# 20 rep deadlift program... **URL:** \ **Category:** Kung Fu Training and Health\ **Created:** [December 7, 2004, 2:49am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226 "2004-12-07T02:49:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![IronFist](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/ironfist/32/16_2.png) [@IronFist](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/IronFist)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2004, 8:56pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/21 "2004-12-07T20:56:28Z")
> Originally posted by Samurai Jack > Funny story; I was working out at the YMCA gym in thier squat rack (where most people just do pull-ups) when about mid-way through a twenty rep set this personal trainer guy comes up and watches as I finish out my set. As soon as I’m done he goes, “You should really lower the weight dude, you’re gonna hurt yourself.” Which kinda pi$$ed me off, but whatever. Wow, that would p.iss me off. > Next week the same guy comes up to me and says, “Dude, if you can lift that for twenty-reps you should go heavier, otherwise you’re just wasting your time.” Haha he counted your reps. PS. that would p.iss me off. > A month later I see these flyers all over the gym announcing a “New Squat Routine Seminar”, and guess who’s teaching it? I’ve got to stand in line for the racks for the next couple of weeks, and I finally quite going to the “Y”. Wow, that would really p.iss me off. > Personal Trainers… Ya gotta I love 'em… :rolleyes: Haha. There needs to be some kind of nation-wide standardization for personal trainers that includes some decent instruction or something. It’s really rediculous how bad it’s gotten. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2004, 9:10pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/22 "2004-12-07T21:10:25Z")
Yeah, it pizzed me off enough that I have no intrest in going back to no dang expensive gym full of teenagers endlessly pumping ten pound plates on the bench press and middle-aged yuppies ogling eachother’s lumpy a$$es on the stairclimber ever again. I’ll buy myself a nice home set-up when I can afford one. Scuh-rew the gym. ---
**Author:** ![Suntzu](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/suntzu/32/233_2.png) [@Suntzu](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Suntzu)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2004, 9:31pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/23 "2004-12-07T21:31:39Z")
it should really pi$$ u off that YOU didn’t come up with the ide for the Squat Seminar and make a few $$$ off of it… home gyms are nice… and they would be even more nicer if i was actually home every once in a while… ---
**Author:** ![Toby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@Toby](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Toby)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 1:12am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/24 "2004-12-08T01:12:46Z")
> Originally posted by Samurai Jack > I REALLY don’t want to get hurt as I’ve tweaked my lower back several times with Deadlifts and it always catches me by surprise. Plus it takes like two weeks to get back to normal. > That would be my main concern - staying concentrated for the whole 20 reps. 5 reps is hard enough for me to maintain form. I reckon with 20 I might lose concentration a bit and mess up something. Not so crucial while you’re still lifting light, but get towards your max and you’ll have to be careful. > Originally posted by Samurai Jack > The personal trainer story … > Fuck, that would really piss me off. Being naturally aggressive I would’ve confronted him about it. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 1:24am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/25 "2004-12-08T01:24:33Z")
Toby, how in the heck do you get the board to print your cursewords? Not that I’d use any… heh-heh… Ohhh, \*\*\*\* it, I would. 😃 Yeah, thanks to fa\_jing’s link, I’ve got an idea that rest/pause will be the way to go. 20 rep Dead’s are going to be a compromise. I’d probably prefer Squats, but I personally think Dead’s might have an advantage as far as hormone production is concerned since it uses even more muscle than Squats. It’ll be an interesting experiment. I’m pretty psyched to try it out. ---
**Author:** ![Toby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@Toby](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Toby)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 1:40am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/26 "2004-12-08T01:40:35Z")
> Originally posted by Samurai Jack > Toby, how in the heck do you get the board to print your cursewords? > Fuck, I don’t know 😕. [SIZE=1]Quote my post. Look closely at the quoted text and all will be revealed.[/SIZE] > Originally posted by Samurai Jack > Yeah, thanks to fa\_jing’s link, I’ve got an idea that rest/pause will be the way to go. > I love the deads, but I can’t help pausing between them. Even when it’s light. When I get to the end of a cycle, it’s probably like 30s between reps. I’ll do one, drop it, stand up and psych myself up for the next before starting. That way I maintain form better than if I just went one, two, …, five. OTOH I can rip out a squat set no problem. ---
