# Choy Lay Fut (Tat Mau Wong) **URL:** \ **Category:** Southern Chinese Kung Fu\ **Created:** [March 20, 2002, 4:54am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516 "2002-03-20T04:54:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![GreenCloudCLF](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/greencloudclf/32/570_2.png) [@GreenCloudCLF](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/GreenCloudCLF)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2005, 11:51pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/41 "2005-06-19T23:51:10Z")
Tat Mau Wong’s CLF videos are available again through century [TAT MAU WONG](http://www.centuryfitness.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10051&storeId=10051&productId=83069&langId=-1&product_parentId=13620&crumb=13501-13753&categoryId=13620&parent_category_rn=13756) They have been discounted to only 10 bucks a pop…good deal ---
**Author:** ![GreenCloudCLF](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/greencloudclf/32/570_2.png) [@GreenCloudCLF](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/GreenCloudCLF)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 7:28pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/42 "2006-03-23T19:28:11Z")
Tat Mau Wong Panther Video Question An old training borther of mine stopped by and dropped off one of Wong Sifu’s Panther Videos, because he has since quit KF. Anyway, it is tape 3 (5 Animal Form and Tuet Jin Hand Form) Anyone know what Tuet Jin means in English? I already checked DFW’s website (cause he has a lot of forms listed), but it wasn’t there. There was something close > [@www.plumblossom.net](#): > > Iron Arrow Long Fist Form (Tit Jin Cheong Kuen) But I wasn’t sure if this was the same thing? Any of my fellow CLF’ers know the answer? ---
**Author:** ![Fu-Pow](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/fu-pow/32/107_2.png) [@Fu-Pow](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Fu-Pow)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 8:03pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/43 "2006-03-23T20:03:36Z")
Tid Jin Cheung Kuen and Tuet Jin Kuen mean totally different things. Tid Jin Cheung Kuen=Iron Arrow Long Fist Tuet Jin Kuen=Break Hold Fist I also refer to it as “Escape the Circle” Fist because some of the techniques are designed to get you out of a circle of attackers. This name similarity had me confused for a long time. FP ---
**Author:** ![GreenCloudCLF](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/greencloudclf/32/570_2.png) [@GreenCloudCLF](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/GreenCloudCLF)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 8:32pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/44 "2006-03-23T20:32:39Z")
Gracias Fu-Pow ---
**Author:** ![Eddie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/eddie/32/126_2.png) [@Eddie](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Eddie)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 8:55pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/45 "2006-03-23T20:55:20Z")
erm, our school used to call it - “the great escape form” - this came from master LKH circa 1987. I have a home video tape from master LKH which was made during that time, where they zoom into a peace of paper with the names of the forms performed. On that it says its called ‘war escape form’. Fu pows breaking holds fist is probably the closest. ---
**Author:** ![CLFNole](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/clfnole/32/50_2.png) [@CLFNole](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/CLFNole)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 9:59pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/46 "2006-03-23T21:59:09Z")
Breaking holds is a definition that Lily Lau uses for their form that shares the same name. When I asked my wife to translate it she kept saying something about going to war or into a battle. She can be a pain in the arse when trying to get something translated. ---
**Author:** ![Fu-Pow](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/fu-pow/32/107_2.png) [@Fu-Pow](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Fu-Pow)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2006, 10:02pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/47 "2006-03-23T22:02:52Z")
I pretty much did a direct translation from the characters and it came up as something like “break hold” or “break away.” ---
