Anyone has any experience with this ?
As the old members of you might remember, I was the dude searching for over a year to find a club nearby, I then found one, pretty **** far away. Now I lost my transport to get there, so I’m well … out of the Wing Tsun business =(
Then I went searching for MA in general nearby, and the closest thing to an MA besides ***** ass Karate, was Aikido, is Aikido even worth the trouble ? I mean Wing Tsun was **** effective, but Aikido wtf is that all about ? I saw a video of their grandmaster who could kick your ass without even touching the opponent, I mean how gay do you have to be to believe that **** ? I hope he was just demonstrating the flow or something, and not really trying to show everybody he was kicking ass without touching them … I mean wtf ? =/
So if anyone here has crosstrained Aikido or something, let me know, I really wanne stay in the MA environment, I just love it ! But wtf is the deal with the pink friggin non touching fighting, I mean c’mon, people actually buy that crap ? :[
I am not saying I am the only opinion you have to listen to, but, I have fought my share of rough fights, san shou bouts, worked with resisting opponents, etc. and I still have not found someone that I think could take my old Aikido Sensei. Dont diss it until you try it out, a good aikido player can make you feel like you are trying to kick the oceans ass while standing waist deep in it. The throws feel like a huge wave picks you up, and you dont even know what is happening until you are on your head or worse. Only THIS ocean is laughing at you the whole time while you are having your A$$ handed to you My point is that I love Hung Gar, and respect the other fighting systems out there too, including MMA of course, and I say DONT MESS with a good Aikido Player unless you want to die and have no idea how it happened. And dont mess with a bad one unless you want to die laughing Just my 2 golden Taels
PS: oh, and the non touch thing, it works..but not the way you think it works..you just have to experience it yourself and you will feel what is going on..its not magic..Aikido just abuses some of the body’s natural reactions to certain things to make some techniques work..again, you dont think it works..go to Aikido Seikikai to name one school in WA, and try it out..hope you know how to take hardfalls on the back of your head safely
ok, I’ll try it out, I got another option atm, Tai Chi Quan (am I spelling it correctly ?), but it seems to be the ***** version of WT ? I’ll go take a look at aikido, if it’s good and the clothes don’t cost too much I’ll try it for a year it’s extremely close to my home anyway.
Hmm..one cool thing to do though is cross train in judo with aikido a bit so you know that there is a hard side to it Only a bit though..Aikido doesnt need the judo to work, it just lets you see what is hidden in there is all if you want to know.. Its from japan, and you will hear good things and bad things about it on this board, but one thing is for sure..it, like many martial arts has good and bad practitioners, but if you work hard and are patient, after a couple years you can throw your friends around like ragdolls and you can develop a very cool ability to tell what someones body is doing just by touching, say, their wrist and not looking All it takes is hard work…if the school seems too new age-y then just learn some techniques and practice them with a partner that knows/will learn how to fall outside of the school..you will learn some good stuff. The feeling of a good aikido player that wants to get you is comparable to the feeling a mouse gets when its looking up at a cat that doesnt bother to hide..it just keeps stalking closer and closer and the mouse KNOWS its screwed! Its pretty cool
Belgium is a small country and there are a lot of WT schools there:
Antwerp
Victor Kan Classical Ving Tsun Kung Fu
Tel: +32/ 0486 796154 or +352/(0)91 382897
Web: www.vingtsunvk.com
Notes: affiliated with Sifu Victor Kan.
Update: 16nov02
Nederlandse Wing Chun Kung Fu Federatie
Belgielei 99 Stedelijke Basisschool
Tel: 03 4545705
Email: federatie@wingchun.nl
Web: www.wingchun.nl
Notes: Maandag 19.30-21.30
Bornem
Wing Tsun in Bornem
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Bree
Wing Tsun in Bree
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Braschaat
Wing Tsun in Braschaat
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Brussels
Académie de kung fu wing chun traditionnel
55 rue du Brochet 1050 Bruxelles
Tel: 0477/57 38 40
Contact: Sifu Laurent Aoute
Notes: Cours le Lundi 20h00 à 21h30, Mardi 18h30 à 20h00, Vendredi 18h30 à 20h30, Samedi 12h30 à 14h00.
