Golden Snake? [Archive] - Kung Fu Magazine Forums

themeecer

10-13-2003, 04:21 PM

Sd? Um no. They were of the group that jumped a bunch of blackbelts at one of our tournaments years ago. It was a dishonorable thing to do and there was an interesting result from one of their top guys fighting one of our top guys.

Please don't push this article off on us SD guys. We get enough slack on these boards as it is. I particularly liked the snake skin cowboy boots he was working out in. Couple this with the blue jeans, blue jean shirt unbuttoned to show his chest hair and gold chain, along with his mullet (only GM Sin can grow a respectable mullet :D ) and you have a humorous picture. I'm not sure why they didn't do the pictorial in their uniforms. I also enjoyed their pic of strength training by having someone sit on your shoulders while they stood in 'low' stances. For those that saw the pic you will see what I mean.

I hope this isn't the same caliber golden snake that GM Sin does. Or maybe the picture layout wasn't able to capture the essence of the art. I wasn't impressed by the article, for something that is supposed to be so high level.

Radhnoti

10-13-2003, 10:17 PM

Props to them for getting any info out about the style. I know people who've been in shaolin-do for 20+ years who've never heard a thing about "Golden Snake" except that it's the grandmaster's special style.

It's an interesting irony that a school SD has a "history" with will now be credited as the experts on "Golden Snake style". So now, in 15-20 years when GM Sin's grandson (or whoever) comes out and says, "My grandpa taught me this, and I'm the Golden Snake Master." The response will be, "Everyone knows that it's Ng family that teaches Golden Snake...and your's looks nothing like theirs. You bought the DVD and copied what they do....badly."
I guess that's the (deserved?) price you pay when you follow the Chinese way of "keeping the best stuff secret"...that and who knows how much material/history being lost to misfortune.

It's funny that I'm seeing a lot of "rolleyes" over the Ng family article...I was under the impression that they were greatly respected by the CMA community.
Au shaolin arts (KY branch anyway) teaches part of their curriculum alongside Hung Gar and Choy Li Fut...4 seasons martial arts...etc.
Here's another site of theirs that google turned up:
http://www.sillumkungfu.com/lineage.html

Edit:

And one site linked from that site states "Sifu John Dufresne's" many CMA accolades...including:
"In 1991 he was a coach of the US Team in the First World Wu-Shu Tournament, held in Beijing, China."

"One who studies Wu-Shu is committed to a peaceful spirit”—Sifu Dufresne

Yep, that's what I heard about him. A peaceful sort of fellow.

:eek:

Bluesman

10-13-2003, 11:12 PM

They are good, really good. I have seen John Dufrense perform several times. If anyone has said anything different, well they are mis-informed.

Ground Dragon

10-14-2003, 03:18 AM

heh, Dufresne is anything but peaceful.

I love the oh so humble attitude presented on that page. And if you look through the rest of the site, there are a couple of digs straight at shaolin-do, which seems kind of pointless.

Judge Pen

10-14-2003, 05:46 AM

I guess familiarity breeds contempt.

MasterKiller

10-14-2003, 06:26 AM

So now, in 15-20 years when GM Sin's grandson (or whoever) comes out and says, "My grandpa taught me this, and I'm the Golden Snake Master." Does Sin The's have kids?
Please don't push this article off on us SD guys. We get enough slack on these boards as it is. I particularly liked the snake skin cowboy boots he was working out in. Couple this with the blue jeans, blue jean shirt unbuttoned to show his chest hair and gold chain, along with his mullet All that's missing is an El Camino up on cinder-blocks in the guy's front yard.

Brad

10-14-2003, 06:36 AM

Does Sin The's have kids?
He's got a daughter... don't know if there's any others. I remember seeing something about her writting a script for a Shaolin-Do movie.

Judge Pen

10-14-2003, 06:43 AM

He has a son as well. I think his son attained the rank of third, but I'm not sure.

His daughter is gorgeous, too. Brad, where did you read about her writing the script?

Radhnoti

10-14-2003, 09:05 AM

He also has a stunning neice who works as a TV reporter in Lexington for Fox News. Jennifer The' I believe?

