OT but need to rant, please forgive me

[lkfmdc]

I got dragged into something today that reminded me of the "old days" in China town and right now I"m frustrated and feeling sick to my stomach.... I really don't like having to feel this way... I'm so much more happeir being a coach with combat athletes rather than an old school kung fu person, which all too often equates to being a pack of thugs. It's a side I don't feel comfortable about when I go into it.... yet it seems so integral to what that was about, all the old guys who could fight, the first adjective was "tough" rather than skilled, not that they didn't have skill, but so much of why they were great fighters was that intangible of being a rough person... would rather be less of a fighter and a better person... wow, really rattled

[joedoe]

I kinda know how you feel. I am currently entrenched in the middle of a family feud, trying to hold everything together with little success. I just wish people would grow up.

Care to tell us more about what happened?

[Green Cloud]

HUUU what you guys talking about, can some one fill me in??? Dave are you refering to the old guy debates??

[Watchman]

Joe,

Do you have a direct stake in the issue your family is feuding over? Did you step into the mediator role because of circumstancial pressures, or are you just the noble type? How long has the feud being going on?

Ross,

Sounds like you've got some old fashioned tribalism going on. Never, ever a good thing.

[GunnedDownAtrocity]

what happened man?

[joedoe]

Joe,

Do you have a direct stake in the issue your family is feuding over? Did you step into the mediator role because of circumstancial pressures, or are you just the noble type? How long has the feud being going on?

Ross,

Sounds like you've got some old fashioned tribalism going on. Never, ever a good thing.

I am kinda stuck in the middle because my sister in law accused my wife of something, and my sister decided to also get in on the act as well. I am just trying to get things sorted out so that the family can be at peace again. Otherwise I would just stay out of it. (I am certainly not the noble type :)).

Has only been going for about a month.

[Watchman]

Ah, so you do have a stake in it. Your role in the mess is difficult because your sis-in-law automatically sees you as being on your wife's side against her. I assume your sis is maneuvering for your wife as well?

Your sis-in-law is going to be more resistant because she sees the conflict as a 3-on-1 full court press against her.

Also, whether what she accused your wife of is true, or is a completely made up fabrication (or somewhere between those two), is irrelevant to her at this point. You can't defuse her with logic. Now that she's accused your wife of what she's accused her of, and caught the backlash from your wife and your sister, you sis-in-law's only tactic now is to fight to defend herself.

The longer this goes on this way, the more entrenched the conflict is going to be, and the harder it is going to be to resolve.

Is there a member of your family that both your wife and your sis-in-law would see as mostly "neutral"? If so, see if you can arrange a sit-down between your wife, your sis-in-law and that person.

The best approach with a sit-down like that is for your wife to go in NOT trying to prove her point, or trying to prove your sis-in-law wrong. The best approach is for her to go in, and in a very frank manner explain to your sis-in-law how the accusation made her feel (hurt her), and how it has negatively affected their relationship.

Taking that approach will (hopefully) de-escalate your sis-in-law's fight or flight adrenal state resistance. If she gets reframed from trying to defend her position into a realization of how bad the conflict itself is negatively affecting the rest of the family, she will be a little more rational and easier to work with.

Also, don't expect the initial sit-down to resolve everything. The first mediated contact is just to take the combatants out of their stress response and able to start a dialogue.

[chud]

lkfmdc: did you have to play the role of enforcer?

[joedoe]

Ah, so you do have a stake in it. Your role in the mess is difficult because your sis-in-law automatically sees you as being on your wife's side against her. I assume your sis is maneuvering for your wife as well?

Your sis-in-law is going to be more resistant because she sees the conflict as a 3-on-1 full court press against her.

Also, whether what she accused your wife of is true, or is a completely made up fabrication (or somewhere between those two), is irrelevant to her at this point. You can't defuse her with logic. Now that she's accused your wife of what she's accused her of, and caught the backlash from your wife and your sister, you sis-in-law's only tactic now is to fight to defend herself.

The longer this goes on this way, the more entrenched the conflict is going to be, and the harder it is going to be to resolve.

Is there a member of your family that both your wife and your sis-in-law would see as mostly "neutral"? If so, see if you can arrange a sit-down between your wife, your sis-in-law and that person.

The best approach with a sit-down like that is for your wife to go in NOT trying to prove her point, or trying to prove your sis-in-law wrong. The best approach is for her to go in, and in a very frank manner explain to your sis-in-law how the accusation made her feel (hurt her), and how it has negatively affected their relationship.