AMOK Club of Wing Chun and Kali
Rue Crickx 31, 1060 Brussels
Tel: 0032 2 537 08 07 (voice mail)
Fax: 0032 2 538 61 02
Email: amokclub@yahoo.com
Web: www.members.tripod.com/~asblcesar
Contact: Es Samri Aziz or Thauvoy Jesabel
Notes: Wing Chun and Kali-Arnis-Escrima.
Victor Kan Classical Ving Tsun Kung Fu
Tel: +32/ 0486 796154 or +352/(0)91 382897
Web: www.vingtsunvk.com
Notes: affiliated with Sifu Victor Kan.
Update: 16nov02
Wing Tsun in Brussels
Tel: 02-2304749
Contact: Ralph Rahders
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie). Affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Charleroi
Tang Shun Ping Wing Chun Kuen
Charleroi, Hainaut, Belgium
Tel: +32 486 16.38.98
Email: fabrizio.nicosia@skynet.be
Web: www.ving-tsun.be.tf
Contact: Fabrizio NICOSIA
Notes: Member of the Ving Tsun Athletic Association.
Update: 6oct02
Deurne
Wing Tsun in Deurne
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Geel
Wing Tsun in Geel
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Gent
Wing Tsun in Gent
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Hasselt
Wing Tsun in Hasselt
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Leopoldsburg
Wing Tsun in Leopoldsburg
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Lier
Kon. Julianalaan 8, 2678 ED, De Lier
Tel: 0174-510884
Contact: Jan Pieter Boekestijn, Level 10 (Instructor)
Notes: affiliated with WWCKFA.
Meeuwen
Wing Tsun in Meeuwen
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Mol
Wing Tsun in Mol
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Sint-Niklaas
Wing Tsun in Sint-Niklaas
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
Tongerlo
Wing Tsun in Tongerlo
Tel: 089-473038
Contact: Sifu Ernst Krause
Notes: Part of the VWTO (Vlaamse Wing Tsun Organisatie), affiliated with the IWTMAA and EWTO.
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Oh, and like I said..it can be found for sure (good aikido) at aikido seikikai in WA. I forever owe a debt of gratitude to that school for opening my eyes to some of the cooler things in the world of getting your butt kicked..they train hard, and they (the senior students at least) are a dedicated bunch. Regardless..dont take my word for it, if any of you are in seattle or japan, look up seikikai, and try them for yourself..
Oh, and going with carly’s statement..I have the feeling/impression that good aikido schools are few and far between..there are a LOT of “harmonize with the universe, and feel the magical ki flowing through you until you can blast your opponents into the netherworld” type schools out there unfortunately
i trained aikido for 5 years before i met my Sifu (now only do qigong and wing chun). in every encounter i have been in it has served me very well… even just knowing how to land without snapping and about being in a good position. even how to take someones centre and when you can hit them… they are all very useful.
like Golden Arms said. Here at my uni we have an old sensei who is around 70… his grip is SO strong, and the way he uses that bokken (ie. stops the technique - sword moving, body-weight, step etc. at EXACTLY the same time), kinda tells me he has good power as well.
Most people who havent trained long say that we dont use resisting opponents, but actually we do… u just cant really resist it and its the boduies natural reaction - otherwise things get snapped
My 1st aikido lesson back home (as an equivalent 2nd dan in shotokan) consisted of me trying to hit the teacher any way i could while then being dumped on my ass, back, side, front and all manner of weirs things happening to me as i couldnt touch him!
so there IS good stuff, but like good kung fu you just have to find it
I mean Wing Tsun was **** effective, but Aikido wtf is that all about ?
This thread is funny on so many levels.
