Buddhism and Kung Fu

[Kairo]

Do practitioners of both these disciplines exist here?

If so, could you please tell me what you think about the relative benefits they offer each other, or point me to somewhere that may explain this?

Thank you.

[David Jamieson]

I wouldn't consider myself a buddhist, but there are likely a few kungfu practitionbers who are also buddhist.

what are the benefits of one to another?

well, the entire buddhisms sobering yin to martial arts rampaging yang thang is certainly worth noting. But I wouldn't say that buddhism is the only thing that brings sobriety to the warrior mind.

However, there is Ch'an practice in and of itself which is a buddhistic practice.

The practice of Ch'an or zen as an action augments martial practice in many ways. It instills mindfulness for one thing, increases awareness, aids in posture and breath and of course brings about a state of mind that is referred to as "no mind" which is without doubt key to "doing".

"Doing" is a large part if not all of martial practice. To be able to singularly focus on the task at hand is essential to success.

Buddhism's Chan practice facilitates this.

As for the religiosity of it, I am uncertain. Perhaps there are morality lessons, or rather of course there are morality lessons that would temper the intellectually undeveloped mind that is combined with a physically skilled body.

Buddhism teaches compassion. Compassion will impede violent action in an individual, but reason will allow the use of violence. As in the buddhist lesson of using Kungfu to destroy evil.

All too often, evil is manifested in human form and action as well. So, this is when the mass congeals and both interplay with each (ma and buddhism).

Consider that Shaolin Temple, the veritable cradle of Kungfu was first a buddhist temple and later was inclusive of the martial arts. The temple was pretty much in a position where harmony was required between the two. From this came highly ritualized forms of martiality that contained within it actual working sets of techniques that could be used for defense.

I am certain that offensive, first strike type attacks came much much later and possibly there has been misinterpretation of the intent behind some things, but that's another story of balance.

anyway, there are myriad resources. There is no singular laser focused answer to your question really. But you can likely find a distilled statement that will hit home somewhere.

:)

[GenKwan]

Kairo,

I recommend checking out the following book:

Shaolin Book (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0975500902/ref=ase_orderofshaolc-20/104-8131335-4067140?v=glance&s=books)

I found it helpful. It has good information in regards to your question in addition to many other topics.

Like Kung Lek said, this may be difficult to answer here.

I hope this is helpful.

Regards,

Gen Kwan

[canglong]

Kairo,
Here are some links that might be of interest to you.


Shaolin Ch'an Buddhism Kung Fu (http://home.vtmuseum.org/articles/meng/3treasures.php)

Shaolin Ch'an Buddhism Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun Kuen (http://www.hungfakwoon.com/faq1.htm)

Hung Fa Yi Homepage (http://www.hungfakwoon.com/)

[Kairo]

Thank you all very much for your contribution - it has all been of great help!

I ask as my former teacher once said something to me that I never understood until I attended a Buddhist Temple, and I wondered whether I was being taught by a Buddhist or whether Kung Fu taught aspects of Buddhism.

[David Jamieson]

lol.

are you a man dreaming he is a butterfly? or a butterfly dreaming he is a man?

:)

[GeneChing]

The original question is coming from an odd angle, and I can't describe what bothers me about it exactly, which is why I've been avoiding it. Practice is practice. If you are only in the moment of the goal - the relative benefit, if you will - you'll fail to be in the moment. And being in the moment is what both Buddhism and kung fu are all about. Therefore, they can be very parallel journeys.

KL: Buddhism is neither yin nor yang. Only your mind is making that distinction.

GK & cl: ****, you guys beat me to the plugs. Strangely, I can't think of anything to plug here, accept maybe my own personal take on it, which I've been documenting in my Shaolin Trips columns. You can see them easily via our new e-zine archive index by author (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/TOC/index.php).

[Vajramusti]

Gene is on target.

Buddhism and some martial arts are parallel journeys.

One can go one one without going on the other.

But a traveller on one path can find journeying on the other- a little easier.

[David Jamieson]

KL: Buddhism is neither yin nor yang. Only your mind is making that distinction.

:p

yes.... yes it is. lol

[David Jamieson]

my mind that is.

[canglong]

GK & cl: ****, you guys beat me to the plugs. Evidence that some of us have really been paying attention ;)

[BebopBelt]

I am Buddhist and I just started studying Northern Shaolin Praying Mantis in August. I am a yellow sash but here are my opinions.

As a Buddhist I love Kung Fu because it helps me concentrate and be strong. When I go to my kwoon I feel at peace there, it's a great atmosphere very positive and I am learning strength mentally and physically. The philosophy that because of your training you should never have to use it I really admire because it flows into the Buddhist's values of a high appriecation of living beings.