MasterKiller

10-14-2003, 09:12 AM

http://www.uky.edu/CommInfoStudies/JAT/Journalism/FacultyStaff/Jennifer.html

not bad, indeed.

shaolinarab

10-14-2003, 09:40 AM

Originally posted by MasterKiller
http://www.uky.edu/CommInfoStudies/JAT/Journalism/FacultyStaff/Jennifer.html

not bad, indeed.

so MK, if a lady like that vouched on the authenticity of her father's and uncle's martial arts styles, would you still disbelieve her? ;)
:D

MasterKiller

10-14-2003, 09:44 AM

so MK, if a lady like that vouched on the authenticity of her father's and uncle's martial arts styles, would you still disbelieve her?
Uuuuuuh, no. Journalists are paid to fabricate lies.

shaolinarab

10-14-2003, 09:46 AM

:eek: you got me there!

Evad

10-14-2003, 10:30 AM

GM Sin has three children, two sons and a daughter. He also had two maybe three brothers, Jennifer is the daughter of his younger brother. I forget his name though, but Jennifer is not Master Hsiang's daughter.

shaolinarab

10-14-2003, 10:49 AM

thanks for the update E. :)

Radhnoti

10-14-2003, 12:43 PM

MK, I don't think that's a very good picture of her. I was wrong about the TV station ...it's a CBS affiliate.
So, that's twice I've been wrong. The first and the last.

:D :rolleyes: ;)

MasterKiller

10-14-2003, 12:45 PM

Looks good enough to me!

CaptinPickAxe

10-14-2003, 01:15 PM

Shaolin-Do Movie?!?

Ludacris...

MasterKiller

10-14-2003, 01:32 PM

I doubt the movie will ever get made. In fact, if I were in SD, I would pray that it doesn't. The last thing you guys need is that kind of exposure on your story. No telling who it would bring out of the woodwork.

However, you can always watch the SD Documentary (http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?d=hv&cf=info&id=1808516274&intl=us)

themeecer

10-14-2003, 01:35 PM

Originally posted by Radhnoti
He also has a stunning neice who works as a TV reporter in Lexington for Fox News. Jennifer The' I believe?
I went to college with Jennifer and hadn't seen her in years. She's still a looker I see.

norther practitioner

10-14-2003, 01:43 PM

I doubt the movie will ever get made. In fact, if I were in SD, I would pray that it doesn't.

lmfao...:D

Judge Pen

10-14-2003, 01:45 PM

Here is a pic of Denise with her father and brother.

As for the movie, I doubt it will be made anytime soon.

shaolinarab

10-14-2003, 02:01 PM

Originally posted by MasterKiller
I doubt the movie will ever get made. In fact, if I were in SD, I would pray that it doesn't. The last thing you guys need is that kind of exposure on your story. No telling who it would bring out of the woodwork.

However, you can always watch the SD Documentary (http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?d=hv&cf=info&id=1808516274&intl=us)

nice one MK, how the hell did u ever even know about that movie...must've once been a fan of the mullet (or SD) yourself, huh? :p

as for the movie, who knows, wouldn't u think it would work for both sides, in that the exposure and controversy it would bring could only stimulate more conversation on both sides and inevitably greater research into the art's history and forms by the CMA (including SD) community as a whole?

Brad

10-14-2003, 04:12 PM

His daughter is gorgeous, too. Brad, where did you read about her writing the script?
It was on one of the websites awhile back. I allways seem to remember strange obscure information that doesn't concern me
:D

as for the movie, who knows, wouldn't u think it would work for both sides, in that the exposure and controversy it would bring could only stimulate more conversation on both sides and inevitably greater research into the art's history and forms by the CMA (including SD) community as a whole?
I doubt it :-P

kenso

10-14-2003, 04:25 PM

Originally posted by themeecer
Sd? Um no. They were of the group that jumped a bunch of blackbelts at one of our tournaments years ago. It was a dishonorable thing to do and there was an interesting result from one of their top guys fighting one of our top guys.

