what is the best kung fu movie ever

[doug maverick]

when i say kung fu i mean movie that deal directly with the art of kung fu, meaning old golden harvest/shaw bros. flicks, nothing modern.

to me it has to prodigal son, the fights are amazing the story is just as good, and the ending fight scene d@mn i still haven't seen a fight like that in a kung fu flick

[jethro]

For me it is an easy choice. Legend of a Fighter. My favorite movie Sammo directed is Knockabout. I liked LAm Ching Ying's fights in Prodigal Son but I didn't like the other fights nearly as much. And Shaolin vs Lama is my second favorite movie. Third is Killer Constable.

[doug maverick]

the fight between frankie chan and yuen biao is probably the best fight scene from that era.

[jethro]

For me Frankie Chan vs Lam Ching Ying is 100 times better. I have never seen more perfect movements in a kung fu movie.

[doug maverick]

the best part about the whole thing is that frankie chan didn;t know anything prior to doing this movie, which proves how good of a movie that is and how good sammo is as a choreagrapher.

[jethro]

Well that is pretty amazing. I thought Frankie Chan was good, but Lam Ching Ying completely blew me away. That teahouse fight where he fights Chung Fa, D!ck Wei, and then Frankie Chan is one of my favorite fight scenes. Probably one of my top 10 favorite fight scenes.

[yutyeesam]

My personal favorite is Born Invincible. The teaming up of Carter Wong and Lo Lieh as bad dudes, man, I'm a fan.

Plenty of fight AWESOME scenes, Yuen Wo Ping choreographed, but with old school players and old school sensibilities, and a wicked Bagua diagram drawn into dirt.

Plus that one dude's double broadsword play is pretty righteous!

And after watching it, you can't help but bring your wu sao hand down through your centerline while whistling!

-123

[Jimbo]

Years ago I had read that Frankie Chan had been a Tae Kwon Do stylist, but perhaps that writer was mistaken(?).

For myself, the best MA movie is Shaolin Martial Arts. Directed by Chang Cheh, starring Fu Sheng and Chi Kuan-Chun. M.A. director is Lau Kar-Leung. Also the first movie appearances of Gordon Liu, Wang Lung-Wei, and Liang Jia-Ren (Leung Kar-Yan). Very old-school; in fact, it's the prototype of the long, arduous kung-fu training sequences in movies. It's not as fast-paced as later films like Prodigal Son, etc., but has a classic plot (near-invincible Manchu villains and the Shaolin Disciples who must train to overcome the Manchus' hard qigong and iron body). Yuen Siu-Tin has a role as a master who teaches Fu Sheng the crane (called stork in the film) style. Nothing flashy in the film, just straight-up Shaolin vs. Manchu storyline. This film, and/or the later Invincible Shaolin, inspired Uma Thurman's training sequences and technique in Kill Bill II.

IMO, a vastly underrated film, and not readily available yet in the States. Hopefully, Celestial/Dragon Dynasty will eventually pick it up and release it on DVD.

[doug maverick]

i got the info of frankie chan not knowing martial arts from bey logans book i forgot the name, but it was very informative.

[yutyeesam]

I think this is the book you're talking about:
http://www.amazon.ca/Hongkong-Action-Cinema-Bey-Logan/dp/0879516631

Frankie Chan was known for his musical scoring of movies, I think.

-123

[Su Lin]

I watched Prodigal Son last week and would agree with Jethro,awesome stuff.I am afraid I am going to have to be predictable and say 36th Chamber though.Or Drunken Master.Gaah I can't choose!!!

[doug maverick]

36 chambers bored the hell out of me, i mean the movie is good but its not lau kar leungs or gordon lius for that matter best film, the sequal was worse. maybe i'm saying this because the version i saw was a special extended version of it.

[Su Lin]

I agree about the sequel,it sucked !

[sanjuro_ronin]

Executioners from Shaolin :D

never have so many trees been abused !

[yutyeesam]

36 chambers bored the hell out of me, i mean the movie is good but its not lau kar leungs or gordon lius for that matter best film, the sequal was worse. maybe i'm saying this because the version i saw was a special extended version of it.