**Author:** ![CLFNole](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/clfnole/32/50_2.png) [@CLFNole](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/CLFNole)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 1:12am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/48 "2006-03-24T01:12:21Z")
Fu-Pow: One thing I have learned is that for so reason or another translating of the characters is not always enough. Cantonese tend to use a lot of slang and as you probably already know there are a lot of multiple meanings for characters. I just asked my wife about it becuase she wrote out a lot of the curriculum for sifu years ago. According to her the 2nd character “tsin” means war. It could be like ping kuen where the character for ping means both level and peaceful. Some translate the form as level fist and others peaceful fist. Peace. ---
**Author:** ![Fu-Pow](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/fu-pow/32/107_2.png) [@Fu-Pow](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Fu-Pow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 6:53am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/49 "2006-03-24T06:53:34Z")
When in doubt gotta go straight to the source: Tyut [http://www.chinalanguage.com/cgi-bin/view.php?query=812B&encoding=text&mode=&lang=en&beijing=pinyin&canton=jyutping&meixian=pinjim&sound=0&fields=cantonese,english](http://www.chinalanguage.com/cgi-bin/view.php?query=812B&encoding=text&mode=&lang=en&beijing=pinyin&canton=jyutping&meixian=pinjim&sound=0&fields=cantonese,english) [1] [v] take off; peel off; strip; undress; take off [2] [v] abandon; renounce; cast off [3] [v] leave; escape from; get out of [4] [v] omit; omission; miss out [5] [v] slip off [6] if; in case; perhaps Jin [http://www.chinalanguage.com/cgi-bin/view.php?query=6230&encoding=text&mode=&lang=en&beijing=pinyin&canton=jyutping&meixian=pinjim&sound=0&fields=cantonese,english](http://www.chinalanguage.com/cgi-bin/view.php?query=6230&encoding=text&mode=&lang=en&beijing=pinyin&canton=jyutping&meixian=pinjim&sound=0&fields=cantonese,english) English [1] war; warfare; fighting; battle [2] [v] contest; fight; contend [3] [v] shudder; shiver; tremble [4] a Chinese family name So in actuality something like “escape the fight.” Which make sense. I think I got “break holds” from some other translation. (On the curriculum I made for my Sifu I wrote “circle out.”) Both translations kind of make sense though because sometimes you must “break holds” to “escape the fight.” ;-). FP ---
**Author:** ![Eddie](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/eddie/32/126_2.png) [@Eddie](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Eddie)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 7:05am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/50 "2006-03-24T07:05:02Z")
CLFNole, about a year or so back i send you that video tape. Not sure if you ever received it. It has the names of the forms written on a paper and zoomed into it - it has the chinese text as well as the engligh explanaiton. As i said, it translates it as war escape. ---
**Author:** ![CLFNole](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/clfnole/32/50_2.png) [@CLFNole](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/CLFNole)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 3:47pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/51 "2006-03-24T15:47:56Z")
Eddie: Never got the tape you spoke of. Sorry would have liked to seen it though. Fu-Pow: I think when you look at the set itself it could be loosely translated to “escaping from a war/battle”. I guess my wife was right when she kept saying something along the lines of “fighting in a war”. The form was obviously designed for multiple attackers which would be seen in battle. Peace. ---
**Author:** ![Fu-Pow](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/fu-pow/32/107_2.png) [@Fu-Pow](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Fu-Pow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 6:43pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/52 "2006-03-24T18:43:29Z")
> [@CLFNole](#): > > Eddie: > > Never got the tape you spoke of. Sorry would have liked to seen it though. > > Fu-Pow: > > I think when you look at the set itself it could be loosely translated to “escaping from a war/battle”. I guess my wife was right when she kept saying something along the lines of “fighting in a war”. The form was obviously designed for multiple attackers which would be seen in battle. > > Peace. I see the form as a means to escape from a circle of attackers. Especially the Che San Sau Chui combo and the quick changes in the direction of attack/defense. Jin can me war, fight or battle so there is some ambiguity. However, I think that if you were in battle and you escaped from multiple attackers you’d still be…well…in the midst of the battle. Anyways, the idea is to escape on that much I think we can agree. 😃 FP ---
**Author:** ![fu\_jow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@fu\_jow](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/fu_jow)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 8:14pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/53 "2006-03-24T20:14:37Z")
this wont help i asked one of my sihings what the tranlation was, a while back, and he told me: “take off your shirt and run!”. but i still think he was messing with me. ---