Well it appears there's some sort of SD connection:
Sifu Rick Pickens (http://www.ngfamilystyle.com/rpickens.html) claims a Shaolin-Do black belt.
Sifu Mark Speck (http://www.ngfamilystyle.com/mspeck.html) claims a SD green belt.
I certainly won't jump to any conclusions, but it does make the discussion more interesting.

Brad

10-14-2003, 07:36 PM

And one site linked from that site states "Sifu John Dufresne's" many CMA accolades...including:
"In 1991 he was a coach of the US Team in the First World Wu-Shu Tournament, held in Beijing, China."

"One who studies Wu-Shu is committed to a peaceful spirit”—Sifu Dufresne
What site did this come from?

Vyvial

10-14-2003, 08:52 PM

Ok, Im sorry but...

"Since this guy has a mullet and lives in KY, I'm assuming this is a Shaolin-Do guy?"

....this is as funny as crap. (and crap's pretty funny)

Kristoffer

10-15-2003, 03:05 AM

I'll sell my crap to you crap-lovva

Judge Pen

10-15-2003, 06:29 AM

Originally posted by kenso

Well it appears there's some sort of SD connection:
Sifu Rick Pickens (http://www.ngfamilystyle.com/rpickens.html) claims a Shaolin-Do black belt.
Sifu Mark Speck (http://www.ngfamilystyle.com/mspeck.html) claims a SD green belt.
I certainly won't jump to any conclusions, but it does make the discussion more interesting.

There's a lot of corss over in students. Dufrense has a black belt in Sd too. Like I said, familiarity breeds contempt.

BTW, I've seen their stuff and I have learned a few of their forms. It's not bad. A bit more flowery than the stuff I was taught. They appear to be good martial artists, but because they and Sd run in the same circles, they seem to butt heads often. It was not, imho, better than what I learned in SD. They were pretty similar, just a bit more flashy. Ng claims to teach 5 animal form, linear Ba Gua, various animal forms, Tiger/Crane, Golden Snake, and Wing Chun.

The incident that themeecer referred too occurred when a group of SD students left to joing Ng and then came back to a tournament and began to taunt the SD people. There are several different accounts of the outcome.

MasterKiller

10-15-2003, 06:50 AM

nice one MK, how the hell did u ever even know about that movie...must've once been a fan of the mullet (or SD) yourself, huh? SD guys have been talking about it forever. Besides that, you guys gush like school girls about it on Mullin's board....

Judge Pen

10-15-2003, 06:55 AM

Not everybody gushes over it over there. ;)

I do think the Su Kong story would be interesting if done well (whether you believe it's legite or a myth it has that old school Chinese larger than life feel to it), but unless it's done really well, it would just be hokey.

shaolinarab

10-15-2003, 06:58 AM

Originally posted by MasterKiller
SD guys have been talking about it forever. Besides that, you guys gush like school girls about it on Mullin's board....

i was actually referring to how you knew about MULLET: the movie, that you linked! ;)

Ground Dragon

10-15-2003, 07:16 AM

I have also been told that either: Dufresne was still in SD and then also started training with Ng at the same time or had already been with Ng and went to do SD, and was then ridden hard by the upper black belts at the time because of his association with Ng. I can't remember the exact sequence at the moment. Either way, there were a couple, maybe more, senior blacks giving him a hard time because of his association with Ng, for whatever reason, and that ended up creating some bad blood.
As with any story related by a third party, take with a grain of salt. But this was coming from 'within the family' so to speak.

Dufresne has had his share of troubles recently. I would assume (hope) he's gotten everything straightened out, since it now appears he's moved and opened a school in MA.

And that movie has been in the works for probably 20 years. I remember hearing about how all the instructors needed to prepare for the huge influx of students that would happen when the movie came out, and that was 7 years ago.

MasterKiller

10-15-2003, 07:37 AM

i was actually referring to how you knew about MULLET: the movie, that you linked! If you like that movie, you'l love mullets galore (http://www.mulletsgalore.com) !

Radhnoti

10-15-2003, 11:00 AM

Brad - "What site did this come from?"

