A Challenge to the masters of Chi...

Guys and Girls,

Here’s your chance to shut me and every other skeptic up and make a ton of money doing it.

It’s the Million Dollar Challenge of the James Randi Educational Foundation http://www.randi.org/research/index.html

All you have to do is:

“At JREF, we offer a one-million-dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event” --(Taken from the Million Dollar Challenge Web Page).

So, there it is. Shut me up, prove your power to the world, and make a million bucks!

Now don’t pull the Miss Cleo/Jonathon Edwards “I can’t express my power for financial gain” (irony in itself, why the books and 900 numbers then?) thing.

Found this Challenge on the Web.

Have fun.

I promise this will be my last contribution to the Chi/Ki debate…

…until the next thread :wink:

Dayyaaaaammmmmmmmmnnnnn, if only Turyian could post his “awesome Chi power in two weeks” sweetness hahahahahahha

Unfortunately, chi does not fall into the catagory of “paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event”.

I doubt anyone will take you up on that. I published the same challenge a couple of years ago in a UK martial arts mag and simply got slagged-off by the editors/publishers - obviously for daring to point out that the ‘Emperor has no clothes’.

There is far too much BS and auto-suggestion in martial arts, but sadly such truths are not popular.

Shaolin Boxer,

I think that you’ll find that Rhandi, the Sceptical Enquirer magazine, and CSICOP - the ‘Committe for the Scientific Investigation into Claims of the Paranormal’ would be more than very happy to accommodate anyone with alleged Chi powers.

Hhmm

Randi leaves little to be desired himself, he is a man without credibility. One should question his motives and his fears behind why he sets up such lame and superficial challenges. To be honest what ever way the “so-called” conclusive results go everyone knows that Randi is no benchmark of credibility.

I think as shaolinboxer does here.

Other potential can be enhanced by chi training. There seems to be a lot of confusion as to where one begins and the other starts. That’s where the joke is. Trying to figure that, and seeing thru the trickery that is bound to occur is another area of comedy if viewed thru ridiculous-colored glasses (made by same manufacturer as rose-colored glasses; what a patent!).

ho hum,
Cody

I think proving something and investigating something is a little different.
There are many people in China and other parts of the world quietly working on what these effects are and are not.

What would a high level chi gung master have to gain by accepting such a test? If he/ she was not interested money or fame. :cool:

They know it works and the people know it works since what ever is happening makes them better.

The idea of proving something that you know or believe to be true, others that you work with also believe it, for what?

seems like the ones out to disprove stand more to gain, the question is really why are they doing this.
money and fame, why would a chi gung master help them in this.

Mr. Richards

I can meditate and reach a point where my dan tien area begins to physically vibrate strangely. I can direct energy to make parts of my body feel tingly. I know the feeling of the “bubbling wells” This is chi power. However, it is not super-para-normal or any of that ****. In fact, the requirement is so vaguely worded that any actual phenomena will not fit the bill.
-FJ

Looking at it wrong

Non internal fighters are always viewing the internal as some out there, mystical thing. It’s not. It is based purely on science: alligning your body properly so it functions at its maximum, breathing and distributing air at its maximum and a study ofmphysics, disecting lines, angles and muscular system study.

Chi is there, but as my Master has taught me, its not something you throw out there to harm, its used to protect oneself, think of it as a reinforcement.

I was not a skeptic before, because I surely believe in this force that is obviously present, it grows all of our finger nails, even while we sleep, but never experinced it in a martial way. I have been training with Master Bong Chan now for a year, and it is real. I have felt the beginning stages of it I guess, a heavy, gravity type feeling around my hands and forearms. But more than that, I feel connected, to everything. Like I’m in a constant zone. I hear what I need to hear to progress or make desicions, I see answers everywhere.

This is no longer martial, but living on a higher plane. Laugh, dismiss, it’s your life, live at the level you choose for yourself. Your mind creates your reality.

As for Martial however, I’ll tell you this: I’ve studied Isshin-Ryu for 13 years, Hung Gar, Wing Chun and SHouthern Mantis, Internal fighting is a completely different ball game, like comparing two girls slapping each other, or Tae Kwon Do, with really good S. Mantis or Hung Gar – not even close.

I suggest if you want to taste internal, find a good hsing-I or Ba Gua club and cross hands with them. Well worth it. It took myself over a year to be lucky enough to find my master – I will never be the same.

Sceptisicm is great; very important. Otherwise you believe everything. But do not close your mind to possibilities.

I am not one to accept the chi throwing across the room (haven’t seen it yet or done to me so I am a sceptic), but when a 60 year old man who weights 135 lbs and throw a 27 year old who weights 210lbs (me) after attack with full power, well, there is something there – he obviously is not using strenght or speed as external stylist know it.

