Ive been trying out some different moves to thwart takedowns. I study Kuk Sool Won and BJJ. Our horse stance is the same in kuk sool as it is in Northern Shaolin. Now I dont stand in horse and let someone tackle me head on but when the takedown comes I step back at an angle to the attack, assume the stance, and then control their head with my arms to throw them onto the floor. Have any of you guys tried this it works pretty good for me.
Your joking. Right? A horse stance? That sounds like a bad idea to me. Even if you turned at an angle you would still be vulnerable to a single leg takedown.
I didn’t know there was a BJJ school in conneticet (spelling).
“Then he was above me. He attacked critial point ver well. I was near death.” — Takada after his fight with Rickson
I think
he’s in Colorado
Knowing others is wisdom, Knowing the self is enlightenment- Lao Tzu
???
Who has this worked against? It sounds to me like they haven’t learned to “turn the corner” properly…
I’ve used it against wrestlers. It works but you have to use it actively. Basically, drop straight into it whenever you think they are going to shoot and be ready to push them back. If they initiate the take down before you can drop they will get you everytime.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
Strange…
You know, no matter how many times I hear this, I just don’t understand what’s going on. I guess I’m just not envisioning it properly, because from the description given, I’d go right to the single leg, or ankle pick. When you push, are you maintaining that classic horse stance position, or are you getting your hips and feet back with your weight into the shooter?
As always, I’m not trying to be a jerk, I just don’t seem to get it. To forestall anybody, I don’t think the sprawl is the ONLY way out of a wrestlers shot. I’ve been dumped enough times by an uchi mata throw from judo to know that’s not true 
Sure, what a horse stance does is drop your center of gravity. The trick is to keep my center under yours. Also, you can’t drop and root. Pushing your hands out is putting pressure on the other guy who now has a higher center than yours. You’re looking for a takedown of your own.
Personally, I think it works because the other guy registers the drop as a “warning” that you’re about to do something and then backs off. With all things, it comes down to who can control the game.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
Or maybe think of the horse stance as a sprawl in which you’re not dependant on the other guy to hold you up. Play with it and you’ll figure it out. Just be proactive rather than reactive.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
Using the horse stance movement does stop the takedown if your opponent is sloppy and doesn’t really have much technique. After all, you are sinking your weight and spreading out your base. But up against a good wrestler you had better learn real counters or else you going down 
Uh guys…
I think he means using a horse stance to throw the guy. Am I on target?
In which case, yes it’s one of the few throws I can use to break a stationary wrestlers root. It did against this guy I know that took nationals for 175 lbs.
If they are actively shooting a crossing leg throw would be better because it allows you more pivot.
Then of course there is the famous throw, “Horse stance lift up” thats common to anything that has crossed paths with shaolin.
King of the Dinosaurs
Real Counters???
Just like a sprawl, dropping to a horse stance requires that you initiate before the clinch is completed. If you can sprawl out of a double leg AFTER you’ve been clinched, you are ONE BAD MUTHA F----!!!
More real counters:
Neck Surround
Fading hip (I can’t do this but I’ve seen it done against some good wrestlers)
All of these require the you do something else. You can’t do a triangle without a good guard, but if ALL you have is a guard with no sub to back it up, you might as well have no guard.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
I use something similiar
I do something similiar. If I get their head, I end up in the mount facing 180 degrees from my original orientation. I’m doing a variation of Embrace Tiger/Return to Mountain. It is similiar to your step back into horse except I never root the leg I step back with until I am in contact with the opponent. It works about half the time.
If they are getting a leg(s), I end up sprawling.
SW, Are you studying BJJ in Denver or Boulder?
One must toughen up without losing one’s tenderness.
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I was reffering to the one leg takedown. when they go for that leg, step back, then grab their head and rotate them onto the floor. Works pretty good if you do it quick.
8step
Let me get this straight, you threw the national champ at 174 (oh by the way the category is 174 not 175) while in a horse stance. I really want to shake your hand, I’ve seen Josh Koscheck wrestle for Edinboro a few times and I’ve never seen him close to being thrown. I don’t think he has been thrown for 3 points since maybe grade 10. If you could do that you really should think of trying out for Olympic trials. Josh will do well, but i don’t think he can take Williams; you guys are lucky that Gutches isn’t wrestling. I’d put my money on him any day.
