Challenging the 85% rule

[sanjuro_ronin]

Originally Posted by Hebrew Hammer

You couldn't fight your way out of a wet paper bag, 60% of the time.

If I was in a wet paper bag, it would have to be a pretty big one and probably big enough to smother me if it was wet, so you are probably right !

[David Jamieson]

applying math and stats to fighting is goofy. lol

it's fighting. you can get good at it if you apply yourself.
who gives a sh1t where it happens?

[MightyB]

The answer is Judo.

[HumbleWCGuy]

I have been in 16 or 17 street confrontations. Only 2 went to the ground.

One was because I felt like it was the easiest way to restrain a kid without hurting him although, I placed some some undue risk on myself with his buddies surrounding us.

The other time was when I I jumped in mount to finish a guy who I was pounding senseless.

I have only had 12% of my fights to to the ground with it being my option. Of course, I am pretty much from the Cobra Kai school of street fighting, "Strike first, strike hard, no mercy sir!"

[HumbleWCGuy]

My casual observations of street fight is that the two parties agree to go to the ground to avoid injuries.

[Hebrew Hammer]

Originally Posted by HumbleWCGuy

My casual observations of street fight is that the two parties agree to go to the ground to avoid injuries.

You mean in like Twister? If I'm taking someone to the ground in a fight it's not to avoid injuries, it's to inflict them and I usually don't ask them nice before I do it.

Care to expand on your casual observation?

[HumbleWCGuy]

Originally Posted by Hebrew Hammer

You mean in like Twister? If I'm taking someone to the ground in a fight it's not to avoid injuries, it's to inflict them and I usually don't ask them nice before I do it.

Care to expand on your casual observation?

Both parties are scared because the have no training so both parties are often happy to go to the ground, a few punches are thrown and a mutual tackle ensues. Technically, one initiates, but the other is happy to ride it to the ground hoping to control the situation when it hits the ground.

They just end up rolling on the ground until someone breaks it up because authorities are coming. It's much easier to strike from a standing position. Mostly guys want to avoid getting hit hard.

You can try to analyze it from a trained perspective, "I do this. I would do that." That's not my opinion of how it works with a couple of untrained guys. Jail is quite a bit different too. Those guys aren't trained, but are seasoned fighters often. Fights don't go to the ground much in jail.


I have never seen a situation where two guys have no grappling training and one initiates a tackle and the other resits it by trying to stay on his feet.

[Aero]

90% of fights may or may not end up on the ground, but 100% of all fights start standing up. Unless you're attacked while you're sleeping in bed or something silly.

XD

[donjitsu2]

Originally Posted by Aero

90% of fights may or may not end up on the ground, but 100% of all fights start standing up. Unless you're attacked while you're sleeping in bed or something silly.

XD

Not true.

As we were laying in bed last night, I told my wife that her sister was looking pretty good ever since she started working out...that was one of the worst fights I've ever been in.

[Raipizo]

Originally Posted by donjitsu2

Not true.

As we were laying in bed last night, I told my wife that her sister was looking pretty good ever since she started working out...that was one of the worst fights I've ever been in.

Did you go to the ground?

[Hebrew Hammer]

I'm pretty sure he went straight for the North/South position, then the full mount.

[Hebrew Hammer]

Originally Posted by HumbleWCGuy

Both parties are scared because the have no training so both parties are often happy to go to the ground, a few punches are thrown and a mutual tackle ensues. Technically, one initiates, but the other is happy to ride it to the ground hoping to control the situation when it hits the ground.

They just end up rolling on the ground until someone breaks it up because authorities are coming. It's much easier to strike from a standing position. Mostly guys want to avoid getting hit hard.

You can try to analyze it from a trained perspective, "I do this. I would do that." That's not my opinion of how it works with a couple of untrained guys. Jail is quite a bit different too. Those guys aren't trained, but are seasoned fighters often. Fights don't go to the ground much in jail.


I have never seen a situation where two guys have no grappling training and one initiates a tackle and the other resits it by trying to stay on his feet.

So you're basing this on incompetence of the fighters involved or that they aren't trying to injure the other guy, it's not through skill? For most drunken brawls I would agree with the premise that if it goes to the ground it's not based on skill but the lack there of. But I doubt they are just agreeing to take it there.

Originally Posted by David Jamieson

applying math and stats to fighting is goofy. lol

it's fighting. you can get good at it if you apply yourself.
who gives a sh1t where it happens?

Actually applying stats to fighting can be an excellent tool for improving results, evaluating tendancies, and preparing yourself. How can knowledge be a bad thing?

[HumbleWCGuy]

Originally Posted by Hebrew Hammer

So you're basing this on incompetence of the fighters involved or that they aren't trying to injure the other guy, it's not through skill? For most drunken brawls I would agree with the premise that if it goes to the ground it's not based on skill but the lack there of. But I doubt they are just agreeing to take it there.

No I am basing it on the idea that people are more scared of getting hurt than they are committed to hurting the other guy. It seems like you have some notion that I am suggesting compassion for the opponent exists in the "go to the ground agreement".

[donjitsu2]

Originally Posted by HumbleWCGuy

No I am basing it on the idea that people are more scared of getting hurt than they are committed to hurting the other guy.

I think this statement may be true for some, but certainly not everyone.

[Kevin73]

Originally Posted by Aero

90% of fights may or may not end up on the ground, but 100% of all fights start standing up. Unless you're attacked while you're sleeping in bed or something silly.

XD

I've come across quite a few working in LE that started while one person was sitting in a chair/barstool.