Taking that approach will (hopefully) de-escalate your sis-in-law's fight or flight adrenal state resistance. If she gets reframed from trying to defend her position into a realization of how bad the conflict itself is negatively affecting the rest of the family, she will be a little more rational and easier to work with.

Also, don't expect the initial sit-down to resolve everything. The first mediated contact is just to take the combatants out of their stress response and able to start a dialogue.

Actually, my sister took the side of my sister in law. To be honest, I think it is a case of people feeling threatened and lashing out.

And yes, I do have a vested interest I guess, but I am still trying to be the voice of reason. No one else in the family wants to get involved, so I am resigning myself to long term hostilities.

However, I will take what you have said on board and see if there is a way to try and make it happen. Thanks for taking the time to try and help :)

[Watchman]

Actually, my sister took the side of my sister in law. To be honest, I think it is a case of people feeling threatened and lashing out.

And yes, I do have a vested interest I guess, but I am still trying to be the voice of reason. No one else in the family wants to get involved, so I am resigning myself to long term hostilities.

However, I will take what you have said on board and see if there is a way to try and make it happen. Thanks for taking the time to try and help :)

OK, that means the battle lines are pretty evenly drawn then. It's a two-on-two engagement, with one person (you) trying to establish themselves as the peacemaker.

With this being the case, and you mentioning that no one else in the family wanting to get involved, scrap the plan to get a "neutral" involved to mediate.

Still see if you can arrange a sit-down, but do it with all four of you together. Since you've already been tring to be the one to lessen the conflict, you be the one to make the calls. Ask your sis and sis-in-law if they'll meet with you and your wife in a "neutral" venue. Tell them you don't want to try and prove a point, but just to talk between all four of you about what the effects of the dispute itself is having on the family, and how you all might lessen the damage.

See if all four of you can answer the following questions: What do we really want here? How can we lessen the hostility and be civil to each other at family functions?

With this approach you start to reframe people away from trying to be right in the present, and toward a longer-term view.

This model works really well in child welfare court mediations. The main aim is to let the air out of the adrenal state, irrational emotional bubble and to get people to rationalize their approach to the conflict at hand.

Fun stuff.

[lkfmdc]

while this thread appears no longer to be about me, I was indeed asked to "strong arm" someone, not that they didn't deserve it mind you, but it was a bad experience.... I'm still not fully comfortable again

[Wong Ying Home]

The Greatest power is that of a compasionate loving heart, that know's no boundary

Too many people think that their power is in their fist, so short sighted and will eventually only lead to sadness and regret

I'm with you here llkfmdc, sounds like you are moving upwards away from the dark heart that poisons the soul, hence your regret and posible guilt at having to strongarm a person.

It is the beter person who moves away from thuggery

[hskwarrior]

but i like the thuggery.

if a ninja owed me some money and i saw him flaunting some money when he owes me some........boy you bet i will strong arm a mutha effer in a heart beat and take my money back then make him take me out to lunch for doing some stupid shet.

man i thought you knew;)

[joedoe]

lkfmdc : sorry to hijack your thread, and sorry to hear you were touched by that kind of ugliness. It is one of the few things about training kung fu that I dread - the day someone approaches me with something similar.

Watchman: again, thanks for taking the time to help out. The idea of talking about the long term aspects makes a lot of sense to me, and I will give it a go. The tempers are still too hot to try that yet, but I will keep it in mind.

[chud]

while this thread appears no longer to be about me, I was indeed asked to "strong arm" someone, not that they didn't deserve it mind you, but it was a bad experience.... I'm still not fully comfortable again

That's what I figured. Well, you're a good man to feel some regret even if, as you said, the guy deserved it.

[Wong Ying Home]

yeah but you didnt say ninja before...that changes the ball game totally...gloves off for that indeed ;)

[Ou Ji]

Hmmm, what's the job pay? :D

[mickey]

Greetings,

Try reading between the lines. I think Ross did the deed. That is why he is so down. C'mon now. It's not like you did p0rn and had to swallow.


mickey

[Ou Ji]

Nah, I don't think so. I think he's upset because his associates wanted to drag him into that stuff, or assumed he would be willing.

I turned down the last request I got like that because I'm getting too old for that crap. Too old to risk doing time now.

[mickey]

He did it.


mickey