Here ya go:

http://www.tiendaowushu.com/history.html

Brad

10-15-2003, 05:43 PM

Thanks! But... where's the part about him being a coach of the US wushu team? Am I just blind? :D

Radhnoti

10-15-2003, 09:34 PM

Brad...you must be, my earlier statement is a cut and paste from that page. :eek:

:)

Shane

10-23-2003, 11:03 PM

I am sorry that I do not visit this board more often. Perhaps I would have been able to clear up any questions before things went quite in the direction that they did. My name is Shane Bryant, and I am a closed door student of Master Tim Pickens, the author of the mentioned article. I have trained with him since I was twelve years old, and he is my family. First, any deragatory comments towards him I will now disregard and assume that they were originally made in good fun. After this message I will no longer make that assumption. John Dufresne is my uncle in the arts. I have the highest respect for his abilities and his growth as a martial artist and more importantly as a man. I won't be involved in any discussion on the nature of his character from this point forward. Beyond that, he certainly does not need me to defend him as his accomplishments are numerous and easy enough to find out on your own.

On to the things that I do wish to discuss. My teacher as well as his brother, Master Ricky Pickens, who I have also trained with regularly and also regard as my family, both recieved black belts from Sin The in the Shaolin-Do organization. When Rick met Dr. John Ng while attending Eastern Kentucky University, they switched thier training to Dr. Ng's family arts, feeling that this training was better suited to their goals as martial artists. The Southern Golden Snake art that my teacher is speaking of in this article is from Dr. Ng's system and not from the Shaolin-Do system. Neither of the Masters Pickens have any current affiliation with that organization. Also, my martial uncle Master Mark Speck was mentioned as well. Master Speck also originally began in the Shaolin-Do system, but left when he met Master Rick Pickens to become a student of the Pickens Brothers. He is, to this date, the most learned of their students, as well as a good man, which is more important.

Now, many of the comments made in this discussion thread were negative, which immediately makes me suspect that perhaps the individuals involved just wanted to bash something and be heard, not to contribute or learn. However, I am going to make yet another assumption (despite what we all know that makes me) and assume that you all do want to share information in humility so that we may all grow in our knowledge. In that spirit, I invite all of you who still have questions to email me at shane_bryant@hotmail.com and I will be happy to talk to you in length about whatever it is that you are curious about in regards to this article or our style in general. If I do not have the answers I will tell you so, but I will also go to my teachers and try to get them for you. I AM willing to respond to questions on this board, but that is not exactly my favorite thing. I prefer private correspondence as those who wish to truly have a discussion are not interrupted by those who only wish to speak without meaning. A lesson to them is that there is a difference between having pride in your system and its heritage and loving your teachers, and what often occurs on this board. The first is very personal and strong, while the latter is fragile and based upon feelings of inadequacy and an ego that must be catered to by publicly crusading against any who take issue with you in order to combat those feelings.

One final note, to themeecer. I truly expect to hear from you. You wrote with the connotation that you had disdain for the information contained in the article. I will not argue with you because I know the quality of the results contained in these teachings. I will humble myself to you now because I am nothing and ask you to share knowledge in return.

To all of you again, please, I invite discourse.

Shane Bryant

Serpent

10-23-2003, 11:14 PM

Originally posted by Judge Pen
Ng claims to teach 5 animal form, linear Ba Gua, various animal forms, Tiger/Crane, Golden Snake, and Wing Chun.

WTF?

:confused:

themeecer

10-24-2003, 12:33 AM

Shane I emailed you.

David Jamieson

10-24-2003, 01:27 AM

wow, for second there i felt like a fly on the wall at a knights of the round table discussion. :D

can we put this whole sd thing to bed now?

greaaaat, thanks. Have a beer.
cheers

Judge Pen

10-24-2003, 06:17 AM

Originally posted by Serpent

WTF?

:confused:

You've got me Serpent. It's from his website.

David Jamieson

10-24-2003, 06:38 AM

help you guys out a little bit on understanding the whole "what's in a name" thang.

Linear Baguazhang (http://members.xoom.virgilio.it/sinicus/liu_dekuan_linear_baguazhang.htm)

K, there are more examples of teh concepts involved with so called "linear" baguazhang. It still has circle walking as does all Bagua, if that's what is throwing you off.

