Hung Gar Tang Fong Lineage?

Wai Jia: The Kung Fu Forum Southern Chinese Kung Fu
21

Friends will help you keep secrets.
A good friend will drive 5 hours out to the middle of the desert to help bury your secrets. :smiley:

I consider JLS a good friend and will support (from personal experience) that he is nothing but a respectful individual, even around people he does not like. Heā€™s not the type to talk tough, preferring matters to be settled civilly or with hands, and not heated or boastful words.

JLS
Yo, we need to set up another road trip so we can put the hurtin on some yardbird and some hobbits. :smiley:

22

Ainā€™t Nothing Like Some Yardbird & Hobbits

BMore Banga,

lol. Itā€™s been a minute since I had some of that DC yardbird. Unfortunately, I didnā€™t get to hook up with a DC Hobbit.

Guess you canā€™t give me the 411 on that anymore:(

When are you coming back to Philly?

Peace

Jerry Battle

23

true, but there are always san shou chix ppprrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr :wink:

I visit my folks all the time.
I just never know which # youā€™re gonna be at.
Iā€™ll find out the next time they want me up there & let u know.
Iā€™m thinking Easter or sometime in March.
Febā€™s gettin busy with work stuff; but I still may end up there.

24

No Problem

Dats Wassup,

Give me a call at either number or email me before you come up. We can hit Chinatown again for dinner. Depending on what time you get into town, we can even pay a visit to the mo gwoon.

Peace

Jerry Battle

25

no harm no foul , i just prefer being direct. but peace train hard

26

Cool

Deathtouch,

No problem my man. Stay cool.

Peace.

Jerry Battle

27

Ya know what I think? I think everyoneā€™s Hung-Ga is wrong except for MINE! My Sifuā€™s Sifuā€™s Sifu has stated this and although he is long passed away, his word is law. So you guys can argue till the cows come home, only I have the real deal!!!
The proof whether anyone really knows Hung-Ga is if they know the Lung Hung Bot Gwa=Dragon walks the eight Diagrams-special footwork. I f they donā€™t know this technique, then they donā€™t know the higher levels of Hung Ga, for without this, the hand techniques are useless.

28

I must say that I am a bit disappointed in my first posting at this forum. I had no intention of starting a debate on which lineage is the REAL hung gar. I just wanted to know what the difference in each lineage was and if there was any other people who studied Tang Fong lineage. To say that one lineage is better or more original than the other other is akin to saying one style is better than another. I have trained in both Hung gar and 7 star praying mantis and both are very good styles. I would only show my ignorance if I said that one was more superior. I think itā€™s all dependant on the Sifu and the student on which style is better for themselves. No matter what lineage, each student and sifu have different qualities they bring to a style and I believe that it doesnā€™t matter if itā€™s Lam Sai Wing, Tang Fong or even Wong Fei Hung were your teachers your style is going to change because we all have different body styles and strengths and weaknesses. The important issue is that we carry on with dedication and hard work that Traditional Kung Fu demands of us.
Thank you and I hope I have not offended anybody by this posting.

29

To HungFutKune

All I have to say is, I know the sifu in Vancouver whom you refer to. He is the best Hung Gar sifu there is. Iā€™m sorry to offend many of you, but it is the truth. In fact, Iā€™d go so far as to say heā€™s the best Kung Fu teacher. I really mean this, not trolling.

HungFutKune, I donā€™t know why youā€™re not training with him still, but if youā€™re still in Vancouver get your butt back there if you want to learn the real thing.

30

To Keng Geng

Thanks for your reply Keng Geng,

Which sifu are you refering to in Vancouver? I did train with two of them. How do you know him?

I do agree with you, one of them is one of the best kung fu sifuā€™s I have seen or ever met. Itā€™s only a shame that he hasnā€™t got the noteriety that some other Hung Gar masters have. His school is very small and many of the martial arts students in Vancouver do not appreciate TRADITIONAL martial arts.

I posted originally on this site to see what other peopleā€™s opinions are in regards to the differences of Lam Sai Wing lineage and Tang Fong lineage, but as to date no one has been able to answer me.

In regards to me getting off my butt and start training again? Thank you for your concern but unfortunately due to work commitments I have been relocated to China, and funny enough there is no Hung Gar in shanghai that I have been able to find. I have started to train in Northern Style 7star praying Mantis while I am here though. It is also a very good style if taught properly.

Anyways thanks again for your reply and your support of one of my sifuā€™s. (I just hope we are talking about the same one). Also feel free to email or pm me. We actually might know each other.

31

What questions?

I posted originally on this site to see what other peopleā€™s opinions are in regards to the differences of Lam Sai Wing lineage and Tang Fong lineage, but as to date no one has been able to answer me.

What is not answered? You asked if someone was TF lineage. You got a few. You asked about Mui Fah, I think you got that too.

Anything else?

32

questions, what questions?

I guess I didnā€™t make myself clear in my original posting.(Doesnā€™t anybody scroll up anymore?) I was asking if anybody knew what the differences between the lineages were? More to do with the difference in the movements and focus of the forms, breath and training. I already know the differences between the forms in Mui Far Kuen (TF versus LSW), but I was wondering what other peoples opinions were.
Also if there are any other pratitioners who know the Hung Fut Kune form and if they were ever taught it in a Hung Gar class?

Thanks

33

Iā€™ll do my best to answer your question.