This is the truth. If you live in the NYC area, respond here. I am always willing to cross hands so you can feel the difference between internal and external.

Hope all is well.
Ray

I found a Hsing-I guy…

I’m looking into studying some Hsing-I after the Holiday season.

Cheers

A bunch of you have the wrong idea of chi, I am not going to explain it, you have to really discover chi on your own

Then why’d you post?

Enlighten us.

He’s right

Northern is right.

I just gort into this the other day with WC guys to swear Wc is internal. When you know internal, you’ll know that its not.

Dynamic tension is not internal, in fact, heading in the opposite direction.

Get a REALLLLLLYYYYYYYYY good teacher. Then have fun.

Rhandi’s arguement is not something that stands or falls by his credibility as you put it. BTW you did not specify what the problem is with him, and, if you do specify it, can you prove it?

In philosophy, an attempt to ridicule an arguement by calling a persons character into question is a well known fallacy called ‘argumentum ad hominem’ and such things are rightly dismissed.

Rhandi is not the only source, I for example listed three.

In my challenge, I suggested that the scientific journal ‘Nature’ be invited to adjudicate and publish the results.

BTW, I have investigated trance states, healing, chi and many, many other related phenomena since the 1970’s and am a consultant in complementary medicine in the UK . It isn’t simply a case of scepricism for its own sake, but more a question of providing proof for certain claims.

I’m more than familiar with the usual ‘mystical’ responses that pass for reasoned research and am long unimpressed by them.

There is a very serious side to all of this, and that is the the quackery that goes on with claims to cure illnesses such as cancer - sometimes in children. I have known people die as a result of following the advice of chi-gung ‘masters’ - whose only authority came from cultish suggestion techniques and dogma, issued to sick, terrified and vulnerable people.

To make it absolutely clear, I am not saying that effects do not exist - however - the atribution of said effects (with certainty and dogma) to specific causes (e.g. chi and meridian channel manipulations) has no basis in proof at all.

The different explantions worldwide, for these effects are usually hijacked as evidence in favour of one cultural or emotional belief.
It is said that the other explanations/theories are ‘just chi’ (for example, under a different name. That relatavism is almost never applied to the favoured culture. To do real research, it would be necessary to eliminate what is unnecessary in the understanding of what are very diverse practices - cultural baggage that hides rather than reveals any active agency.

A useful comparisson is western healing and chi-gung - exactly the same (apparent effects) but, no meridians, no accupuncture points, no breatrhing exercises are necessary.

About the ‘making of money’ - in my published challenge I suggested that any takers could donate the money to a charity of their choice - and pointed out how a successful delivery of proof would revolutionise world medicine leading to the saving of millions of lives - still - no takers.

A scientific study of chi-gung breathing exercises (using measurements in end tidal C02 regulation with an infa red mass spectrometer) - show that they are hyperventilation exercises, which create a state of respiratory induced alkalosis in teh brain - a natural inducer of trance states. Much psychiatric literature since the 1960’s has pointed out the role of Central Nervous System alkalosis in mental disorders and transitory first rank schizophrenic symptomology.

We, we martail artists, should not be afraid to face up toi these things in case the magic bubble bursts - we should (must) have the courage to find the truth. If our art is anything more than elaborate ritualised BS we have nothing at all to fear and we may advance the sum of human knowledge enough to help a lrage numebr of suffering souls.

Re: A Challenge to the masters of Chi…

Originally posted by MightyB
[B]Guys and Girls,

Here’s your chance to shut me and every other skeptic up and make a ton of money doing it.

It’s the Million Dollar Challenge of the James Randi Educational Foundation http://www.randi.org/research/index.html

All you have to do is:

[/B]

I’ve already spoken to randy. I challenged him to show proof that he has 1 million in escrow and to pay up to the person behind issue I brought up to him that he doged in classic randy style.

Learn about the issue your talking about before sounding dumber than you look.

Originally posted by Crimson Phoenix
Dayyaaaaammmmmmmmmnnnnn, if only Turyian could post his “awesome Chi power in two weeks” sweetness hahahahahahha

Nice picture of your roundeye son. Just wont let this one go. Looking for ideas? Hmmmmmm? The problem with people like you is you think you can get anything handed to you for the asking.

Pleasezzzzzzzzzzzz!!!

When and where did you talk with Randy, what powers do you have, adamantuim claws, night vision, leap a building in a single bound, regeneration, the ability to **** out gold eggs!

Money is not the issue, the claims you people make are.

How do you explain the KO’s that people like Dillman can do? Is it a disruption of chi? or the electrical system in the body/ Im not saying it is chi, but the KO’s do work, Id like to get a good explination on it.

I have seen no proof that Dillman can do ****, except beat the crap out of his commune of followers.

It will be the day he graps a non-follower and does one of those goose turd “one touch” knockouts on somebody who is swinging back.