View Full Version : Chuojiao and Fanziquan
09-08-2000, 09:11 AM
Any of you northern folk know anything about these styles? For instance, are they still taught anywhere as fighting arts or are they just practiced as wushu routines these days? Are they considered more internal or external? What is the training regimen?
Do you think they are *effective* fighting arts?
09-09-2000, 08:43 PM
I went to Beijing once and met an excellent Chuojiao-Fanziquan teacher there. The style he practices is very traditional; that is, he emphasizes on the 'fighting' aspects of the style compared to the 'performing' aspects of the modern wushu version of Fanziquan. (I don't think they've ever created a modern wushu version of Chuojiao.) Anyway, if you've seen the modern wushu version of Tanglangquan, then you know how they exaggerate certain movements from the traditional version.
Chuojiao literally means 'poking the foot.' The Chuojiao-Fanzi teacher I met was certainly very fast and accurate in striking certain points on the lower leg when he demonstrated his kicks on me. Do you know how in some old Western movies where have cowboys shoot at the floor beside some poor fellow's feet to make him tap dance? Well, that's exactly how I felt when this teacher was kicking me. In a way, it's Chuojiao's method of breaking the opponent's 'root.' If you don't have rootedness, then it's difficult to issue power when defending or attacking.
Chuojiao-Fanzi is certainly an effective fighting system. It would most likely be considered an external system, but with internal elements combined. On the other hand, the internal/external classification of martial arts is difficult to define, so most people would probably disagree with me on this. Anyway, this Chuojiao teacher I met, certainly has external/internal qualities in his training and fighting.
BTW, practitioners in China practice Choujiao and Fanziquan as separately or combined depending on their lineage. There seems to have been some mixing between both systems. The teacher I met came from the Chuojiao-Fanziquan lineage and practiced the combined version. Do you know of the 'China's Living Treasures' video series? If you see the 'Open Hands Volume Set,' there is a renown Chuojiao teacher there demonstrating in that video.
My advice if you want to learn this system: Learn Chinese and then go to Beijing.
09-10-2000, 07:50 AM
Thanks for getting back with all that information :-)
Relocating to Beijing will have to remain a wistful dream, I'm afraid. Perhaps some students/teachers will turn up here and there as the popularity of the more eclectic martial arts continues to grow.
Where is the 'China's Living Treasures' series available? Might be worth a look in the meantime.
05-20-2005, 10:21 AM
I am currently learning the style from my instructor in Montréal. He learnt it in China from a Master who learnt it from his uncle etc. The style is definitely straightforward and it is taught to me as a Kung Fu style, not Wushu, even though my instructor also teaches Wushu (in a different course). What we are learning is techniques, a lot of techniques, and a couple forms. I had learnt Kung Fu styles in the past but I don't think I ever learnt something as results-oriented. The movements look simple at first but they are very subtle and it takes a long time to master some apparently quite basic techniques. I would say it is half internal and half external as we are also trained in chikung and some of the mechanics are similar to what one could find in Chen Tai Chi for example. I am french speaking and we translate the name of the style as "Les huit poings éclairs" (I guess you can liberally translate this as "8 fists of Lightning"). As far as I know, "Fanziquan" is the modern name for the style, the ancient names being "Bafanquan" and "Bashanfan". I really like the style. Let me know if you need any more info.
05-20-2005, 03:11 PM
traditional Bashanfan, also known as Wen Tang Fanzi (Civil Route), is definitely a great combative system. In some ways, it's quite similar to Classical Tanglang IMHO. Chuo jiao is sometimes known as Wu Tang Fanzi (Martial Route) which has Ditang (ground skill) as well. I highly recommend them.
05-21-2005, 06:49 AM
Chuojiaomen is my most favoured system. It is a very effective and complete martial system with a unique methdology and power generating methods. From Liuhegen and Jinggangchui basic sets to the series of Wu and Wen tangzi followed by the more advanced sets (including Meihualuodi(Ditan), Bapan etc. Each brings a unique and complementary facet of skill to the arsenal of the practitioner.
Chuojiao and Fanzi have been interlaced late 19th century and is very popular in China at its original place of propagation : Baoding are of Hebei (Including Raoyang County, Li County, Jinning and Gaoyang county). It also has to branches known as the Beijing (taken by Wu binlou orignally from the Wei family lineage of Li County) and Dongbei (From Hao Mingjiu and Hu Fengsan of the Duan Family Lineage in Raoyang County).
Stemming from Wen family boxing in theory, they are considered unique in that are neither internal nor external. The content is really quite beyond any popular system and it is a shame that few practitioners had been exposed to the whole piece. As examples most only would have learnt Wu tangzi, few Wen tangzi and even fewer the advanced components including the dantien rotations and power releasing methods, which at times have a close similarity to the xinyiliuhe methods.
To learn authentic chuojiao I would suggest seeking practitioners from the districts/county above or a practioner with such an deep comprehension of this most traditional and often underestimated martial art.
Wu Chan Long.
05-26-2005, 10:08 AM
"dantien rotations and power releasing methods, which at times have a close similarity to the xinyiliuhe methods"
What is very interesting about this statement, and something no one has done any research about, is that supposedly during the Sung Dynasty, Monk Zhou Tong practiced what amounted to Chuo Jiao/Fantzi and he was Yueh Fei's teacher (and others) and what they eventually passed on was called Yueh Fei Jia Quan.
Eventually, this art reached Henan province, via the decendents of one of Yueh Fei's army officers, and eventually the Dai Long Beng and one of his sons learned this Yueh Fei Jia Quan when he was in Henan where he owned an inn,
and he incoporated the "dantien rotations and power releasing methods, which at times have a close similarity to the xinyiliuhe methods" into his Xin Yi Liu He Quan.
Another thing never researched is that Henan Xin Yi Liu He Quan shares a number of moves in their forms with those also found in Fantzi/Chuo Jiao.
Some of the moves are foundational moves.
05-26-2005, 01:10 PM
...just last night at practice, Master Sun Wenyuan was showing me some Chuo Jiao and Fanzi. I've always loved Chuo Jiao - great sneaky leg work, like in-fighting kicks to your opponent's feet. Chuo Jiao was a foundation style for a Shaolin monk friend of mine, Shi Xinghao, and he's showed me some of the combos. As for Fanzi, Fanzi not only influenced Eagle Claw, but also modern wushu, so there's a flamboyant wushu version of Fanzi, as well as a more traditional 'fighting' version. Good stuff. Great styles. I'd love to see more research come out on both systems.
1'st post, so forgive me if it's moofed up!
Chuojiao is a foot style/method of martial art (traditional wushu). I also know it as Mandarin duck leg.
I did find a link with nice information and even some form/routine images at:
Hope this helps.
vBulletin® v3.8.7, Copyright ©2000-2013, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.