It's lines of attack are direct though and there are other aspects of linear baguazhang that as you can see from the chart, make it appear to be along the lines of bajiquan, xingyi, etc.

but just wanted to clear that up a bit,

you can find lots more about it if you do a google on "linear baguazhang"

cheers

Evad

10-24-2003, 02:59 PM

Concerning the linear bagua from Ng family site - if you read in their site history about Dr. Ng, it states that this style of linear bagua is unique to his family or some such.

Fu-Pow

10-24-2003, 04:45 PM

Is the Southern United States really that far from China?

I just can't take this anymore.

If you are Chinese and know some form of MA can you just open your own Golden (insert animal) school and will people buy into it?

Brad

10-24-2003, 06:21 PM

Prof. Kang Ge Wu's Bagua video shows a good example of linear Baguazhang in China(you can find it at plumpub.com)

Brad

10-24-2003, 06:25 PM

If you are Chinese and know some form of MA can you just open your own Golden (insert animal) school and will people buy into it?
You'd be surprised what we can get away with in this area, esp. if you're Chinese ;) I could have my own kungfu cult in less than a month, and I'm a 23 year old white guy, lol :D

Shane

10-24-2003, 07:44 PM

Fu-Pow - I am not certain that you were saying that the Southern Golden Snake system that we teach is a farce or not, but I can see how your post could be taken as such. Thus, I am going to offer a few methods to verify the authenticity of our system. As a general rule, I do not do this, but since I stated earlier I would respond to messages on this thread, I will. Other avenues and methods exist to accomplish this same task, but I will leave it to those who seek knowledge to search them out.

Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming would certainly vouch for Dr. Ng's system. They are colleagues and have given demo's together as early as the 1980's. I have some pics of them together, but they are from magazines and I am not sure they can be published here. If you are interested I'm pretty sure there wouldn't be a problem with me attaching them to an email. Eric Lee is also a friend of Dr. Ng's, and visited his school occasionally when Dr. Ng taught openly. Pics of them together are available on the web. Grandmaster Chan Pui is also an acquaintance of Dr. Ng's and I imagine he too would speak for the authenticity of our system. I think I have a pic of Grandmaster Chan, Dr. Ng, and Moy Yat, but I am not sure. As I said, other avenues exist for discovery, but these are a good starting place. Due to the nature of the individuals mentioned, it might be difficult to speak with them, but I promise that it is not impossible. Besides, knowledge is most prized when true effort is put into the search for it.

Also, I would like to point out that our SYSTEM is Ng Family Kung Fu. The Southern Golden Snake is a style within the system. Often we use the terms interchangeably, I do it myself as much as anyone, but I wanted to note here that we do not advertise to teach Southern Golden Snake (actually we don't advertise at all, at least I and my teacher do not) but, again, to teach Ng Family Kung Fu.

Thank you.

Shane Bryant

BAI HE

10-24-2003, 08:00 PM

"Concerning the linear bagua from Ng family site - if you read in their site history about Dr. Ng, it states that this style of linear bagua is unique to his family or some such."

No it's not unique.
Gao style has many "Post heaven" Linear drills and forms.
It is one of the trademarks of the system.

The Ng family pics look BaiJi flavored.
Most BaGua will look flavored though, depending on the branch and whom it passed through. To be Baiji flavored would only be a good thing IMHO>

__________________

trilobite

10-24-2003, 08:03 PM

how does one pronounce Ng anyway?

BAI HE

10-24-2003, 08:05 PM

Ummm.
Sometimes Wu, so I've heard.

Brad

10-24-2003, 08:07 PM

Ng is pronounced ing(as in runing) or Wu(Mandarin). All my friends named Ng pronounce it the first way.

BAI HE

10-24-2003, 08:15 PM

A vietnamese friend of mine just married a lady from HK and said that her last name "Ng" was pronounced Umm.