**Author:** ![CLFNole](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/clfnole/32/50_2.png) [@CLFNole](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/CLFNole)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 9:04pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/54 "2006-03-24T21:04:05Z")
Bottom line here is the form was designed to focus on multiple attackers. Personally I am not much for english translations, to me it is easier just to use chinese. Plus it sounds cooler 😉 ---
**Author:** ![GreenCloudCLF](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/greencloudclf/32/570_2.png) [@GreenCloudCLF](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/GreenCloudCLF)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 9:31pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/55 "2006-03-24T21:31:10Z")
> [@CLFNole](#): > > Bottom line here is the form was designed to focus on multiple attackers. > > Personally I am not much for english translations, to me it is easier just to use chinese. Plus it sounds cooler 😉 I agree in liking to use the Chinese terminology…but I also like to know the English equivalent…I wouldn’t want to teach the “White Devil sucks pen1s” form…ya know… ---
**Author:** ![Hung25](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Hung25](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Hung25)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 5:30am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/56 "2011-08-23T05:30:14Z")
Tat Mau Wong Distance Learning VHS! Hi, if anyone has Tat Mau Wong Choy Lay Fut Distance Learning VHS series, please reply to my thread. I’ll buy the if the price is reasonable enough. Thx! ---
**Author:** ![CLFLPstudent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58f4c7/32.png) [@CLFLPstudent](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/CLFLPstudent)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 5:43am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/57 "2011-08-23T05:43:07Z")
VHS??? Wong Sifu needs to get with the times!!! -David ---
**Author:** ![Hung25](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Hung25](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Hung25)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 10:25am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/58 "2011-08-23T10:25:17Z")
Well, I don’t know if they have DVD format for the Distance Learning titles:). I’m trying to look everywhere but can’t find them, even on Ebay. ---
**Author:** ![Hung25](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Hung25](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Hung25)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 11:16am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/59 "2011-08-23T11:16:03Z")
This is the link but they don’t sell them anymore: [http://www.tatwong.com/distance.php](http://www.tatwong.com/distance.php) ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2024, 11:27pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516/60 "2024-01-16T23:27:23Z")
[QUOTE=Fu-Pow;665885]When in doubt gotta go straight to the source: Tyut [http://www.chinalanguage.com](http://www.chinalanguage.com) [1] [v] take off; peel off; strip; undress; take off [2] [v] abandon; renounce; cast off [3] [v] leave; escape from; get out of [4] [v] omit; omission; miss out [5] [v] slip off [6] if; in case; perhaps Jin [http://www.chinalanguage.com](http://www.chinalanguage.com) [1] war; warfare; fighting; battle [2] [v] contest; fight; contend [3] [v] shudder; shiver; tremble [4] a Chinese family name So in actuality something like “escape the fight.” Which make sense. I think I got “break holds” from some other translation. (On the curriculum I made for my Sifu I wrote “circle out.”) Both translations kind of make sense though because sometimes you must “break holds” to “escape the fight.” ;-). FP[/QUOTE] Great discussion, thanks to all of you guys, I was actually researching the translation of Tuet Jin Kuen and it was very helpful! Would the characters for Tuet Jin Kuen be [SIZE=5] [/SIZE] (tyut3 zin3 kyun4)? [INDENT] [SIZE=5][/SIZE] (tyut3) -\> [https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=脫](https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=%E8%84%AB) [SIZE=5][/SIZE] (zin3) -\> [https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=戰](https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=%E6%88%B0) [SIZE=5][/SIZE] (kyun4) -\> [https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=拳](https://cantonese.org/search.php?q=%E6%8B%B3) [/INDENT] [Previous page](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/choy-lay-fut-tat-mau-wong/10516.md?page=4)