Deadlifting

[tri2bmt]

Hey, been doing that deadlift 5 times a week at 2 sets of 5 reps with ample rest time inbetween and started running every day again. Feels great to be back at it after almost three months of no cardio other than kung fu.
So I just wanted to say that the deadlift thing is great! Thanks for the advice Ironfist.
I'm curious though how should I increase the weight? Should it just be as I feel necessary or should it be at specfic times?
Can this system be done with other lifts such as the bench, bicep curl, squat or any other?

[IronFist]

Increase the starting weight 5lbs per day. The second set is always 90% of the first set. Your very FIRST set of your first day should be 5 reps with a weight you can do 10 reps of. Then you add the 5lbs per day to that starting weight. Say your 10RM is 200lbs. You would go like this:

Day 1: 200 x 5, 180 x 5
Day 2: 205 x 5, 185 x 5
etc.

When you can no longer get 4 or 5 reps with the first weight, take a few days off and then start over with a little more weight than the first time.

Can this system be done with other lifts such as the bench, bicep curl, squat or any other?

I would only do it with compound things. That means DL, squat, and bench. Nothing else, really. Military press maybe. Don't mix squat and deadlift in the same cycle. Also, if you're doing this with like deadlift, don't do anything else for legs during the cycle. If you do, you will not recover enough in time for the next workout.

If you have more questions let me know. Deadlifting rules. Have fun, dude.

IronFist

[IronFist]

...and if any DF here replies with "5lbs a day is too much. Deadlifting every day will lead to overtraining" just ignore them and keep on going, and laugh when you destroy their records.

IronFist

[tri2bmt]

Cool man thanks!
I'm just going to stick to the Deadlift anyway was just curious.
Addin weight everyday makes sense but for the first week I've just been getting used to the movement and how my body works. On saturday once I've had two days off I'm going to start increasing it by five pounds everyday and 2nd set at 90%.
Thanks alot man!

[Scarletmantis]

Hey Iron,

Look, I might be dense or something, but when you say everyday, does that mean seven days a week? No rest until you hit a wall? I'd like to try this program as I have hit another plateau (Doh!). Seems like my body's getting used to everything I throw at it! I've been changing up my routine every month or so, time for something new I guess! Hows this sound?

Bench Press 2 of 5
Squats 2 of 5
Bent over Rows 2of 5

Also, I like to do some of my powerlifts like Clean/jerk, snatch etc. Do you think this might work for them too?

[IronFist]

Originally posted by Scarletmantis
Hey Iron,

Look, I might be dense or something, but when you say everyday, does that mean seven days a week?

Sorry, 5 days a week :)

No rest until you hit a wall? I'd like to try this program as I have hit another plateau (Doh!). Seems like my body's getting used to everything I throw at it! I've been changing up my routine every month or so, time for something new I guess! Hows this sound?

Bench Press 2 of 5
Squats 2 of 5
Bent over Rows 2of 5

What do you mean "no rest until you hit a wall?" There's 5 minutes of rest between sets. You don't end the cycle until you hit a plateau. I mean, you could end it earlier, but then you wouldn't get any benefit :)

Your routine sounds good. The only change I would make would be weighted pullups instead of bent over rows, but that should work, too. It's good because you have one exercise for each muscle. (Bench: chest/tri/front,side delts, Squats: Legs, Rows: Back/biceps/rear delts).

Also, I like to do some of my powerlifts like Clean/jerk, snatch etc. Do you think this might work for them too?

Clean/jerk/snatch are Olympic lifts, not powerlifts. I don't know anything about the Olympic lifts... sorry. I would like to say it works... but, there's generally a HUGE difference between what someone can deadlift and what they can actually press so I don't see the above cycle being as effective here. I'm sure there are already lots of Olympic routines out there, though.

Let me know if this clears everything up.

IronFist

[IronFist]

btw, powerlifts are deadlift, squat, and bench.

IronFist

[Scarletmantis]

Thanks for the timely response! Sorry for the confusion, I have done both competitivly, and all of the Powerlifters at my school do the O's as well, at least for training. At any rate, I sometimes mix terms as a result (blush). You should try the Clean and Jerk sometime though, since you like the big movements. Anytime people start talking "functional strength" and telling me they Squat 800, I've gotta wonder how the hell they think they'd get THAT up on thier shoulders without a rack? :p

Train hard!

[IronFist]

What's wrong with using a squat rack?