On it's own, I totally agree. I think the movie takes too long to build, and the pacing is pretty darn slow.

But, this has been an incredibly influential movie, and the first time I saw it I was so freakin pumped afterwards. I saw it in the early 80's where there were very very few choices of martial arts films to rent from my local video store. And aside from the Bruce Lee movies (which we watched ad nauseum) the ones they had were pure crap, mostly made in America.

So we rent this Master Killer movie, sit through it as we've sat through so many bad MA movies (our tolerance for slow, bad MA movies was up because of this), and then he starts training at the Shaolin Temple. That was the first time we'd seen anything like that before, and of course fell in love with the movie and couldn't stop talking about it in our respective Kung-Fu classes.

Contrast that to today. Good Kung-Fu movies all over the place. You don't even need the movie, you can just catch the highlights of them on youtube. The mindset when watching a martial arts movie today is different today than it was when you didn't have hardly any choices for Hong Kong action films in the early 80's video store era.

But like I said, I agree - whenever I show Master Killer to my students, I pretty much explain the story and zip right up to the Shaolin Temple training! hehe

-123

[doug maverick]

i watched master killer for the first time like five years ago and i had already been exposed to jackie chan sammo hung and donnie yen films for years, also i'd sen other lau kar leung films like challenge of the masters before i watched master killer, so i was a bit dissapointed.

[yutyeesam]

i watched master killer for the first time like five years ago and i had already been exposed to jackie chan sammo hung and donnie yen films for years, also i'd sen other lau kar leung films like challenge of the masters before i watched master killer, so i was a bit dissapointed.

Makes sense.

What do you think about Warriors Two compared to Prodigal Son?

-123

[CLFNole]

I am rather partial to Heros of the East (Shaolin vs. Ninja).

[godzillakungfu]

Makes sense.

What do you think about Warriors Two compared to Prodigal Son?

-123

So, many great movies.

I hated 36th Chamber because of the pacing. Then I watched again after being in Martial Arts for awhile and it was a much better movie.

I saw Legend of A Fighter for the first time about 2 years ago. One of the few that actually lived up to the hype.

You know the star has no real MA training right?

It is hard to choose between the two. They both have great stories IMO. Prodigal has a better representation of WC. Warriors Two is just ridiculous fun.

[doug maverick]

i liked prodigal son better, as you get to see lueng chan become the person he was is in warriors two.

[jethro]

I wasn't bored for a second during 36th Chamber. Gordon Liu becoming a man is amazingly done. The way he defeats the senior monk is brilliant. It is not your average kung fu movie. The first half of the movie is spent at the temple training and they spend a lot of time on those scenes. In terms of choreography it isn't Lau Kar Leung's best, but as a movie it is a kung fu masterpiece. I actually like the sequel better. Some great comedy and the end fight is one of the best ever. Part 3 (Disciples of the 36th Chamber) is not as good as the first 2 but still worth checking out because of the comedy and a great final fight.

[doug maverick]

come ion jethro are you kiddding me serious that filmed sucked!!!!!put down the weed man put down the weed!!!j/k:D

[jethro]

What all 3 of them sucked? You need to be the weed down while you watch the movies:p

[RAYNYSC]

Here are a few off the top of my head some have already been mentioned some haven't .
18 Legendary wepons of Kung Fu
Mystory of chess boxing
Tiger over the wall
7 grand masters
Legend of a fighter
Fighter in the wind
Shaolin vs Lama
Prodigal son
Warrior's two
Mantis fist fighter
Mad monkey kung fu
Snake in the monkeys shadow

There are lot more that I know of & have just can't remember all of the name's off the top of my head at point & time.

[doug maverick]

while this was a good movie without a shadow of a doubt it was a poor poor representation of the life of mas oyama. and total fiction and i think oyama would've been ****ed by the air force scene

[RAYNYSC]

"while this was a good movie without a shadow of a doubt it was a poor poor representation of the life of mas oyama. and total fiction and i think oyama would've been ****ed by the air force scene."