The goal I guess you could say in Buddhism is Enlightenment and just like meditation trains your mind to stay in the moment I think that Kung Fu and Wu Shu in general produces the same effect. When I focus at Kung Fu sometimes like in meditation when I first come to practice I notice that my mind is all tangled, I am worried about my day and have trouble kicking etc, but when Sifu really pushes us we start working on kicks or new forms it requires all of my concentration and my mind is soon focused. By time I leave I feel energized, at peace, happy and confident. It's a great feeling. Even on my yellow belt test (which to some of you higher belt may seem now as you look back on it very very easy I'm sure) I was nervous to preform my test and forms infront of the spectators there and the higher belts grading us. I was in speeching for two years and have won awards I have no problem getting up infront of people and preforming verbally but for this I was nervous. So nervous I forgot the first basic form I learned. But once I got up there and started kicking and sweating my mind soon clicked into place and I while I was aware of the spectators I was still able to focus like they weren't. It's a really great effect that develops confidence and helps you train your mind. You gain insight into your emotions which helps you control them.

In Buddhism when you meditate it's developing mental strength to stay in the present to accept your emotions but be able to control them and use them for positive things. As well you should take care of your body and try to produce good karma. The result of the things that you do should be accomplished with the goal to minimize suffering etc. I've had alot of health problems in my past, stomach ulcers because of stress, anxiety and because of certain medications I was put on when I was to young to take them my immune system does not work very well. One nurse even suggested I may have to have my stomach removed. During that time I was in the ER twice that year for dehydration. I suffered alot. As a Buddhist sometimes it is very difficult to sit down and just focus on where I am. My mind is constantly going a mile a minute. I often find myself chanting mantras for awhile just so I can get my head where it needs to be. But I always feel much better when I'm done. I get this same peaceful feeling after Kung Fu because I am able and of course have to focus on exactly what I'm doing to get it done right. As well I see that my health has really increased, I'm losing weight, muscles having strengthed. I got sick just a week or so ago but I was actually able to get over it within about a week without having to go to the doctor. Usually when I get sick I am in the doctor within that time period because I get worse and worse but this time I was able to get over it. I think that is just another sign that my body is physically getting stronger. This has helped decrease my suffering in general and be able to work better in my personal life and at my job.

Thich Nhat Hahn addresses this somewhat I think in his book Anger because he talks about mindful consumption. By consuming the studies of things like Kung Fu that help make us strong and healthy, that helps allievate are suffering we can be an ascet to others in our lives and to ourselves. I think that its one of those things that just helps us get closer to enlightenment because as I keep saying it (to me) is a form of meditation. In Kung Fu we focus alot on breathing. Deep breathing excercises, sanchi, breathing out as we punch, breathing as we preform and even during stretching, I remember in Hatha Yoga we did similiar things when focusing on meditations. As well I remember reading and listening to tapes by meditation teacher Pema Chordron where she talked about breathing, how you breath during meditation is very important and Kung Fu makes this link as well. Breath is the life of the body and this really applys to Buddhism and Kung Fu.


Well that's all I can think of for the most part. I know I kind of talked in circles. I guess if you didn't feel like reading all that basically my point is meditation as Buddhist (let me specify I mostly study Zen (Cha'an) Buddhism but a little bit of all different types) but meditation is a link to enlightenment and I think Kung Fu in many ways produces the same effect.

[l@zylee]

Well I consider myself Buddhist and I practice Kung Fu, the Buddhist meditation practise helps my Kung Fu concentration for example, and my Kung Fu keeps me fit and healthy which is great for maintaining a healthy mind, also the lessons I learn from Buddhist teachings help me keep feelings such as anger and jealousy at bay which in turn stop me from flying off in a rage and hurting myself or someone else, like a couple of nights ago a gang of youths walk passed me and my wife and slapped her ass and called me various names, there was a time when I would of made the foolish mistake of retaliating despite being completley outnumbered, I actually took a deep breath and let them pass, this I believe I get from practising Buddhism, the feeling of anger arose I noted it and let it pass and die and we all lived happily ever after Amen.

Lee

[GeneChing]

Did you hear about Cambodia banning a pop song because it misrepresented Buddhist monks (http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/wire/sns-ap-music-buddhist-love-song,0,7625607.story?coll=sns-ap-world-headlines)?

[HearWa]

I am currently in the process of reading "Barefoot Zen." It's interesting in the fashion that the author has written it from the viewpoint that the Shaolin martial arts were not in fact made solely for self defense reasons, but in fact for spiritual development via Zen.

He seems to be very unbiased in his opinions since he has mentioned that Thai boxing and such is currently a more practical method to self defense given the history of the fights between that and Kung Fu.

He also claims the concept of the Shaolin fighting monks as contradictory with their Buddhist roots, and most of that is due mostly to romanticised myth. Quite ironically, he still practices Karate (he believes that most Karate and contemporary versions of Kung Fu style derived from the Shaolin temple).

He also goes into the dangers of culture worship, teacher idolation, hero idolation, changing Katas an forms, the misconceptions given for practicing certain methods for self defense and more.

And all this after reading only fourty pages of the two-hundred-fifty-odd pages!

Also included are actual applications from alleged "classic" Katas and explanations behind some of them, such as the applications intended ranges, etc.

All in all if you want to learn some history and development of the martial arts, some application of common techniques seen in our forms and/or katas and Zen Buddhism and how it applies to the martial arts this would be an excellent read.