**Author:** ![IronFist](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/ironfist/32/16_2.png) [@IronFist](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/IronFist)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 1:52am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/27 "2004-12-08T01:52:20Z")
I heard hormone production in squats and DL and stuff doesn’t really matter cuz your body produces something else with the GH or whatever to negate it. I dunno. I didn’t read any research or something, I just heard it from someone who supposedly read something. ---
**Author:** ![Toby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@Toby](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Toby)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 2:55am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/28 "2004-12-08T02:55:20Z")
_Does lazy Iron’s research for him_ “When blood glucose drops (during exercise or with carbohydrate restriction), insulin levels generally drop as well.” “When blood glucose increases, insulin levels increase as well, causing glucose in the bloodstream to be stored as glycogen in the muscle or liver… Protein synthesis is stimulated and free amino acids (the building blocks of proteins) are be moved into muscle cells and incorporated into larger proteins.” “Glucagon is essentially insulin’s mirror hormone and has essentially opposite effects. Like insulin, glucagon(s) … primary role is also to maintain blood glucose levels. However, glucogon acts by raising blood glucose when it drops below normal.” “Glucagon’s main action is in the liver, stimulating the breakdown of liver glycogen which is then released into the bloodstream.” “Under normal conditions, glucagon has very little effect in tissues other than the liver (i.e. fat and muscle cells). However, when insulin is very low, as occurs with carbohydrate restriction and exercise, glucagon plays a minor role in muscle glycogen breakdown …” “From the above descriptions, it should be clear that insulin and glucagon play antagonistic roles to one another. Whereas insulin is primarily a storage hormone, increase storage of glucose, protein and fat in the body; glucagon’s primary role is to mobilize those same fuel stores for use by the body.” “As a general rule, when insulin is high, glucagon levels are low.” “… insulin and glucagon play the major roles in determining the anabolic or catabolic state of the body.” “When blood glucose increases … insulin is released to lower blood glucose back to normal. The greatest increase in blood glucose levels (and the greatest increase in insulin) occurs from the consumption of dietary carbohydrates.” “Growth hormone (GH) is another peptide hormone which has numerous effects on the body, both on tissue growth as well as fuel mobilization. GH is released in response to a variety of stressors the most important of which for our purposes are exercise, a decrease in blood glucose … As its name suggests, GH is a growth promoting hormone, increasing protein synthesis in the muscle and liver. GH also tends to mobilize FFA from fat cells for energy.” “High GH levels along with high insulin levels (as would be seen with a protein and carbohydrate containing meal) will raise IGF-1 (insulin like growth factor-1) levels as well as increasing anabolic reactions in the body.” [1] Cliff notes for Iron: exercise causes blood glucose to drop -\> insulin drops -\> glucagon increases -\> GH increases. Glucagon is catabolic, insulin anabolic. GH with glucagon won’t help much. GH with insulin will help much. Follow up weights program with protein and carbohydrate meal/shake soon after. [1] McDonald L., “The Ketogenic Diet: A Complete Guide for the Dieter and Practitioner”, self-published, 1998. ---
**Author:** ![IronFist](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/ironfist/32/16_2.png) [@IronFist](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/IronFist)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 3:24am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/29 "2004-12-08T03:24:46Z")
^ Did you understand that article? I didn’t see any metric in it. 😃 PS. Thanks for the cliffs notes. I wanted to read the whole thing but the eye movement was too much cardio. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 5:03am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/30 "2004-12-08T05:03:37Z")
LOL! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![fa\_jing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ee7513/32.png) [@fa\_jing](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/fa_jing)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 6:34pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/31 "2004-12-08T18:34:17Z")
yeah, but don’t forget that guy in the article only did the 20-rep sets once a week. The original 20-rep DL program calls for continuous reps and more frequent workouts. You’ll have to figure that one out. BTW, for all of you that do the rest-pause style, in the past few months I have switched to the continuous style with controlled descents, little to no bouncing at the bottom and I feel it is benefical - because it teaches you to take advantage of the hamstring stretch reflex. The second rep is usually easier than the first for this reason. ---
**Author:** ![fa\_jing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ee7513/32.png) [@fa\_jing](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/fa_jing)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2004, 6:34pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/32 "2004-12-08T18:34:55Z")
ps I still do low rep sets though. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/33 "2004-12-09T21:47:37Z")