So am I to believe what you're saying about all of the other representation's of the movie's mentioned are a 100% accurate!... ( As that's what it sounds like )Give me a brake it's a movie you know entertainment therefore there are going to be exaggeration's made no matter how fictional they may seem.
Let me put it to you like this I'm sure you've seen the movie The Dragon ( The Bruce Lee Story) That would be like you telling me that everthing in that movie was true I don't think so & this is a movie about one of if not the most influential martial artistest of the 20th century. Nothing could be further from the truth. The question at hand is do you argee?

[Jimbo]

As for 36th Chamber, how a KF movie fan views it has a lot to do with when you saw it first. I first saw it a year after it was made, so at that time it was pretty surprising. Gordon Liu did a great job acting; at that time and even up to present day, very few KF stars could act from a bumbling neophyte evolving into a master so convincingly. He also had good body language/facial expressions to where you knew how his character felt or was thinking. I was actually more impressed with the storyline and acting than I was with the choreography.

The one thing that always puzzled me from the first time I saw it, though, was the training scene with the reflecting mirrors on the wooden dummies. It happens before Gordon Liu/San Te learns "boxing," yet he's striking/kicking the dummies like he was already kung fu-trained.

A lot of the best-made classic KF movies of the '70s would not be popular at all today, because most people nowadays have grown up in a more rushed society. Martial arts-type movies that once took the time to tell a story and build up gradually to a conclusion can rarely hold people's attention anymore. They lacked the quick-cut editing, fast-paced storylines, more frequent action, and computer effects of the last couple decades. Things come faster now, but do not hold the attention to the same degree, and are also more quickly forgotten than in decades past.

Even after seeing so many really good KF films, my favorites are still the mid-'70s Chang Cheh Shaolin series of films. I suppose they made such a memorable impression for me that the later films cannot quite surpass them.

BTW: Yes, Leung Kar-Yan was never a formally-trained martial artist. I think he was probably the most naturally talented non-martial artist to play these kinds of roles. Also, some others who by their own admission aren't real martial artists: David Chiang, Hui Ying-Hung, Lo Lieh.

[doug maverick]

So am I to believe what you're saying about all of the other representation's of the movie's mentioned are a 100% accurate!... ( As that's what it sounds like )Give me a brake it's a movie you know entertainment therefore there are going to be exaggeration's made no matter how fictional they may seem.
Let me put it to you like this I'm sure you've seen the movie The Dragon ( The Bruce Lee Story) That would be like you telling me that everthing in that movie was true I don't think so & this is a movie about one of if not the most influential martial artistest of the 20th century. Nothing could be further from the truth. The question at hand is do you argee?

even thou dragon the bruce lee story was exagerated it was still fact based. fighter in the wind was way off th mark, but thats beside the point as it was still a great film and i've watched it quite few times.

[yutyeesam]

As for 36th Chamber, how a KF movie fan views it has a lot to do with when you saw it first. I first saw it a year after it was made, so at that time it was pretty surprising. Gordon Liu did a great job acting; at that time and even up to present day, very few KF stars could act from a bumbling neophyte evolving into a master so convincingly. He also had good body language/facial expressions to where you knew how his character felt or was thinking. I was actually more impressed with the storyline and acting than I was with the choreography.

Really well put, Jimbo. It's all about context of the times. And I definitely agree that Gordon Liu did a great acting job. You don't see that kind of acting talent these days.


The one thing that always puzzled me from the first time I saw it, though, was the training scene with the reflecting mirrors on the wooden dummies. It happens before Gordon Liu/San Te learns "boxing," yet he's striking/kicking the dummies like he was already kung fu-trained.

Haha! Yeah that's one my friends and I were always like, wait a second! But I guess you just have to suspend your disbelief.


A lot of the best-made classic KF movies of the '70s would not be popular at all today, because most people nowadays have grown up in a more rushed society. Martial arts-type movies that once took the time to tell a story and build up gradually to a conclusion can rarely hold people's attention anymore. They lacked the quick-cut editing, fast-paced storylines, more frequent action, and computer effects of the last couple decades. Things come faster now, but do not hold the attention to the same degree, and are also more quickly forgotten than in decades past.