Uchi mata off single
Actually, even a very good wrestler will be caught off guard by an uchi mata if you use it to throw them when they have attempted a single leg take down. They just aren’t used to that counter… You sprawl as a fake, just enough to get a bit of your weight on him, then turn your leg, as if you were going to try and run/mule kick away, secure a whizzer grip on the near arm and place your hand under or over the opponents far armpit, then dump him over your leg for the throw. Gotta COMMIT though. Can’t do it half arsed. It took me a few times before I figured out what was happenning, but I’ve picked it up now. Works GREAT! With sturdy pants (like a gi) on it’s even better! Can also be used off a whizzer grip or a russian 2 on 1.
You can sprawl out of a double leg when somebody has it locked up. As long as just one of your feet are contacting the ground, you can still execute the sprawl. Decent counter wrestlers do this all the time. When your feet are off the ground you’ll have more problems.
I understand about lowering your center of gravity, but the single leg take down doesn’t rely on penetration through the center of gravity the same way that a double does. You can execute a single from much further out because you can sweep out, pick the ankle as you do it, attack the knee, etc, and the finishes are varied too. From everybody’s description, I can’t figure out how a horse stance wouldn’t open you up to a single.
One last thing It sounds like the people shooting against Studd have their heads down, and are leaning over their own centers of gravity too far. The move he’s talking about sounds very similar to a 1/4 nelson from the front, which I use frequently, and ESPECIALLY when the opponent has their heads down, because it’s so easy to get when they do that.
Merry Prankster
I’ll try one more time. Then I quit. It’s one of those things that’s easier to show than describe.
If were squared off, assuming you’re a wrestler: You will be facing me head on, I will have one leg (for me it’s the right) forward. You will probably not go for the double because of my position. It wouldn’t make sense. The single is right there for you. I realize this so I will protect it. When I see you drop, I will drop also and stick my right hand out and try to press on your left shoulder. I need to be able to keep your center above mine so that you can’t get the position for the shoot. I’m not trying to stop the single leg, I’m trying to stop you from being able to start it. Once you start to shoot, I’ll probably go down. The only two things I personally know to do once I’m caught is to go for a guillotine and drop into guard (head down) or a neck surround (head up) Neck surround is a combo head lock hip toss and only works if I rush you at the same time.
With the Taiji and now the Shuai Chiao I’m studying, I’m trying to actually get closer than you are. A lot of the stuff I’m learning depends on us being body to body. So I’m using the horse to find a way in. It’s a momentary thing while I’m seeking my open door. Don’t think it’s fool proof because it’s not. In fact, the move opens me up for an ankle pick pretty often. (Maybe that will help, try to picture someone in a horse and it’s hard for you to take the single but relatively easy to take an ankle pick) Maybe it’s hard for you to come “in” but easy to come “down”
As far as I go, if someone clinches and actually wrap the back of my knees–I’m done. I’m going down like a back alley *****.
In conclusion, no, you can’t drop straight to a horse and hope for the best. You have to be active and look for your own attack. The other guy HAS to be uncomfortable. It is also not the preferable thing for me. For me, I want to come straight in with my foot between yours (a little behind) and our chests touching. I use the horse to try and get there without being shot on along the way.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
Gotcha
Ok, what you wrote makes sense water dragon. It’s very similar to a buck back… and you are defending your leg by changing levels… Thanks!
Without being haughty, may I make a suggestion w/regards to defending the shot? While you may not be as “twitchy” with the sprawl as a guy who wrestles day in and out, when they shoot, even if they get their hands in on the back of your knees, sprawl, get your hips DOWN and your legs back, secure a whizzer grip with one arm, and use the other hand to try and push the opponents head down to the mat. Use the whizzer grip to counter the opponents hold on your knee. Whatever hand has the whizzer, sink that same leg back and away, and use your hips to help apply pressure on the whizzer.
I try Bro, believe me I try. It’s probably one of those things I need to keep working on.
If you understand what I’m doing, maybe you can tell me how to stop that damn ankle pick. 
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics
What’s a “whizzer grip”? 
A “whizzer” is basically a wrestlers version of the Taiji ward-off with the added benefit of being able to cause a nasty little rub burn on the face.
Although there are many styles, they all depend on the strong beating the weak and the slow falling to the quick. These are not related to the power that must be learned – Taiji Classics