What do you guys think of B.K. Frantzis and Mantak Chia?I have heard that Mantak Chia is a phony and B.K. Frantzis has no skill in the Internal Martial Arts.The guy who said this said that he was told this about B.K. Frantzis by people in the Yang and Chen family. What do you guys think about this?
I think it’s inflammatory hearsay.
And I can’t stand Mantak Chia’s books.
Merciless is Mercy.
But B-K Frantzis went to china for 10 years, and learned many chinese boxing styles from many big time chinese masters, so he have to be good, he just have to be! Lol
Yeah, but I have heard that BK has some skills, he’s just an A$. And it came from a source that I know The BT would consider valid.
You may take my life, but you will never take my Freedom
Unless you are taking lessons from either it really doesn’t matter. And if you are, you won’t be needing a skilled teacher to learn the basics of taijiquan, just someone who actually learned the basics of taijiquan themselves, which is only about 1/100 practioners.
“won’t be needing a skilled teacher to learn the basics of taijiquan”
I have to disagree with this in fact go so far as to say its the opposite. Here’s an analogy, say an F-15 Eagle pilot aims just a bit off target by his instruments then his bombs may land many miles off target.
HHmmm
Mantak Chia was supposed to of learnt his Internal Alchemy disciplines frm Taoist monks, but his Taiji forms I’m wholly unsure of where he got them from.
Mr Frantzis’s skill I believe lies mostly in his Bagua, his Taiji is not his strong point. He has been turned down by a few Taiji masters because they thought his attitude was sub-standard. He has come off rough a few times from some Masters and rejected any more teachings, primarily Wang Shu Jin. In his book he says how wonderfully he got on with him, but he fails to mention how through egotisim he finally was asked to leave his classes and not to come back. he has been refused by a few High level Masters, and I would expect been excepted by some others.
His Internal arts book, is not comprehensive and a little opinionated to be honest.
My view
When I first started to learn Pa Kua I heard of BK as a good martial artist. When I fought in my first tournament 3 - 4 years ago at Summer Bash in NYC - I saw him enter the place… this by mean is not meant to be any disrespect…but he had a big stomach and he wobbled in…he was receiving a award that day…I was shock to see this because when I was starting out I was reading books how Pa Kua practitioners were supposed to be flexible and agile…WOW!.. His book is a well written and I enjoyed reading it…
Chia’s books I found enjoyable to read…
brassmonkey, I will not argue with you on the point I made because most practioners of taijiquan are often under the impression that their teacher is highly skilled. I will emphasize however that the majority of people doing taijiquan are not learning it for anything except the health benefits, and possibly flexibility/relaxation.
So if you take that into account, you will find that the basics necessary to achieve that do not require a high level of taijiquan, and in fact, considering there are so many practioners, and so many teachers, you figure most of them are not very skilled.
I will not debate this subject though, as it is usually discomforting to westerners because they tend to feel they have and are receiving the true/best teachings/style/forms/philosophies/etc.
- Nexus
Great Post
[b]
brassmonkey, I will not argue with you on the point I made because most practioners of taijiquan are often under the impression that their teacher is highly skilled. I will emphasize however that the majority of people doing taijiquan are not learning it for anything except the health benefits, and possibly flexibility/relaxation.
So if you take that into account, you will find that the basics necessary to achieve that do not require a high level of taijiquan, and in fact, considering there are so many practioners, and so many teachers, you figure most of them are not very skilled.
I will not debate this subject though, as it is usually discomforting to westerners because they tend to feel they have and are receiving the true/best teachings/style/forms/philosophies/etc.
[/b]
The absolute best part about this post is it also demonstrates the mass egotism of many taiji practitioners.
That is to say:
“I know what I’m talking about because I am receiving a true transmission of taiji, but since most of the other people I’ve seen are crap, it’s unlikely you are.”
This is pretty much an epidemic amongst internal stylists, and is one of the reasons why I confine my posts to making obnoxious comments, rather than anything meaningful.
Merciless is Mercy.
I was quite aware that I would receive criticizm for saying that, but I still feel it is necessary to be made clear. Take it with a grain of salt if you please.
- Nexus
Actually, the problem is that most people think there is only one way, written in stone, to develop internal skill. If you don’t do it the way I do it, you are obviously wrong.
Now, think about this: How many ways are there to write the number 8? How many ways to make a pizza? How many ways to write the alphabet in cursive? If I don’t make my letters like you, does it mean I can’t write?
You may take my life, but you will never take my Freedom
bk frantzis
i have mixed it up with bk frantzis at some of his seminars when he used to come to New York and needless to say he has skills in push hands and ba gua. As for his build he is not the only good martial artist i knew that was overweight he moved well when he had to and his flexibility was above average. He has been challenged many times in his life and has done well according to all reliable eyewitness. As for his teaching method and personality to each his own, I have not studied or practiced his material in a very long time. I felt the need to look around after about 2 years. nuff said for today hope nobody was offended.
Not criticizing
Actually, I’m not really criticizing. I’m as guilty as sin. I’ve seen more than a high level, well known masters, who I think suck.
Like WD said though, it takes all kinds.
Most people slammed Earth Dragon when he talked about his teacher projecting chi at a distance, but to him it may have simply been a case of other people demonstrating their own teacher is not as high level as his.
Another funny thing is that people tend to judge teacher’s skill level by their students. While you might be able to judge their skill at teaching, it does not speak of their own power at all. We all study with teachers we are confident have the real deal, but we are also aware that some of our fellow students are not… motivated as we are? There are “health” nut taiji students in my classes. As a matter of fact, I’m the only martially oriented taiji student there.
Not only does not everyone teach martial taiji. Not everyone wants to learn it.
I could go one and on.
Merciless is Mercy.
but what about his main teacher, Liu Hong Chieh, he was a Taoist adept,spent ten years in the mountains.This was B.K. main teacher and he didn’t study with him till after all the others,I think he probably polished his Tai Chi up?
Liu
Is the one who taught him Wu taiji. I’d be interested to see Kumar’s taiji one day.
Merciless is Mercy.
“Actually, the problem is that most people think there is only one way, written in stone, to develop internal skill. If you don’t do it the way I do it, you are obviously wrong.”
There is only one way. Practice.
- Nexus
I’d like to see Kumar’s taiji in person one day myself as well.
- Nexus
Taiji
Kumar will be teaching open classes on Wednesday nights in November and December in Fairfax. I might go to some even though I don’t practice Taiji because the second class is Tui Shou and Rou Shou. Which I like. Anyways, check the guy out for yourself and see if he has anything to teach you. He is certainly not the teacher for everyone!
-Jess–
“Actually, the problem is that most people think there is only one way, written in stone, to develop internal skill. If you don’t do it the way I do it, you are obviously wrong.”
There is only one way. Practice.
So what is the correct way to throw a punch? Root off the front leg, root off the back leg? or root off both?
Who has the correct front stance? The Chens? The Yangs? The Wus?
Whose Single Whip is correct? Which frame? small medium or large?
You may take my life, but you will never take my Freedom