Good analysis. I agree. Although, to the Wu Tang Clan's credit, they did make the whole smokin weed while watching old school Kung-Fu movies and integrating it into hip hop culture enough of a fad to reissue some old classics that got some pretty nice distribution.



BTW: Yes, Leung Kar-Yan was never a formally-trained martial artist. I think he was probably the most naturally talented non-martial artist to play these kinds of roles. Also, some others who by their own admission aren't real martial artists: David Chiang, Hui Ying-Hung, Lo Lieh.

You know, I've heard this for years, and have come to this conclusion:
They say they aren't but really, the amount of work they have to put into practicing and executing the choreography with the amount of films they've done, they have practiced and performed martial arts for more hours than an average American black belt, who might go to class 2-3 days/week for 2-4 years.

So I don't totally buy this thing they keep saying that they aren't real martial artists. They've put in a lot of work and time w/martial arts, perhaps more than some real martial artists. But what I will give props to is their ability to pick stuff up without a real foundation. That's impressive, for sure.

Oh yeah, and Chang Cheh films are unreplaceable in my book.

-123

[Jimbo]

yutyeesam:
I really agree with you about the stars who claim they weren't formally trained probably being better-trained than a lot of martial artists. Maybe they meant not trained as in the normally expected manner as in many traditional KF schools. But that can't take away that at least they could make the moves, many very difficult ones, in a format where it's not as easy as it seems to look good or convincing. And they really took their lumps, bruises, and sometimes worse. Even if only for perfromance, they had to develop timing, spatial awareness, toughness, and quick reactions. Now that they are retired (unfortunately, Lo Lieh is deceased), they probably do not practice anymore, but then, I've known lots of people who really trained for years in actual kung fu, started gaining a fairly high level of skill, then their priorities changed or interest waned and they quit training cold turkey.

[banditshaw]

The Best Kung Fu Movie Ever Made is LEGENDARY WEAPONS OF KUNG FU.
HANDS DOWN.
Second would be Ninja Hunter with Alexander Lou as Abbot White.:D
I love all the Shaws Classics, Chang Cheh To Lau Kar Leung.

Anyone see Human Skin Lanterns?? Kung Fu Horror at it's finest.:eek:

My favorite might be Eight Diagram Pole Fighter sheerly for it's raw emotion...and knowing that it was during the filming the Late Great Alexander Fu Sheng passed away.

RIP to a True Legend.

[doug maverick]

i loved legendary weapons, but there was a movie that outshined that in terms of weapons fight and that was odd couple with sammo hung and lau kar leungs brother(forgeting his name) that movie was awesome it combined opera (chinese opera)techniques with kung fu it looked amazing

[yutyeesam]

Lau Kar Wing. That dude is baaaad! In the Odd Couple, I think he's credit as Bruce Lau! :D

[banditshaw]

Yeah the odd couple was hokey but the weapons fighting is top notch....agreed.

[doug maverick]

just thought of another one secret of taichi, i think this was the first movie to accurately use and show chen style tai chi, and it showcases a number of masters. and the fights are first rate

[Jimbo]

I thought Secret of Tai Chi was definitely one of the better mainland KF films; also, I liked Undaunted Wudang and South Shaolin Master as good examples as well. My favorite part of Secret of Tai Chi was a small part when a turncoat bad guy was displaying the characteristics of Chen Tai Chi to the villains who wanted to kill practitioners.

Two of my other top favorite KF films are Disciples of Shaolin and Men From the Monastery. Both starring Fu Sheng and Chi Kuan-Chun. Disciples was more story-oriented than fight-oriented, and Fu Sheng really showed great acting ability in this one. You actually begin to care a lot for his character, which doesn't always happen with martial arts films.
*spoiler alert!*
When I saw Disciples of Shaolin it was at an inner-city grindhouse full of the rough crowd. When Fu Sheng's character dies in the film, his character's painful and convincing death scene had the entire theater dead silent. Maybe it was just that one showing, I don't know; but I've never seen that happen before or since then in a KF movie. Fu Sheng really had charisma, which this film showcased.