You are probably somewhat right as well Brad. Anything Chineseis so horrifically vague it boggle the mind

Bluesman

10-24-2003, 10:22 PM

I believe it is pronounced Ing.
This is just my observation, not a flame! Does anyone else think that the instructor in the Inside Kung Fu article looked like Billy Ray Cyrus from Flat Woods Ky ?

shaolinarab

10-24-2003, 10:27 PM

Originally posted by Brad
Ng is pronounced ing(as in runing) or Wu(Mandarin). All my friends named Ng pronounce it the first way.

brad, it's runN ing (2 N's) ;)

David Jamieson

10-26-2003, 08:54 AM

my friend alex ng pronounces his name "ing".

wu style taichichuan is also called "ng style" in Guandong China and Hong Kong and most places where Cantonese is spoken. But in Mandarin, it is Wu.

cheers

Fu-Pow

10-27-2003, 11:20 AM

Originally posted by Shane
Fu-Pow - I am not certain that you were saying that the Southern Golden Snake system that we teach is a farce or not, but I can see how your post could be taken as such. Thus, I am going to offer a few methods to verify the authenticity of our system. As a general rule, I do not do this, but since I stated earlier I would respond to messages on this thread, I will. Other avenues and methods exist to accomplish this same task, but I will leave it to those who seek knowledge to search them out.

Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming would certainly vouch for Dr. Ng's system. They are colleagues and have given demo's together as early as the 1980's. I have some pics of them together, but they are from magazines and I am not sure they can be published here. If you are interested I'm pretty sure there wouldn't be a problem with me attaching them to an email. Eric Lee is also a friend of Dr. Ng's, and visited his school occasionally when Dr. Ng taught openly. Pics of them together are available on the web. Grandmaster Chan Pui is also an acquaintance of Dr. Ng's and I imagine he too would speak for the authenticity of our system. I think I have a pic of Grandmaster Chan, Dr. Ng, and Moy Yat, but I am not sure. As I said, other avenues exist for discovery, but these are a good starting place. Due to the nature of the individuals mentioned, it might be difficult to speak with them, but I promise that it is not impossible. Besides, knowledge is most prized when true effort is put into the search for it.

Also, I would like to point out that our SYSTEM is Ng Family Kung Fu. The Southern Golden Snake is a style within the system. Often we use the terms interchangeably, I do it myself as much as anyone, but I wanted to note here that we do not advertise to teach Southern Golden Snake (actually we don't advertise at all, at least I and my teacher do not) but, again, to teach Ng Family Kung Fu.

Thank you.

Shane Bryant

Shane-

Sorry if my post was offensive. I'm a bit skeptical of kung fu styles I have not heard of before and especially after all the debating about Shaolin Do.

Yang, Jwing Ming, Eric Lee and Chan Pui are all well respected martial artists. Chan Pui was a friend of my late Si Gung, Lee Koon Hung. If they truly vouch for your system then I am a lot less skeptical.

However, I did see the article in Inside Kung Fu Magazine and I did not think it was a very good article. The accompanying pictures were kind of silly and did not cast your art in a very good light. I might suggest in future articles that you take things more seriously as they will published in nationally distributed magazine.

FRANK SEXTON

03-16-2004, 08:59 PM

Fu-Pow I have seen a picture of your Si Gung Lee Koon Hung with my teacher Dr. John Ng in front of the Wah Lum temple with Chan Pui and 2 others. Your teacher is in the picture that shane has. Also to the rest of you out there that wants to talk about Timmy in the golden snake article. Say all you want but you'll never be as good as him ever. Also sin claims to have the shaolin monkey form well Dr. Ng was the first one to teach monkey openly and yes I do have our history and Dr. Ng's teachers. I've seen the pictures of his teacher Senior Monk Po from the Fukein Temples. He died in 1984 at a ripe old age. Our history goes back further than sd style does when it comes to the temples and in the tournament in 1984 it was very interesting especially when John Dufrense knock out Bill Leonard twice and cleaned house on the rest of them. Nice video from that tournament so if the sd's say anything else we'll go to the instint reply. So remember it doesn't matter what style your in play nice.

themeecer

03-16-2004, 09:45 PM

Oh really Frank? Are you speaking of the same fight I know of? The same one where your school shamefully jumped our's during a demo at a tournament? The same one where Dufranse jumped Master Leonard from behind and knocked him down? The same one where Dufranse had to go to the hospital the next day for?

