence in. No one is fanatically shouting that the sun is going to rise tomorrow. They KNOW it’s going to rise tomorrow. When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or any other kinds of dogmas or goals, it’s always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.”

  • Robert M. Pirsig in “Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance”
2

I don’t have huge heartburn with his alien-talk - frankly I believe alot of that stuff is all too possible. Despite stifling mainstream scientific prejudice, he is frankly far from alone on this subject. The alien/human origins/religion/gov conspiracy (http://www.paranormalnews.com/article.asp?ArticleID=29) actually makes a whole lot of sense, but that’s a whole 'nother topic!

The main beef I have with his statements in this interview is his assertion that David Copperfield is not really just an illusionist, but a TRUE magician. That he is actually able to levitate or walk thru walls, etc. Which is just about impossible in my opinion. While there are such stories of such masters in the East, I don’t think Copperfield is one of them. His life is documented doing little textbook magic tricks as a kid to the same tricks on a bigger scale now. If such yogic feats are truly possible, I would imagine that they would take years of specialized training under hard-to-find masters, and I seriously doubt Copperfield ever got that opportunity in his life. Sound like Li is just going out on a limb on this one claim.

3

hmm

i also saw david copperfield levitate off the ground once, and there was no way that was faked. it was in haiti, outside, and he was demonstrating to a few locals in broad daylight. emphasis on “few,” as being two or three. not something worth rigging wires for (it wouldn’t have been possible, for that matter).

4

Hi-

Can I ask you guys something?

Isn’t everything in the world and all the wonders of our universe enough?

Must we make up such piffle to answer questions about ourselves that are right in front of us?

P.T Barnum was right. :frowning:

yeesh
and
peace

Kung Lek

5

plasticsquirrel - and did he have these observers stand about 7’-10’ back facing him at an angle to his back/side? And then he “levitated” standing with both feet together about 4" off the ground?

6

Nicely postioned..

question there Origenx, if you’ll excuse the pun. If Plastic-squirrel answers yes to this question, then I myself with show that in this manner anyone can “seemingly” levitate. I mean you can even learn that one from the David Blane website links.

That aside true Levitation is considered to be possibly, but as it has been mentioned a) not by D. Copperfield b) not without many years of dedication to a energetic discipline (and not necessarily a Spiritual one).

By all accounts Levitation by what I have been told is not specifically a sign of Spiritual advancement, just energetic.

7

Kung Lek

May I ask why you so easily dismiss levitation (and possible other feats) as nonsense? I’m not saying that it is or is not possible but it’s best to keep an open mind about it. Maybe with the world view you hold, it is not possible to imagine such feats possible. For to do this, your belief-system would start to crumble.

8

Levitation..

is no big deal. It is done all the time and most people don’t even realize it. If you stopped trying to define it and giving it some exact requirement you are looking for you would see this. Instead of watching and then comparing or contrasting, just watch for the sake of watching. Within that, you will see all you ever needed to see. You must let go of the desire to see the specifics if you want to see the specifics.

Its as if you stare at a beautiful painting, and the entire time your mind is filled with comparisons with other paintings, colors, objects in the painting, and you consume yourself with so much thought that you miss out on the most important thing.

  • Nexus

Freedom is what you do with what is done to you. - Sartres

9

I’d like to clarify my original post a bit, because I quoted things but failed to comment on them myself.

About the levitation – I am not doubting the existence of people who can possess the ability to levitate. In fact, I think that it is DEFINITELY a reality.

I am laughing that Li Hongzhi refers to DAVID COPPERFIELD as one of the people who are capable of achieving this.

“You are never dedicated to something you have complete confidence in. No one is fanatically shouting that the sun is going to rise tomorrow. They KNOW it’s going to rise tomorrow. When people are fanatically dedicated to political or religious faiths or any other kinds of dogmas or goals, it’s always because these dogmas or goals are in doubt.”

  • Robert M. Pirsig in “Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance”
10

even David Blaine would have been less laughable

You know, the street magician. The alien stuff seems crazy, but I’m against ruling anything out, since none of us really knows what goes on in the universe. I doubt Copperfield can levitate though..

11

David Blaine ain’t so great either. He simply takes the opposite “street-real” presentation to Copperfield’s over-bloated “rock shows.” However, they all use the same basic magic textbook tricks.
Remeber, the art of “magic” is all in the presentation and illusion. That’s where the real skill and creativity lies. And contrary to what Blaine claims in his shows, he does use camera tricks and stuff. Like when he’s shown “levitating” several feet up - he IS using wires there.

12

origenx

How do you know he’s using camera tricks/wires?

13

..

no, he was closer to the observers, as they were just local haitians, and he levitated what looked like two to three feet off the ground. it was in broad daylight in a village, though, and the people watching got all freaked out (not a crowd-- just a few people watching).

it’s almost scary to think that someone like david copperfield could actually levitate, or change his molecular structure so he could pass through the great wall of china. of course, how many magicians practice traditional magic? i have no idea, but i would guess that it would be few.

i trust that what li hongzhi said was true, though, because of his reputation. not the reputation that china has given him since '99, but the reputation as being the man who brought the spiritual side of qigong known again. the man who many other qigong masters thought was best qualified to do this. the man who has been practicing falun dafa since he was four years old.