Who do you know that can squat 800lbs? Do they go down all the way? That's like approaching elite world class impressive.

IronFist

[Scarletmantis]

Nothing wrong with a rack, it's just that getting under the kind of wieght I squat without a rack, in the real world would be next to impossible. Don't think I'm saying that I'm superman, I squat 360 (god I wanted to exagerate!), all the way down. That's a huge accomplishment for me, but there're 'lots of guys out there that can do more. Anyhow, my point is that if you asked me to put that up on my own shoulders... well I'd look like a smooshed bug, if I didn't break my back first!

[IronFist]

Don't worry dude, no one can squat a lot of weight without loading it from a rack. It's all good :)

IronFist

[Merryprankster]

7 years of shotput and discus have made me reasonably familiar with OLs--not to hijack the thread or usurp position--

I can try and answer some questions....

[Lung Hu Pai]

hey merryprankster,
i was wondering if you could help me out with a few questions. can you get the same benefits from doing the snatch and the clean from the hang position as going from the floor? also, could you give me a few tip on form for the lifts? I really don't have access to a coach that often so I would appreciate the help....thanks, Azar.

[Merryprankster]

Lung Hu--

You're not going to get the same benefits because you aren't hitting the big pull from the bottom. Put shortly, if you are using proper form, you'll be able to snatch and clean a lot more weight from the floor than a hang. In the hang, you're not building up the same amount of momentum. It also obviously reduces the involvement of the large leg muscles.

That said, hang cleans and snatches are GREAT exercises, and there is nothing wrong with doing them. They are especially handy for building explosiveness at the top of the movement.

I'm assuming you are at least somewhat familiar with the lifts themselves. I CANNOT stress enough that you should NEVER attempt an Olympic lift if you've never done them, without a proper coach. It's an explosive movement that, when done improperly can seriously injure you.

Here are some tips for the olympic lifts--they hold true for the hangs as well, since you start the hangs with a slight dip in the legs:

Leg drive initiates the movement--back should be straight as if you were doing a deadlift.

The bar should travel as close to the body as possible. If you lose it forward, drop the darn thing--better a clatter and smash than torn muscles.

At the top of the leg drive, get the last drive with your calves by coming up to your tiptoes. As this happens, you're going to look at the ceiling and arch your hips forwards, and shrug the shoulders to the ear. This starts the second big pull and keeps you from falling forward. Continue to keep the weight as close to the body as practicable. You'll learn you can't really do the hips forward thing until the bar is at least just above knee hieght. I like mid-thigh.

Just as the bar reaches maximum height from your pull, drop underneath the weight at full extension. Pressing out the top of the movement isn't acceptable--besides which if you're moving the kind of weight you should be with good form, you won't be able to simply press it out anyway :)

The above is an outline of the snatch, obviously.

For the clean, the same principles still apply except that when you drop under the weight, it will come to rest as high on the chest as practicable. The elbows should be pointing forwards, palms up and facing away from you, with your chest taking the load.

For the jerk, you go into a front squat position that is optimal for power generation. For most of us, that's around just above parallel--olympic quality athletes have usually developed tremendous force out of the hole and squat much more deeply, allowing for a longer drive on the bar. Then you explode upwards with the weight to your full height.

At your full height, the bar is going to continue to travel upwards. At this point drive your hands directly up while dropping underneath the weight. Lockout of your arms should theoretically occur at the same time that the weight is at 0 vertical speed--in otherwords, that INSTANT that it is going neither up nor down. In reality, that won't happen most of the time. The finish depends on your personal preference. I like split jerks. Here's a link to the jerk types:

http://www.olympus.net/personal/cablebar/JERK.htm

If at any time, you feel as if you are going to lose the weight during either of these lifts, drop it by pushing it forward a bit and away. As good courtesy, it is considered a nice thing if you keep hold of the bar, just to minimize the bouncing and rolling.

In fact, the whole site is a good over view:

http://www.olympus.net/personal/cablebar/ARTOL.htm

[vingtsunstudent]

try this link for a rough look at how things are done as well...
http://www.exrx.net/Lists/PowerExercises.html
vts

[Lung Hu Pai]

thanks for the thorough answer, Merryprankster, I appreciate it. I'm going to put more work into practicing the power snatch and power clean from the floor. One more question I had was, do you think it's necessary to learn the full lifts or are the power versions enough? I mainly want to do them to build up explosiveness and power. thanks again, Azar.