I edited what I was going to say here. Let me just say what goes around comes around ol Frankie boy.

Vash

03-16-2004, 09:47 PM

Even I wish this thread to die.

Golden Tiger

03-17-2004, 07:05 AM

As much as I hate to....

Frank, after reading many of your other posts I see that you seem to be a decent guy. Except when it comes to SD of course.

As to this "beating" that you claim took place, I too am wondering if you are refering to the one at Lafyette HS? As I remember, all during the demo, your school (in matching little running suits, very cute)was taunting and yelling and pretty much making an a$$ out of themselves. After Master Sin had left to catch a flight that night, Master Hiang (who has a temper) called for a "open sparring match " to anyone that wanted it. All your guys came out and it was on. What stopped it was that one of your guys was beating the heII out of a female black belt. Then Master Hiang called for a match between him and Bill. The match went well until your guys went full contact and hit Bill in the face (nose to be exact). Bill then jumped one your guy and started beating him until Master Hiang was able to pull him off. Everything stopped and your people left, after yelling obsenities, flipping off the crowd, turning over chairs, tossing garbage cans like all mature MAist do.

So, while I don't have "video" of it, I was there and remember it quiet well. I am still not sure why all this stuff continues to be stirred up but what can you do. You seem very proud of your art and as far as I know, there hasn't been any problem between the two clubs in forever. We do our thing, you do yours. I am even aware that recently, Sifu John D. made an attempt to smooth over some of the issues with SD in a very honorable way. He let it go, perhaps you should to.....

Humbley, GT

MasterKiller

03-17-2004, 10:11 AM

Originally posted by FRANK SEXTON
I've seen the pictures of his teacher Senior Monk Po from the Fukein Temples. He died in 1984 at a ripe old age. So, realistically, you are saying Po was a monk at the Fukien Temple at least around 1900 or so?

Where is the proof of the temple's existence if it was destroyed 100 years ago?

In your opinion, why do other accounts of Fukien place the destruction at 1673 or so?

norther practitioner

03-17-2004, 10:16 AM

I was there, I was the .. erm nevermind, live and let die..

so, if you want to live, let this die.

SevenStar

03-17-2004, 10:32 AM

Back to the title of this thread, NP's girl nicknamed me the golden snake...

MasterKiller

03-17-2004, 10:42 AM

Originally posted by SevenStar
Back to the title of this thread, NP's girl nicknamed me the golden snake... That was the lock-jaw....she was really trying to say "pull it straight" because of how it bends sideways at a funny angle....

Kymus

03-17-2004, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by SevenStar
Back to the title of this thread, NP's girl nicknamed me the golden snake...

Better make sure MK doesn't meet her NP, he defiled my g/f and "taught her".. She's still recovering. :p

Kymus

03-17-2004, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by MasterKiller
That was the lock-jaw....she was really trying to say "pull it straight" because of how it bends sideways at a funny angle....

lmao MK

FRANK SEXTON

03-25-2004, 03:02 PM

Since most of you say you we're at the tournament in 1984 which one's are you? See I got a copy of the tape from the tournament where Bill Leonard challenged Dufrense and the other ones to a sparring match. And got about 20 of your peoples a-- es kicked. And in the video you see Shawn The get under a table. Like I said let's go to the instint replay. And for all of you out there threatening me Ther's only one I'm will not fight and that is Grandmaster Ng. Oh yeh the the main temple my have been burned but therer were 2 more one in a cave and the other in the forrest dumby. Also have pictures of them stating Shaolin Temple Fukien. Dah I never make a statement that I can't back up or show proof. The tournament in 84 was one of the reasons I left sd in the first place.I was ther too. I was 19 and still in sd at the time, so again I ask which one was you I'm on the tape watching Dufrense kicking the sh-t put of sd people and he never got hurt. So if you want to test me or Dufrense we will be at the Mountain Friendship Tournament in Jenkins Ky. May 8th or I will be at Somerset on April 3rd. Please though on April 3rd no trouble in the tournament we can go out side. I would be glad to show you what the vibration palm is along with the willowleaf strike among other things. remember play nice. And don't push me unless you want to give me your real name. like I use not a made up one.

norther practitioner

03-25-2004, 03:12 PM

Better make sure MK doesn't meet her NP, he defiled my g/f and "taught her".. She's still recovering.

lol, he looks at her at Taiji legacy and he'll get his monk spade shoved where the light wont make it look shiny no mo...