HungFutKune,

I first would like to start off by saying that the Moi Fa Kuen is not a part of Tang Fongā€™s lineage. He Sigung is Ho Lap Tin. Ho Lap Tin trained with Tang Fong since the time he was in China teaching at the Yi Yong Tong. Ho Lap Tin learned everything that Tang Fong taught and taught these things to his students as well but the Moi Fa Kune set was not a part of the curriculum.

The Kuen Toh (Fist Sets) which were taught by Tang Fong are;

1.) Gung Ji Fook Fu Kuen
2.) Fu Hok Sueng Ying Kuen
3.) Ng Ying Kuen
4.) Gau Duk Lin Waan Kuen
5.) Teet Sin Kuen

Although there are some physical differences between Lam Sai Wingā€™s and Tang Fongā€™s system of training, the faht (method) is still the same. More or less the shape of some movements are different, but the applications are the same.

The other difference is that Tang Fong lineage breaks the Gung Ji Fook Fu Kuen into two different sets because of the lenght of the form which is hard for some beginning students. The form is broken into Gung Ji Kuen and Fook Fu Kuen. Also, Lam Sai Wingā€™s branch does not teach the Gau Duk Lin Waan Kuen.

I hope I was able to answer somethings for you.

Peace

Jerry Battle

34

my, my. Your first post was answered, you said in your second post "I just wanted to know what the difference in each lineage was and if there was any other people who studied Tang Fong lineage. " buried within a bunch of other stuff, which was good by the way.

OK, I should read closer next time. [:)]

Unfortunately, your question needs some qualification. Thatā€™s like asking what is the difference between the two sifuā€™s you saw. I bet a lot on the surface and probably more as you dig. In the end, however, itā€™s the similarities that bind us as family.

For example, Subitai on the list and I started at the same time with the same sifu. We worked out together for an extended time and pretty much share the same philosophy and understanding of Hung Gar. In fact, we are in frequent communication refining both.

That said, if you were to watch us perform our Hung Gar, you would see differences. I guarantee that his students and mine look more different. And Iā€™m talking about students who have trained for over 3 years and are currently still studying from us.

Now you are asking about the difference of lineages that have 100s of 1000s of students each and down 4 or 5 generations. That should give you the magnitude of your seemingly simple question.

On the surface, Je Lei Sifu gave you some diffs. The two biggies in my mind are the use of Yee Gee Kim Yeung Ma in Gung Gee and Fu Hok for Tang Fang but not in LSW and that LSW has Sup Ying instead of Ng Ying.

For Hung Fut Kune, scroll up (J/K). I answered that in my first post to you. Itā€™s most likely from, get this, the style called Hung Fut. Which is Hung Gar with Fut Gar. Itā€™s not considered a Hung Gar form by either lineages.

Hey, donā€™t take offense to my flip remarks. Just giving back a little for your scrolling comment.

On a different topic, since you put it out there, who are the vancouver sifus? Are they open to visitors? I head up there every now and then and I make it a point to visit as many Hung Gar players as I can. We learn from our differences and from what we do the same.

35

Haysafu - no offense taken in the scrolling, if anything I deserved that one. At times I like to be a bit sarcastic but only in a joking manner, so I never want to come off by offending anyone . My sifu in Vancouver is a very private teacher so I will ask him if it is ok with him before I mention his name on this forum. Hopefully he wonā€™t mind, because he does have a lot to offer to the martial arts world in general, and honestly his Kung Fu is some of the best Traditional Hung Gar iā€™ve ever seen. I only wish my schedule would let me keep training there.
By the way when you go to Vancouver do you ever hook up with any Hung gar schools there? And where are you based out of?

Jerry battle - I also thank you for your comments. Itā€™s good to see other Tang Fong people around. In vancouver it is only LSW lineage.
I thank all of you for posting your opinions and getting me a little more caught up in the Martial Arts world. Iā€™m sorry that Iā€™m not thanking all of the people who posted on this forum, but to be honest with you, Iā€™m a little lazy to scroll up!

36

Iā€™m not sure if this was mentioned, but..Tang Fong ā€˜styleā€™(if I may be so bold) is also known for more sinking of the horse and gathering of power, as well as in some techniques to be a bit more yeilding in order to draw the opponent into cum na sao. This is due to the fact that Tang Fong was smaller in stature than Lam Sai-Wing-who was a pig butcher, and known for his size and strength, and also had a backround in Northen Gung-Fu as well, so the forms are played a little higher and ā€œlighterā€(?). Ok, that being said, let me also contradict myself by saying that the interpetation of the form is based entirely on the Sifu, and that there are plenty of Lam Sai-Wing practitioners that have deep low horses, and utilize whole body strength.
Hung Tiger Shullmanā€™s ? Dang! I wanted to be that!
-Rik

37

you still can ten tigers , the tiger schulmanā€™s of the hung system are found in any city in your local area lol. Hint follow the yee and get robbed till ya bleeeeed lol

38

HungFutKune

I know for a fact your sifu would not want his name posted here, so donā€™t bother asking him.

39

HungFutKune,

Iā€™m glad you took my post exactly as it was meant. some good fun. If your sifu is private, I can totally respect that. I donā€™t get up to Vancouver too often. Might go in the summer. Last time I did not visit any Hung Gar sifus there.

FYI, I am based in Sunnyvale, CA at Wing Lam Kung Fu.

Ten Tigers,

I may agree on the low stances but being ā€œyieldingā€ is a hallmark of our kwoon and from what I have learned, signature to Lam Jo and Chiu Wai lines. Not arguing, just from what Iā€™ve seen.

That said. I do notice a lot of Hung Gar guys play their game very hard. (From both lines) I think itā€™s how we are taught to start but soften at the high levels.