Aikido players get schooled frequently by judoka in randori. At one time Aikido was quite respectable and to even begin aikido, you had be a shodan rank or better in judo (A man who understood the principles of offbalancing, turning force against an opponent, re direction of energy)
but sadly aikido fails.
They cannot practice their art against a resisting opponent. I train regulary with several judoka who started in aikido and came running to judo after spending many years in the art. Why? - Lack of reality. and the “cult like” obsession with bushido.
Remember Ueyeshiba had a “religious experience” when aikido came to him..
Is aikido worthless? no. There are several wristlocks and techniques that are very good as I have been shown but can be better suited to fighting if applied in a more realistic grappling system.
Most people who havent trained long say that we dont use resisting opponents, but actually we do… u just cant really resist it and its the boduies natural reaction - otherwise things get snapped
half true.
Yes you roll out of the lock as to not break your limb, but the setups are very much scripted.
My judo club shares space with a very large aikido club. I frequently randori with them. They are fish out of water in a live situation. It was comedic (prob the reason they ask us to randori with them to learn things that do work.)
and here we begin with the usual San Shou/BJJ/Judo troll we have come to expect…
fair enough ST00 but i have used it against people in a real encounter and it has worked just fine, also against people who trained kickboxing, karate and other things.
Actually in my own experience aikido and wing chun are what i am comfortable using now and they have served me well.
there are a few others here who also successfully use aikido as part of their repertoire so no big deal.
To begin learning the techniques yes they have been codified and are pretty static, but i dont know about the school you have seen - but we regularly trained with other MA styles and went at each other in a non-scripted manner (depending on your level).
i know many people who train aikido who are police officers, jail wardens and bouncers, who have used the sakill successfully in an alive, real manner.
I am well aware of the aikido wristlocks used by LEO’s but that is where the systems abilty ends.
As a fighting method it is horrible.
Please explain to me why a green belt judoka in my class who had never studied another sport let alone a grappling system, thrash two 5 year+ aikido students in simple randori. I had expected the young aikido man to lambaste my fellow student, but to my utter amazement he fell prey to every basic throw judoboy applied.
By the time I was called to the mat I was giddy with anticipation and I think my opposition was actually scarred…
(Apoweyn, whom had no grappling training before the time we worked out had 2x the balance and common sense to stay on his feet)
But the aikido guys are humble. fanatical, samarai- wanna be’s but a very nice group. and we welcome them into our class as often as they can come.
LOL..ok…I am not going to say you are a troll..but in NO WAY do your few experiences happen to invalidate the fact that both Dezhen and Myself HAVE been to good aikido schools, and we both said they are not all that common. I have used it in 2 real situations..one of them involving a knife even..and I came out no worse for wear…and still standing Is it the end all of martial arts? Not more than any other art is…does it work if you train hard and is it proven effective? To me at least, yes… But again, I can see how people think it is not too good because, like tai chi, there are very few people that train it hard, realistic, and long enough to “get it”..
Oh, and just to get ahead of you ST00 My Sensei WAS a long time judo player before he became an aikido player..he travelled to japan, with no money or food and asked for several months to be allowed as a student to kurita sensei before finally getting the go ahead. I once asked him “how does aikido deal with a jab?” he replied by saying “thow one sometime” Heheh..I did a couple weeks later when he was talking to someone..he wasnt there when it should have hit…Where he WAS was standing on my front foot while he threw me onto the back of my head.
My point is that I love Hung Gar, and respect the other fighting systems out there too, including MMA of course, and I say DONT MESS with a good Aikido Player unless you want to die and have no idea how it happened. And dont mess with a bad one unless you want to die laughing 
Just my 2 golden Taels
Only a bit though..Aikido doesnt need the judo to work, it just lets you see what is hidden in there is all if you want to know.. Its from japan, and you will hear good things and bad things about it on this board, but one thing is for sure..it, like many martial arts has good and bad practitioners, but if you work hard and are patient, after a couple years you can throw your friends around like ragdolls and you can develop a very cool ability to tell what someones body is doing just by touching, say, their wrist and not looking