14

I was told by a local lady that I know who is deeply rooted in metaphysics that david blaine is a practicing yogi. She said his levitation techniques are real. She then wen’t to explain to me how levitation is possible by saying the following:

“Between all molecules and atoms there is a space. We are made up of millions of atoms and between each of these is a space. While you walk on the ground, there is actually a space between the bottom of your shoes(or)feet and the floor. Levitation is a method of increasing this space while cooperating with the laws of gravity.”

She does private practices (not teaching) with levitation after she had a dream where she was levitating and said she came to an understanding while the teacher in her dream showed her how. Now she practices whatever it is he showed her. I see her every few months, and the last time I asked her how her levitation practice was going she said it was going well. I don’t know what that means.

This doesn’t make me a believer or a disbeliever but I do not doubt that it is possible and within the capabilities of human beings. It is more possible than many things which we do believe are real.

  • Nexus

<font size=“1”>“Time, space, the whole universe - just an illusion! Often said, philosophically verifiable, even scientifically explainable. It’s the <font color=“blue”>‘just’</font> which makes the honest mind go crazy and the <font color=“blue”>ego</font> go berserk.” - Hans Taeger</font>

15

I levitate all the time - when I get really p1ssed off I hit the roof :smiley:

cxxx:::::::::::>
What we do in life echoes in Eternity

16

Well, if David Blaine can REALLY levitate 2-4 feet off the ground, then how come they don’t show that in his TV specials? The only shots I’ve seen of him levitating on TV would be consistent with the textbook “Balducci levitation” or with the use of wires. I figured out how to do that trick merely by watching his show. Thing is, if it’s real magic, u don’t need to control the camera or audience viewing angles.

But, if you say u saw him levitate 2’-4’ up in person, what can I say. Maybe he’s like Li Hongzhi says Copperfield is - a real magician whose real illusion is hiding his real skills. But I doubt it. I’ve talked to some amateur magicians and they all believe Blaine & Copperfield are textbook magicians. I gotta website from some amateur magician association I’ll have to look up. But in the meantime, I suggest u find a few of those sites and forums and ask around. See what the magic community thinks of these guys. And then write back and let us know!

Interestingly, I had a vivid dream I was about to levitate off my bed not too long ago. It was so real I got scared and held myself down. But now I wonder..what if I hadn’t???

17

David Blaine is an illusionist. His levitation trick is just that, a trick. He is not the first illusionist to perform the levitation trick. If you notice how he performs it, he always has the audience stand in a specific spot and view him from a specific angle; all part of the illusion. If you move and change your perspective you lose the illusion. Remember, his television shows are edited. They never show the performances that he screws up. It is common for new age psychics to name drop in order to enhance their own credibility with the uninitiated. Charlatans will band together in an attempt to give each other credibility.

If levitation and many of these other psychic abilities were possible and practical they would not only exist in the sub-culture. The reason they remain in the sub-culture is because there is no solid foundation for their efficacy in everyday life. As I have posted many times already, they are merely parlor tricks that distract individuals from more important endeavors.

Sincerely,

Scott

18

I wouldn’t say that levitation is impossible. Improbable maybe, but nothing is really impossible :slight_smile:

cxxx:::::::::::>
What we do in life echoes in Eternity

19

It is a common platitude to say that nothing is impossible, however it is clear that there are a great many things that are clearly and factually impossible. I could give a tediously long list of what is impossible and there are a number of abilities that are so difficult to achieve they might as well be impossible. We all want to believe that super-human abilities are possible, but the fact is there are no super human abilities. Of course by definition, if a human could accomplish it, it would not be a super-human ability. Even if a person could float 3” above the ground, so what!! There are plenty of more valuable abilities to develop that are much more easily accomplished and possible to achieve.

I am all for thinking outside of the box and expanding the horizons of human endeavors. However, I do refuse to believe that those that do so are more special than any other human being. Many people that pursue psychic abilities are actually insecure people attempting to make themselves special so that they can feel significant in a world in which they feel they are just one of the crowd.

Many people like to play around with psychic abilities. There have not been significant accomplishments in the psychic realm since the beginning of history. The parlor games people are playing now are the same ones that have been in existence for thousands of years. Even The Amazing Kreskin considers his abilities to be skills that anyone can develop and he is one of the more successful performers in the history of these types of abilities.

Sincerely,

Scott

20

I actually agree - psychic abilities are available to anyone who wishes to develop them. However, I do not believe that all people who develop psychic abilities are doing it for an ego boost (there are also many different types of psychic abilities). In fact, most people I have met who do any psychic development actually do it to help others.

That aside, yes levitation is probably a skill that has limited value. Whether it is possible or not is yet to be proven.

cxxx:::::::::::>
What we do in life echoes in Eternity