[jethro]

Other than the beginning, I only saw flashes of Tai Chi in Secret of Tai Chi. But, it is a good movie with non stop fights.

And Banditshaw, JAck Long plays abbotwhite in Ninja Hunter. Same guy from 7 Grandmasters and Ninja Checkmate. Alexander Lou was the star of Shaolin vs LAma and did some Ninja movies like Super Ninja and Ninja in the USA. Alexander Lou plays the hero in Ninja Hunter alongside another guy.

And if you want to see Lau Kar wing at his best, then check out Shaolin Mantis and Knockabout. The pipe snake fist is one of the coolest things I have ever seen.

[banditshaw]

Other than the beginning, I only saw flashes of Tai Chi in Secret of Tai Chi. But, it is a good movie with non stop fights.

And Banditshaw, JAck Long plays abbotwhite in Ninja Hunter. Same guy from 7 Grandmasters and Ninja Checkmate. Alexander Lou was the star of Shaolin vs LAma and did some Ninja movies like Super Ninja and Ninja in the USA. Alexander Lou plays the hero in Ninja Hunter alongside another guy.

And if you want to see Lau Kar wing at his best, then check out Shaolin Mantis and Knockabout. The pipe snake fist is one of the coolest things I have ever seen.


You are absolutely correct. I always get those guys names mixed up. Ninja Hunter is ......shall i say, special kind of kung fu movie.

Knockabout is great as is Shaolin Mantis.

One film I saw recently that I hadn't seen in a while is Kung Fu instructor with Ti Lung. Good staff work By Ti Lung in that.

[jethro]

I have to see Kung Fu Intstructor, and the sequel. Ti Lung is one of my favorites. And check out this Alexander Lou Rei clip. This guy only got better as his career went on. http://youtube.com/watch?v=ER0f-8KVPdE

[NJM]

The Chinese Connection. Sure, the acting was bad, but the message was powerful. And, of course, Bruce Lee's fight scenes.

[godzillakungfu]

7 Grandmasters is great.

If you want to see a really good Tai Chi Movie with actual Tai Chi principles get a movie called The Shadow Boxer.

It is a Shaw Brothers Movie.

[Jimbo]

An interesting note about The Shadow Boxer:
The guy who was the star of that film had previously won the Southeast Asian Kung Fu full-contact championship the year before the film was made (1972). I forget the star's name. But he died shortly after making the film due to the punishment he took during filming. He supposedly claimed to have "iron body" qigong. There is a scene where a bad guy jumps off a 2nd(?) or 3rd story railing and lands feet-first on the star's abdomen. That movie is possibly the only known kung fu "snuff film".

[godzillakungfu]

No he committed suicide.

[doug maverick]

i just watched what is the greatest kung fu movie of all time. Five Deadly venoms. great story and even better kung fu

[jethro]

I prefer Crippled Avengers and Shaolin Rescuers. The chemistry between the characters is a lot better. I still love 5 Venoms though. One of the greatest openings ever.

[doug maverick]

those filsm don;t even touch venoms with a twenty foot long kwan dao. the story of the venoms was so rich and complex and it wasn't like alot of the kung fu films that were out back then

[jethro]

Maybe it was just overhyped but 5 Venoms didn't do much for me. Probably my 6th or 7th favorite Venoms movie. I didn't think the story was rich at all. Could have been a good story, but Chang Cheh was in decline. He was much better with the simpler stories late in his career.

[godzillakungfu]

Maybe it was just overhyped but 5 Venoms didn't do much for me. Probably my 6th or 7th favorite Venoms movie. I didn't think the story was rich at all. Could have been a good story, but Chang Cheh was in decline. He was much better with the simpler stories late in his career.

Yeah, It was fun but to me there are way better venom mob movies.

[Jimbo]

My favorite of the Venoms movies is The Magnificent Ruffians.

Another fun but hard to find KF film is The Treasure Hunters, starring Fu Sheng, his younger brother Chang Chan-Peng, Wang Lung-Wei and Yang Tsing-Tsing. One of Wang's better villain roles. This film is not to be confused with another later HK film with a similar title that came out in the late '80s, more of a crime(?) film.