Judge Pen

03-25-2004, 03:56 PM

Originally posted by FRANK SEXTON
Since most of you say you we're at the tournament in 1984 which one's are you? See I got a copy of the tape from the tournament where Bill Leonard challenged Dufrense and the other ones to a sparring match. And got about 20 of your peoples a-- es kicked. And in the video you see Shawn The get under a table. Like I said let's go to the instint replay. And for all of you out there threatening me Ther's only one I'm will not fight and that is Grandmaster Ng. Oh yeh the the main temple my have been burned but therer were 2 more one in a cave and the other in the forrest dumby. Also have pictures of them stating Shaolin Temple Fukien. Dah I never make a statement that I can't back up or show proof. The tournament in 84 was one of the reasons I left sd in the first place.I was ther too. I was 19 and still in sd at the time, so again I ask which one was you I'm on the tape watching Dufrense kicking the sh-t put of sd people and he never got hurt. So if you want to test me or Dufrense we will be at the Mountain Friendship Tournament in Jenkins Ky. May 8th or I will be at Somerset on April 3rd. Please though on April 3rd no trouble in the tournament we can go out side. I would be glad to show you what the vibration palm is along with the willowleaf strike among other things. remember play nice. And don't push me unless you want to give me your real name. like I use not a made up one.

My real name's Ben Mullins, Frank, and I live in Knoxville Tennessee. These forums have no place for talk like that (especially in light of your other "peace" posts). I'll tell you what, PM me your address and I'll send you a blank tape. Copy the tournament on that tape. If what you say is true I'll publically apologize to you and your style and confirm to everyone that your account of the tournament is true. Is that fair?

I apologize to the rest of KFO. I would have just PM'd him and not aired this crap here, but I don't think he'll send me his address so I can see this tournament tape. He's probably just some troll and I took his bait. But I've been wrong before.

Brad

03-25-2004, 05:28 PM

Like I said let's go to the instint replay. And for all of you out there threatening me Ther's only one I'm will not fight and that is Grandmaster Ng. Oh yeh the the main temple my have been burned but therer were 2 more one in a cave and the other in the forrest dumby. Also have pictures of them stating Shaolin Temple Fukien. Dah I never make a statement that I can't back up or show proof.
Actually, you haven't shown proof for anything yet :confused:

Vash

03-25-2004, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by FRANK SEXTON
Since most of you say you we're at the tournament in 1984 which one's are you? See I got a copy of the tape from the tournament where Bill Leonard challenged Dufrense and the other ones to a sparring match. And got about 20 of your peoples a-- es kicked. And in the video you see Shawn The get under a table. Like I said let's go to the instint replay. And for all of you out there threatening me Ther's only one I'm will not fight and that is Grandmaster Ng. Oh yeh the the main temple my have been burned but therer were 2 more one in a cave and the other in the forrest dumby. Also have pictures of them stating Shaolin Temple Fukien. Dah I never make a statement that I can't back up or show proof. The tournament in 84 was one of the reasons I left sd in the first place.I was ther too. I was 19 and still in sd at the time, so again I ask which one was you I'm on the tape watching Dufrense kicking the sh-t put of sd people and he never got hurt. So if you want to test me or Dufrense we will be at the Mountain Friendship Tournament in Jenkins Ky. May 8th or I will be at Somerset on April 3rd. Please though on April 3rd no trouble in the tournament we can go out side. I would be glad to show you what the vibration palm is along with the willowleaf strike among other things. remember play nice. And don't push me unless you want to give me your real name. like I use not a made up one.

I'm neither friend nor foe of Shaolin Do. Though, I'd have to say that Judge Pen seems like he could be a pretty bad mothertrucker, so it can't be all bad.

Anyway, your post is quite obviously a cry for unconcealed man-lovin'.