So I did my first workout with the 20 rep Deadlift program I’m adapting. I started with a 20 rep set @ 100 lbs. as I planned, and I’ve gotta say, it was not easy. Round about 12 reps I was breathing like a frieght train. I didn’t need to use the rest/pause protocol yet, but I can easily see that this might be necessary by the time I’m pulling 200 or so. I’m going to increase the resistance by ten pounds and try again on Friday. Thanks for all the input guys, it really helped me figure out how I wanted to do this. ---
**Author:** ![IronFist](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/ironfist/32/16_2.png) [@IronFist](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/IronFist)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2004, 10:13pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/34 "2004-12-09T22:13:10Z")
It will take a week or two but you’ll adapt to the higher reps. I went from doing sets of 5 to sets of 15 and it took a week or two to adapt. Of course by that time I had moved on to sets of 10, but still 🙂 But at any rate, I would bet that when you get into it after a few workouts, doing 140 x 20 will be easier than when you did 100 x 20 (hopefully). ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 1:50am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/35 "2004-12-20T01:50:57Z")
Arrrgghh. 20-rep deadlifts… killing… me… Maybe I’ll switch to two or three sets of ten. I don’t know how long I can continue this. It looks like I went and found the toughest weight training routine in history. Or at least it’s the toughest I’ve ever tried. Anyone have a heart defibrellator? How in the f@ck did you manage 5 sets of 15, Iron? I’ll keep at it as long as I can. I definately think I’ll be seeing some kind of results from this, if the effort involved is any indication. ---
**Author:** ![WinterPalm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a3d4f5/32.png) [@WinterPalm](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/WinterPalm)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 8:09pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/36 "2004-12-20T20:09:17Z")
How many sets of 20 reps are you doing? I only did 20 reps once on the deadlift and it was only 185, my max for singles is 315. However, I used a thick bar, didn’t rest between reps and wasn’t that out of breathe in the end. I don’t understand. Maybe I didn’t have enough weight. However, that said, my squat is pathetic and I’ve recently started a 20 rep squat program. Basically just once a week for 20 reps starting at 130 with an end goal in fifteen weeks of 200. The first workout was fine. Oh yeah, I never squat, the only time I have was a couple summers ago with some friends at the gym. ---
**Author:** ![IronFist](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/ironfist/32/16_2.png) [@IronFist](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/IronFist)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 9:20pm UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/37 "2004-12-20T21:20:47Z")
> Originally posted by Samurai Jack > How in the f@ck did you manage 5 sets of 15, Iron? I’ll keep at it as long as I can. I definately think I’ll be seeing some kind of results from this, if the effort involved is any indication. I’ve done 2 sets of 15 before, but never 5 sets of 15. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 5:47am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/38 "2004-12-21T05:47:50Z")
> Originally posted by IronFist > I went from doing sets of 5 to sets of 15 and it took a week or two to adapt. Lol. I’d read that quote from you about five minutes after finishing a set of twenty with 160lbs. and was so addled I read it “5 sets of 15”. Boy was I tired! Anyway, I hope I can keep this up, 'cause if I make my goal of a 20 rep set with 320lbs. I will be stronger than I’ve ever thought possible. ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 1:20am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/39 "2004-12-22T01:20:28Z")
I can see this is turning into a training BLOG. Anyhow, I just finished my first set of deads for 200 X 20. I jumped up 40 lbs. from my last workout because I knew I could if I used the rest/pause method, and I was getting impatient. Thing is, rest/pausing like the article suggested ends up turning the set into 20 sets of singles, since after awhile, the temptation to rest a little bit longer after every set gets pretty strong. I had the soundtrack to “Conan the Barbarian” blasting and judging from where the track was when my set was over, it took a little over four minutes! I miss PTP. So do you guys think a set of 20 that takes four minutes to complete is too much rest for hypertrophy purposes? ---
**Author:** ![Samurai\_Jack](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex034/user_avatar/forum.kungfumagazine.com/samurai_jack/32/372_2.png) [@Samurai\_Jack](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/u/Samurai_Jack)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 1:22am UTC](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226/40 "2004-12-22T01:22:55Z")
Yikes! I just went back to the bar and realized I pulled 220 X 20, meaning I jumped 60 lbs! Brain damage anyone? No wonder I’m tired. I’ll be big and dumb before you know it. [Previous page](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forum.kungfumagazine.com/t/20-rep-deadlift-program/30226.md?page=3)