The Kid from Kwangtung. My favorite Hwang Jang-Lee performance.

[bawang]

Kung Fu Vs Yoga.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=FrYlNNy929Y

[banditshaw]

Also the all time cult classic.

MASTER OF THE FLYING GUILLOTINE



Ol' Jimmy Wang Yu.

Great music and unbelievable violence.

I love that movie.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmdP1qTjGZY

[bawang]

rare movies you never heard of, but is very good

water margin tv show on cctv
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7GEAm8DCxY

yellow river fighter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXL9_8vlJbk

sino dutch war, this is a very emotional scene
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5BUXUiBeeI

[jethro]

Yeah Yellow River Fighter is a classic. The bearded guy from Jet LI's Shaolin Temple movies is an AMAZING actor, and his sword skills are probably the best I have ever seen for an actor. And this one guy used a 3-section staff with a spear on one end and a ball and chain on the other. I saw this movie a long time ago and I still remember that badass weapon.

[doug maverick]

wants i say this movie jethro is going to say "that movi was okay i liked bl blah blah" but f uck it i don't care. three evil masters is the jump off you got one of the best training scene's you got great fight scene's, and a great story put togather 3 evil masters deff. goes into the top ten

[jethro]

3 Evil Master is freaking awesome. A rare Yuen Tak showcase. Lau Hok Nin has a good role, Chen Kaun Tai is the man, the relationship between Kuan Tai and Yuen Tak is good, and Wang Lung Wei is a madman with a spear. One of my top 15 favorite Shaw movies for sure. I love that scene in the brothel. I could go on about this movie all day:)

[CLFNole]

Three Evil Masters is good but Yuen Tak is a bit annoying.

[jethro]

i agree, just a little annoying. He does do well in that scene in the brothel. I was dying when he was trying to convince people he had boobs.

[banditshaw]

You guys can't forget about ''Legend of a fighter''. That is also a really good Yuen Wo Ping film.

[jethro]

Don't worry, I could never forget that incredible movie. That is why I listed it as my fav:D

[doug maverick]

yea i liked this film as well when i first saw it i was like this movie isgreat. it has a star who doesn't look like a star who just looks like a regualr person. and u can relate to him. even thou i did like fearless better only ecause of the acting and camera work. face it ronnie yu is a master director. too bad he couldn't direct blood the last vampire i would've loved to see his interpretation of that film

[jethro]

I agree Yuen Chat Yor is really good in Legend of a Fighter. His relationship with Yusuaki Kurata is very well done. And I love the kids fight!

[doug maverick]

this was the darkest kung fu film i'd ever seen ringo lam really made a great film and the tigervs crane fights and the big ass sword and flying moon weapon were awesome. i was around 13 when i first saw this film and about a week later i bought a bagua dao just so i could have a big ass sword like that. i still have it actually

[jethro]

Is that the Fong Sai Yuk movie? I will have to see that.

If you are looking for dark, then check out Killer Constable and Secret Service of the Imperial Court. Shaw Brothers made some really dark stuff. Also check out Iron Dragon Strikes Back. Bruce Li's best.

[doug maverick]

i've sen all those films not as dark as burning paradise not even in the same league

[jethro]

Well I will have to see that to believe it. I thought I was going to have a heart attack when Beardy almost killed his son in Secret Service. And the final shot of Killer Constable where the girl is standing out in the rain brought a tear to my eye.

[Jimbo]

A very dark, old Shaw Bros film is What Price Honesty. I seem to remember it starred Danny Lee, Sun Chien, and (?). It was pretty depressing, esp. the part where one character's wife visits him in jail, and she's later graphically hanged by the bad lawmen.

[Laukarbo]

challenge of the masters

this one has the best master and disciple relationship scene..
and an outstanding trainings sequence..speacially for hung practicioners


the lady is the boss

at times corny but there are those moments..specially Lau Sigung is not even acting..hes just himself


martial club

the endfight...


36th chamber of shaolin

blueprint of a kung fu movie

[doug maverick]

those are some good films. we tlked heavily about 36 chambers already.challenge of the masters is awesome, martial club again is also awesome.